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  1. #181
    The Lightbringer Wangming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    Once again, over 200k players in a game that just went through a massive content draught for months is hardly "nothing"
    Once again, WoW supposedly has millions of players. Is it really that hard to understand that not everything is for mythic raiders?

  2. #182
    I am Murloc! Asrialol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    Once again, over 200k players in a game that just went through a massive content draught for months is hardly "nothing"

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    Then what do you need to justify a new dungeon? Because that's basically the only reason I can think of
    You do realize that the dungeon is justified for a overwhelming majority of the playerbase, right? The gear from the dungeon is also a massive upgrade for that same majority. And Blizzard are also able to turn it into justified content for the small minority of players that do m+ and raid when it gets added to the m+ table, which is pretty great.
    Hi

  3. #183
    Dont forget that activating hard mode makes drop higher ilvl loot - 233.
    Also I thing maybe 10% (and thats generous) of the player base are 226 capped, so mega dungeon droping 226 is big upgrade for lot of people.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    and for that you need to do +14/15, which again, majority of people dont...

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    so people fully decked in HC raid gear dont even play the game... you need reality check dude, majority of people is below 220...

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    ehm... vast majority of playerbase?

    not to mention HC CH and +13 still gives you lower than 226, AND +14/15 gives you one piece, so even people running +15s nonstop might not be fully decked in 226, and hardmode Taza gives 233...
    so even goddamn mythic raiders can get a fuckload of upgrades there, let alone casuals who are now between 200-220...
    Many alts maybe. But anyone's main char who played since start had plenty of opportunities to vault up.
    Idk, from what I can see and tell, the people who are only 200-220 are in the minority right now. That's literally your covenant gear mixed with a few normal CN items. You're trying to tell me that's the majority of players 8 months into the addon?

    I started in March/April and I'm 225 and by no means did I no life the game. In fact I didn't even log into retail since TBC launch. I would have probably hit 226 by now if I had continued.

    We wouldn't have to have this discussion if Blizzard could just design items and dungeons that last for more than just one major patch. Just stop scaling the ilvl this hard and we won't have this discussion anymore, plus we would have more to do towards the end of any patch/addon since old content would remain relevant

  5. #185
    As a 227 the drops don't invalidate the content for me.
    I'd just like to see how it plays and do a few runs. Mechagon was pretty similar in most regards anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tsarez View Post
    Many alts maybe. But anyone's main char who played since start had plenty of opportunities to vault up.
    Idk, from what I can see and tell, the people who are only 200-220 are in the minority right now. That's literally your covenant gear mixed with a few normal CN items. You're trying to tell me that's the majority of players 8 months into the addon?

    I started in March/April and I'm 225 and by no means did I no life the game. In fact I didn't even log into retail since TBC launch. I would have probably hit 226 by now if I had continued.

    We wouldn't have to have this discussion if Blizzard could just design items and dungeons that last for more than just one major patch. Just stop scaling the ilvl this hard and we won't have this discussion anymore, plus we would have more to do towards the end of any patch/addon since old content would remain relevant
    I think you greatly over-estimate BOTH the effort the average player is willing to pour into the game AND their overall skill level.
    The majority of the player-base can't handle a timed +14 NOR is willing to push a key and do it un-timed each week.
    Especially seen how much of a pain it is to get into one if you don't have a guild/steady group.

  6. #186
    New content that drops catch-up gear? Oh the horror.

  7. #187
    Bloodsail Admiral Malania's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    Once again, over 200k players in a game that just went through a massive content draught for months is hardly "nothing"

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    Then what do you need to justify a new dungeon? Because that's basically the only reason I can think of
    That it's new? It's something new to do as we've been doing the current content for a while...

    Why do you play this game? Are you missing something in life that purple pixels make up for? You do pay this game for fun I assume?

  8. #188
    ~1.5% of players cleared CN on mythic (https://www.dataforazeroth.com/colle...ire-denathrius)
    ~25% of players cleared CN on heroic (https://www.dataforazeroth.com/colle...ire-denathrius)
    ~17.5% of players got KSM Season 1 (https://www.dataforazeroth.com/colle...ter-season-one)

    Keep in mind most players got more than one lv 60 char.

    I think it's pretty save to assume that less than 10% of chars are 225+ geared.

  9. #189
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tubben View Post
    ~1.5% of players cleared CN on mythic (https://www.dataforazeroth.com/colle...ire-denathrius)
    ~25% of players cleared CN on heroic (https://www.dataforazeroth.com/colle...ire-denathrius)
    ~17.5% of players got KSM Season 1 (https://www.dataforazeroth.com/colle...ter-season-one)

    Keep in mind most players got more than one lv 60 char.

    I think it's pretty save to assume that less than 10% of chars are 225+ geared.
    I agree the idea that this will only be a concern for a very very small amount of players but honestly, it doesn't even matter. Even if 100% of the population was at 226:


    • If you're ilvl 226, that means that offsetting your 235 legendary is likely a piece or two that is under 226. But even if you have a 226 in every slot, the odds are still pretty good there will be something there that is an upgrade even at 226 just due to better itemisation or better trinkets.
    • Hardmode has 233 which is an upgrade even for mythic raiders.
    • People do content for reasons other than just gearing their main: for fun, for the experience, on alts, learning for when it goes to m+, etc. This is a game. A large volume of it exists just for the sake of fun.

