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  1. #301
    Herald of the Titans Advent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    The effects do extra damage when executed correctly (positionals) and grant buffs or enable to use of other abilities.
    It would be pretty annoying if they applied CC effects.
    I probably didn't articulate that well, but what I meant is that you have very few class-defining abilities that do anything other than damage. No ability to clone yourself (Like Mesmers in Gw2), or a second health bar and new abilities (Like Necromancer shroud) or a blink (Like wow mages). Abilities beyond "It does damage" that truly define and differentiate classes aren't very omnipresent in FFXIV.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    There are seperate abilities for CC. There are stuns, interrupts, hard CC, roots, knockback immunity, positional requirement denial and snares. They are their own abilities as they should be. It would be a pain if they were rotational. It's bad enough that charges do damage and are rotational, compromising your mobility options.
    I agree that's not ideal. I recall this being a thing for warriors on Ultraxion back in Dragon Soul where they'd do more damage if they weaved Heroic Leap into their rotation, because it did damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    In GW2 they had to invent a new "shield bar" for enemies so those abilities with CC aren't useless in PvE. I don't think that is a good design at all myself.
    That's mostly for boss enemies, and it exists primarily because they wanted CC to be usable on bosses without completely hamstringing them. Imagine if you could completely keep a boss stun locked (Which many classes likely could), it'd be awful for player engagement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    Guild wars is a different type of combat as well, as you have to pick your load out/limited number of abilities from a lot, which will probably not be ideal for every type of content, while in FF you have acess to all your abilities at all times, except PvP which has a lite version of the job. Different design.
    Of course the combat is different, Gw2 is something of a hybrid. But the way it handles dynamic combat decisions is very good, and something I believe FFXIV is sorely lacking. There's no consideration for ability use beyond what does more damage, and when. Your choice of healing for most jobs is a single ability that takes no consideration for what job you're on. It causes a lot of combat-related content to fall flat because your ability to make decisions on the fly is hamstrung by a lack of meaningful choices to actually make. I think this could be improved by looking at how other games achieve it, and learning from them.

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by Advent View Post
    I probably didn't articulate that well, but what I meant is that you have very few class-defining abilities that do anything other than damage. No ability to clone yourself (Like Mesmers in Gw2), or a second health bar and new abilities (Like Necromancer shroud) or a blink (Like wow mages). Abilities beyond "It does damage" that truly define and differentiate classes aren't very omnipresent in FFXIV.

    I agree that's not ideal. I recall this being a thing for warriors on Ultraxion back in Dragon Soul where they'd do more damage if they weaved Heroic Leap into their rotation, because it did damage.

    That's mostly for boss enemies, and it exists primarily because they wanted CC to be usable on bosses without completely hamstringing them. Imagine if you could completely keep a boss stun locked (Which many classes likely could), it'd be awful for player engagement.

    Of course the combat is different, Gw2 is something of a hybrid. But the way it handles dynamic combat decisions is very good, and something I believe FFXIV is sorely lacking. There's no consideration for ability use beyond what does more damage, and when. Your choice of healing for most jobs is a single ability that takes no consideration for what job you're on. It causes a lot of combat-related content to fall flat because your ability to make decisions on the fly is hamstrung by a lack of meaningful choices to actually make. I think this could be improved by looking at how other games achieve it, and learning from them.
    I do believe the design for FFXIV jobs comes from their weapon, not so much a special fantasy gimmick. That is what differentiates them.

    As for abilities. Sure, that is your opinion. I didn't enjoy GW2's combat at all so i don't share it. I don't think there were meaningful choices at all. You picked a build that works and do it's rotation, which involved stacking a debuff for DoT or physical damage increase.
    I mean, it is difficult to compare cause GW2 is a game with a big focus on the overworld and how dangerous it is. So, CC's baked on your damage skills help you survive. FF is a more rigid instanced game whose overworld is not overly dangerous. So, the combat systems are designed for the respective games. I don't think one benefits much from importing from the other.

    But, we'll see. YoshiP was talking about how to make DPS fun, implying we will see sone changes in endwalker. Not necessarely the ones you are envisioning, but i am curious.
    Last edited by Swnem; 2021-07-24 at 02:34 AM.

  3. #303
    Quote Originally Posted by ippollite View Post
    Ooops.

    1. Posted in the wrong thread.
    2. Apropos of nothing.
    3. I was very.... very drunk (and obviously up in my fee-fee's )
    Fair enough I was super confused.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    It's bad enough that charges do damage and are rotational, compromising your mobility options.
    I actually hate that gap closers do damage in this game.

    In GW2 they had to invent a new "shield bar" for enemies so those abilities with CC aren't useless in PvE. I don't think that is a good design at all myself.
    Blade and Soul had this design as well and I loved it. You had specific # of CC skills that had various functions and requirements and it was nice trying to fit those puzzles in to interrupt as many mechanics as possible as well as chaining CC and ani-cancelling combos on normal mobs.

  4. #304
    Herald of the Titans Advent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    I actually hate that gap closers do damage in this game.
    I get the impression that the devs don't think players will enjoy pushing a button that doesn't do damage.

  5. #305
    Quote Originally Posted by Advent View Post
    I get the impression that the devs don't think players will enjoy pushing a button that doesn't do damage.
    I'm still waiting for them to just make all heal spells into damage spells that just happen to heal people nearby.

