Report: Tax Returns of the Top 25 Wealthiest in America

[Elegiac]

Bullshit, that is a fucking lie.

Evidence, now.

*gestures*

Yet you won't do anything to stop corporatism because it would be infringing upon the corporatists liberties and harming their ability to push corporatism. Curious.

A wealth tax still leaves everyone under the same rules, the same way progressive income tax does.

And wealth inequality directly contributes to harms suffered by those in poverty, by attenuating society's collective wealth more and more to the plutocracy alone, expanding and encouraging poverty at the low end. And yet, you won't support a wealth tax to restrict that harm.

Curious.

At least be honest about your ideology not having any internal consistency. Curious.

[Themius]

Like, nearly 800,000 others, according to Google.

Bezos didn't make those billions. Those hundreds of thousands of workers did.

And yet, when some of us suggest worker-owned collectives as a model, so that workers can own the fruits of their labors, that's "socialism" and that's "terrible", because wharrgarble.

Edit: To be clear, it is socialism. Never get to hear an explanation why it's terrible, though, except for fearmongering about Stalin and Mao which is just shitposting nonsense.

Basically, it goes socialism and then therefore bad because of socialism!

It never goes... socialism for workers to own the fruits of their own labour and not be exploited in the minds of people like Machismo.

If I hire a guy and pay them $2 a day to make me $5,000 to Machismo's mind that's my labour and the fruit of my labour... my gross exploitation of another's labour is suddenly my own labour? It's illogical.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Nope, swing and a miss.

I oppose corporatism just as much as I oppose socialism.

So you're against corporations gathering resources to themselves without check, and you're against doing anything to stop corporations doing that.

Maybe you could hold fire on the 15 pages of telling us what you don't support, and tell us what you do? Then maybe we'd get somewhere with this discussion, because fuck knows it's been going nowhere from what I've seen.

[Machismo]

a lot of the rules for which he obtained 170 billion+ in "wealth" were harmful to a lot of other people.

So now what?

Like what rules?

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*gestures*





At least be honest about your ideology not having any internal consistency. Curious.

Curious, that's not me, that's you pointing to a straw man that someone else said.

So, swing and a miss for you, slugger.

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So you're against corporations gathering resources to themselves without check, and you're against doing anything to stop corporations doing that.

Maybe you could hold fire on the 15 pages of telling us what you don't support, and tell us what you do? Then maybe we'd get somewhere with this discussion, because fuck knows it's been going nowhere from what I've seen.

I'm opposed corporations using the government to create competitive advantages.

I fully support capitalism.

[Elegiac]

So you're against corporations gathering resources to themselves without check, and you're against doing anything to stop corporations doing that.

Maybe you could hold fire on the 15 pages of telling us what you don't support, and tell us what you do? Then maybe we'd get somewhere with this discussion, because fuck knows it's been going nowhere from what I've seen.

"Liberty", without ever defining what that means or explaining why anyone should give a shit about it beyond vague fearmongering about communism.

You know, basic ignorant Red Scare shit.

[beanman12345]

strange, I swear it's like some sort of deja'vu where this glaring contradiction has been pointed out before.

He'll ignore Edge pointing out what everyone but he see's, so not quite deja'vu, but close enough.

[Machismo]

"Liberty", without ever defining what that means or explaining why anyone should give a shit about it.

Feel free to use the dictionary. You find that evidence, yet?

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He'll ignore Edge pointing out what everyone but he see's, so not quite deja'vu, but close enough.

That's because Edge is fucking lying, just like Endus is.

They can enjoy their straw men all they like.

[Themius]

So, don't work for him.

Don't use his service, or his products.

So now you're moving goalposts... the argument you gave was "it's his labour" it ain't... so why should he have so much ownership?

You people are fucking odd as fuck to me.

You are so much for free and people owning their own work to a point that you're fine with wage based slavery and exploitation and LITERAL SLAVERY if it props up consumerism and corporatism.

To say "the workers much own a significant portion of this company that they work for and produce labour and goods and profits for" is theft

yet defend the premise of "a single person totally owns all the labour of all those he exploits and forces into wage slavery."

it's fucking bogus dude.

[Edge-]

I'm opposed corporations using the government to create competitive advantages.

Why do you want to harm these people running the companies by infringing on their liberties?

I fully support capitalism.