    All this semantics and numbers debate about what percentage of people are at what ilvl is just a red herring. The content will be there, offering novelty and new stuff to do, gearing will be somewhat relevant to mains regardless and very relevant to alts, but there's also ample reasons outside of just "gearing your main" to do things in WoW.

    This whole thread concept is just silly no matter what the maths are.

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  10. #190
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    Because they are seriously spoiled at this point. Some of them honestly think that the entire game should revolve and be designed just for them, and $&#@ the rest of the playerbase.

    Btw, the vault of OPness isn't helping either tbh.

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    Catering to casuals is one of the main reasons that allowed WoW to take off as strongly as it did, especially during Vanilla/BC. I still remember many butthurt EQ players calling WoW "MMO for dummies", "World of Grandmacraft", or other supposedly witty phrases in the same vein. Coincidentally or not, the times when the game attempted to go into full Git Gud™ mode was when it started to massively hemorrhage players - the same players that fund the hardcore crowd's fancy toys.

    If you want a full hardcore-oriented MMO, you can always go play Wildst... Nvm, I forgot that it tanked harder than a bag full of bricks
    The only spoiled people are the badsuals(they aren't casual in any definition of the word so stop calling them casuals). Also, the non raiders non pvpers bring in less money to the game these days buddy so yes they can and should start catering to m+ players, raiders and pvpers. Subs aren't what brings in money now and hell most hardcore players have multiple accounts anyway. Advertising, streaming, and esports are the revenue makers and none of those are being provided by "casuals".

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    The only spoiled people are the badsuals(they aren't casual in any definition of the word so stop calling them casuals). Also, the non raiders non pvpers bring in less money to the game these days buddy so yes they can and should start catering to m+ players, raiders and pvpers. Subs aren't what brings in money now and hell most hardcore players have multiple accounts anyway. Advertising, streaming, and esports are the revenue makers and none of those are being provided by "casuals".
    I guess Blizzard/Activision knows better than you, what brings the money. They would not cater to to casuals, if m+/raider/pvp would bring in more money. And given how many chars have certain achivements, which you actually can track, i would say the casual base is larger than the raider/m+/pvp base. But thats only my opinion, of course.

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Wangming View Post
    Once again, WoW supposedly has millions of players. Is it really that hard to understand that not everything is for mythic raiders?
    How many millions do you think retail wow has right now? We have no official numbers if course, but being completely realistic here, if you complete activity all across the board (ingame, forums, social media), do you really thing it has more than 2, maybe 3 million players?
    Again, i am not saying WoW is dying, fluctuating subscriber numbers are normal, but as of right now, the world is very, very empty.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malania View Post
    That it's new? It's something new to do as we've been doing the current content for a while...

    Why do you play this game? Are you missing something in life that purple pixels make up for? You do pay this game for fun I assume?
    Hey, if you think the "no rewards is completely fine" system works, you either missed WoD and the last 9 months or there is no real sense in arguing with you, as you are simply the exception that is the delusional to the fact that the majority of players left for this reason.

  13. #193
    The Lightbringer Wangming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    How many millions do you think retail wow has right now? We have no official numbers if course, but being completely realistic here, if you complete activity all across the board (ingame, forums, social media), do you really thing it has more than 2, maybe 3 million players?
    Again, i am not saying WoW is dying, fluctuating subscriber numbers are normal, but as of right now, the world is very, very empty.
    On one hand it is true, on the other it has little to do with the discussion itself. Point is, Mythic raiders are just a fraction of the playersbase so it makes sense to not make everything for them. In fact I think 9.1 doesn't have enough casual content.

  14. #194
    Seems kinda silly to me considering current M0 items can be upgraded so not sure why they decided to not let them be upgradeable with valor.

  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by Uko View Post
    Seems kinda silly to me considering current M0 items can be upgraded so not sure why they decided to not let them be upgradeable with valor.
    probably because the new dungeon starts a 226 and m0 starts at 210?

  16. #196
    Quote Originally Posted by ohwell View Post
    The only spoiled people are the badsuals(they aren't casual in any definition of the word so stop calling them casuals). Also, the non raiders non pvpers bring in less money to the game these days buddy so yes they can and should start catering to m+ players, raiders and pvpers. Subs aren't what brings in money now and hell most hardcore players have multiple accounts anyway. Advertising, streaming, and esports are the revenue makers and none of those are being provided by "casuals".
    So wrong it's painful.

  17. #197
    Just another point to throw into the pit: doing the Hard Mode quest for Taz rewards a neck item which is BiS for pretty much everyone irrespective of ilvl due to an overstatted proc.

  18. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    We already are in the longest content draught for a first patch ever and it will still take a while for 9.1 to arrive. When it finally arrives, one of the big features will be completely meaningless for many main characters, because it offers no upgrades for them.
    Why exclude a large portion of the playerbase from this content? It's not like the alternatives are abundant.
    Thank god I unsubscribed, first time since Cata. Pretty sad to see this.

  19. #199
    Oh no...

    226 gear, and Hard Mode has 233 Gear. That's...NORMAL SANCTUM GEAR! OH NOOOOO!!!

    lol stop. Casuals now have multiple options of catching up. I agree that this gear should still be upgradable, but to say it's dead on arrival is dumb.

  20. #200
    Please wait Temp name's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uko View Post
    Seems kinda silly to me considering current M0 items can be upgraded so not sure why they decided to not let them be upgradeable with valor.
    So no one feels pressured to spend thousands upon thousands of valor on an m0 item

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