  6. #306
    Quote Originally Posted by Advent View Post
    Actually what happened was that I ran into the spotlight, and either ran too far/not far enough and didn't complete the dance, or I ran in the wrong direction because the game didn't state that I was supposed to orient myself toward the bosses to start.
    For me the spotlight was always spawning well behind me and I don't play zoomed out so I didn't notice it. Once I did notice it, I still had no idea what it was for. Then, after months, one run it just dawned on me that I needed to start where the spotlight was. Really unintuitive IMO.
    Shut your goddamn mouth, Gene!

  7. #307
    Hmm I would probably say a better auction house?

  8. #308
    The arthryryte currents in the final zone of stormblood. Loch thingy. They can die in a fire. In fact almost all of stormblood aytheryte currents can bog off... but this one in particular. I have a feeling they decided this was "gameplay" and wanted to make it a "fun" adventure. Its not. It can suck a bag of d****. I hope they get covered in goop and need at least 3 showers to really feel clean again.
    Last edited by ippollite; 2021-07-27 at 11:01 AM.

  9. #309
    currently level 42 archer and have done all the quests below MSQ including https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w..._That_Got_Away yet I still do not have the option to begin Bard.

    Is it because I only have 2 days left of a free trial? This is kinda frustrating because I have googled for answers but can't seem to find what I am looking for

  10. #310
    Quote Originally Posted by Poppen View Post
    currently level 42 archer and have done all the quests below MSQ including https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w..._That_Got_Away yet I still do not have the option to begin Bard.

    Is it because I only have 2 days left of a free trial? This is kinda frustrating because I have googled for answers but can't seem to find what I am looking for
    to unlock bard you gotta find blue quest, its not related to MSQ. Im bard myself, its just some dude sitting under tree branch in open world
    Ship has been abandoned.
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    NextUI for XIV


  11. #311
    The Lightbringer Maljinwo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poppen View Post
    currently level 42 archer and have done all the quests below MSQ including https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w..._That_Got_Away yet I still do not have the option to begin Bard.

    Is it because I only have 2 days left of a free trial? This is kinda frustrating because I have googled for answers but can't seem to find what I am looking for
    Your 'advanced' class is unlocked with the level 30 class quest.
    You should go back to the Archer's Guild in Gridania and pick up any quests that you might've missed
    This world don't give us nothing. It be our lot to suffer... and our duty to fight back.

  12. #312
    Quote Originally Posted by Maljinwo View Post
    Your 'advanced' class is unlocked with the level 30 class quest.
    You should go back to the Archer's Guild in Gridania and pick up any quests that you might've missed

    nope, that doesn't help as I have been back several times. The comment above yours may be more helpful, no offence intended

  13. #313
    You need to have also finished the sylph quests in the msq. Dunno if that helps, but it might be the roadblock?

  14. #314
    Quote Originally Posted by Katchii View Post
    While I can't argue that the account management and download stuff for this game is pretty bad, there are numerous guides online as well as instructions on the website itself that tell you how to manage all of it. If you cared about playing, you could spend the time reading that stuff.

    Again I agree, it shouldn't be needed, but the resources to help you through this problem ARE there.
    I'm talking about not being able to launch the game. I don't need a freaking guide to tell me how to double-click on an icon. If I can't even get the game launched, I'm not very enthused about the rest of it.
    Still calling them out, one infraction at a time.

  15. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by ippollite View Post
    You need to have also finished the sylph quests in the msq. Dunno if that helps, but it might be the roadblock?
    thank you but pretty sure I have considering I'm now lvl 44 through doing MSQ but you might be right in that maybe I missed something.

  16. #316
    Quote Originally Posted by Poppen View Post
    currently level 42 archer and have done all the quests below MSQ including https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w..._That_Got_Away yet I still do not have the option to begin Bard.

    Is it because I only have 2 days left of a free trial? This is kinda frustrating because I have googled for answers but can't seem to find what I am looking for
    Free trial is unlimited now? If you don't have any extra quest lined up below your MSQ in the upper left corner and you've done https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w...lph-management then I can only imagine it's some kind of bug.

  17. #317
    Quote Originally Posted by Ringthane View Post
    I'm talking about not being able to launch the game. I don't need a freaking guide to tell me how to double-click on an icon. If I can't even get the game launched, I'm not very enthused about the rest of it.
    Online games have various issues for various reasons with launching or downloading or whatever due to firewall settings and other stuff that interact with the online connection. Knowing how to set-up the game and your system together so they can work together so you can play the game is not a problem only FFXIV has. There are guides for literally every online game out there going over this specific issue.

  18. #318
    The Lightbringer Maljinwo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poppen View Post
    thank you but pretty sure I have considering I'm now lvl 44 through doing MSQ but you might be right in that maybe I missed something.
    Check the following just in case
    https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w..._archer_quests
    https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w...of_bard_quests
    This world don't give us nothing. It be our lot to suffer... and our duty to fight back.

  19. #319
    Something weird is going on here because the person that gives you the quest to begin your Bard is the same NPC that does your other Archer quests in Gridania.

    I don't want to say the person is lying but they've now also said they have 2 days left on their free trial, which is unlimited.

    So...something is weird here. This is how all the Job quests are, the breadcrumb quest to your new Job quest giver NPC is from the same person who gives you all your other quests.

  20. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by dlld View Post
    Free trial is unlimited now? If you don't have any extra quest lined up below your MSQ in the upper left corner and you've done https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w...lph-management then I can only imagine it's some kind of bug.
    There is a 14 day free log in event going on.

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