I genuinely, honestly, 100% don't think you actually understand what this even means. Because if you want something functional it's literally not, "Get the government outta everything!" like you seem to think. Like, quite literally it's absolutely not, and hasn't been since capitalist theory started.

[Elegiac]

Curious, that's not me, that's you pointing to a straw man that someone else said.

You're welcome to prove any of us wrong by actually demonstrating you oppose corporatism.

I suspect we'll be waiting a while. Lul.

[Endus]

You seem to forget about that whole liberty thing I kept bringing up.

Nothing about the concept of "liberty" has to do with ownership of the means of production.

And in fact, capitalist models are pretty universally anti-liberty, by restricting said ownership to the capitalist elite.

[Zan15]

Like what rules?

.

umm have you been sleeping during the last 31 pages and did not read the report posted on the first page?
Do we really need to rehash the tax, labor, local/federal rules/laws that caused harm to others while benefitting Bezos?

Come on even you mentioned a few of them that you support changing

[Themius]

"Liberty", without ever defining what that means or explaining why anyone should give a shit about it beyond vague fearmongering about communism.

You know, basic ignorant Red Scare shit.

"If workers own the companies then you know... like they'll... SOCIALISM GULAGS STALIN AND WALLS!!!"

That's their thought process.

[Elegiac]

Feel free to use the dictionary.

Not seeing any dictionary wherein liberty and corporatism are regarded as synonymous. Mind pointing me to what dictionary you're using?

[Machismo]

So now you're moving goalposts... the argument you gave was "it's his labour" it ain't... so why should he have so much ownership?

You people are fucking odd as fuck to me.

You are so much for free and people owning their own work to a point that you're fine with wage based slavery and exploitation and LITERAL SLAVERY if it props up consumerism and corporatism.

To say "the workers much own a significant portion of this company that they work for and produce labour and goods and profits for" is theft

yet defend the premise of "a single person totally owns all the labour of all those he exploits and forces into wage slavery."

it's fucking bogus dude.

His labor is involved, he founded the company, and ran it for 25 years.

He was paid handsomely for it.

As for the rest, that's a fucking lie.

Don't work there, take your business elsewhere.

Or, are you a hypocrite, and use it? How often have you used Amazon over the past 25 years?

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Not seeing any dictionary wherein liberty and corporatism are regarded as synonymous. Mind pointing me to what dictionary you're using?

I never said they are synonymous.

That's not my claim.

[Endus]

That's because Edge is fucking lying, just like Endus is.

They can enjoy their straw men all they like.

Not once have I lied in this thread, and thus there is no possible way you could ever quote me as having lied.

Go on, try. If you're gonna make the claim, back it up.

Otherwise, you're just pissing into the wind because you don't like having your assumptions called into question.

[Elegiac]

"If workers own the companies then you know... like they'll... SOCIALISM GULAGS STALIN AND WALLS!!!"

That's their thought process.

Doubly amusing is that for all their fearmongering about the USSR or China they don't seem to get that none of the abuses committed under those regimes are exclusive to communism as a system and has entirely to do with elites lacking oversight.

You know, the same sort of system that Machismo seems to want with his "anything that hurts the rich is anti-liberty" stance.

[Themius]

His labor is involved, he founded the company, and ran it for 25 years.

He was paid handsomely for it.

As for the rest, that's a fucking lie.

Don't work there, take your business elsewhere.

Or, are you a hypocrite, and use it? How often have you used Amazon over the past 25 years?

Why is founding a company so important once the company is an entity that can be run with just the workers? Rest isn't a lie... it's just like idk libertarian myopia... that's your problem.

You know John Galt was a villain right??

[Machismo]

Not once have I lied in this thread, and thus there is no possible way you could ever quote me as having lied.

Go on, try. If you're gonna make the claim, back it up.

Otherwise, you're just pissing into the wind because you don't like having your assumptions called into question.

I've called you out on that lie for years.

Repeating that lie doesn't make it any more true.

It's your claim, because you made it against me. I'm calling your claims lies, because you did nothing but build straw men.

[Elegiac]

I never said they are synonymous.

That's not my claim.

In which case you haven't made a claim, then, since you won't define what you think liberty is.

Sure hope it isn't you because and the Republican Party have the same definition of "liberty" and it wouldn't service the Never Trumper shtick you've been displaying for the past four years to admit that.