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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by Overlordd View Post
    MoP is the expansion that most the lost subscribers.
    Incorrect. Cata lost millions before MoP launched. MoP regained subscribers during the expansion and did not have a noticeable dropoff in subscribers until the last content patch dropped and the 14 months drought set in. MoP would be the last expansion to not have a substantial dropoff in subscribers before the last content patch dropped. Every expansion afterwards had a huge dropoff after launch and would never recover during the expansion's life cycle. Going by official numbers, WoD was the expansion that lost the most subscribers, losing millions before Hellfire Citadel even launched. If you go by estimates, then Legion lost the most subscribers, losing millions before Antorus even launched.



    Quote Originally Posted by Overlordd View Post
    WoD regained those
    Correction: the gargantuan marketing push for WoD regained the subscribers... for launch. WoD (and every expansion after it) had little player retention.

    thanks to MoP being a failure they had to cut content.
    Incorrect. WoD had little content because after 5.4 released, Blizzard doubled the size of the WoW dev team. Brook's Law was in full effect here, and the WoW dev team produced less because the newbies weren't really developing much, and the veterans had to spend less time developing content and to instead teach the newbs the tools and bring them into the production pipeline. It wasn't until Legion expansion cycle that the whole dev team was up to speed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by justandulas View Post
    You actually answered my point for you. We have murlocs, arakkoa, ogres, centaurs, and a dozen other WoW races that would have fit into the game better than fox people that have NEVER once existed in WoW until they were pulled outta the ass to lure in the FF or pro furry crowd.

    A minotaur, is more monster, than antropomorphic animals, same for something like a werewolf.

    My bottom line is that there were established WoW races that would have been better fits is all.
    I don't see how Vulpera would have appealed to the FFXIV crowd. FFXIV players are into anime aesthetics, as in petite girls and lolis and bishounens and such. The only WoW race that vaguely comes close to that are Blood Elves, and they were already in WoW. Vulpera appeal to furries, which WoW had already long appealed to with Worgen and Pandaren (and, if you stretch it, Tauren. But Tauren didn't look very appealing to furries originally. It wasn't until the WoD character model overhaul that Tauren were redesigned to look more furry).

    I do agree that wackier races like Centaurs and Qiraji/Nerubians/Mantid or Tolvir or Naga would have been much more welcome than Vulpera.
    Last edited by Val the Moofia Boss; 2021-07-14 at 02:04 PM.

  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    Incorrect. Cata lost millions
    People should stop with that meme that Cata "lost" anything because it was supposedly "terrible". Cata had a predictable exodus that would happen ANYWAY because almost all players that played until then first entered either in WotLK or in mid-TBC and it was the very FIRST time that most people would inevitably get bored of MMORPG gaming in general and they would exit anyway.

    It is extremely FITTING that this is once again heard in a MoP-overrating thread; the MoP fanbois ALWAYS used "Cata was terrible" as a meme to inflate their misguided position that MoP was supposedly perfect.

    The exact same overrating happened for Legion because there was an exodus at WoD and to smaller extend the launch of SL was overrated because BfA had another exodus.

  3. #183
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    while it was current? no
    after it already ended? yes

    and that is pretty much case with every expansion, while current its worst thing ever, after its over its great expansion...
    there are even people praising wod now, that should give you a clue

    personaly, i liked pandaria, and wouldnt mind new expansions to be more like it
    True, everyone now all of a suddens loves Cata.

  4. #184
    If you didnt mind the Pandarens, the chinese esthetic, and survived the awful dailies structure at the start, it was a great expansion.
    Classes were fun to play, raids were as great as they ever were, the story was alright, getting your legendary was long but straightforward, your little farm was relaxing, the addition of pet battles were ... a thing.

    Frankly, if it wasn't for the kung-fu pandas turning away a LOT of people, MoP made with another setting would have been a great hit.

  5. #185
    I am Murloc! Asrialol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overlordd View Post
    Do you realise it had 35k likes?
    That's also quite low considering the amount of players at that time.

    I guess that the majority of people doesn't bother to actually like or dislike shit. I'm guessing it had more than 70k views
    Hi

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by epigramx View Post
    People should stop with that meme that Cata "lost" anything because it was supposedly "terrible"
    the MoP fanbois ALWAYS used "Cata was terrible" as a meme to inflate their misguided position that MoP was supposedly perfect.
    I never said Cata was terrible. If anything, Cata is my second most favorite expansion because of all of the story content in it and the QoL features it brought. Perhaps I should have used better wording to point towards the subscriber dropoff after Dragon Soul.

    The exact same overrating happened for Legion because there was an exodus at WoD
    I don't think MoP was more praised than Cata because "MoP was a good expansion after a bad expansion". Again, I thought Cata had a lot of good stuff and wasn't particularly bad. I thought MoP wound up being more praised for it's own merits.

    I do agree that part of Legion's popularity isn't because people actually think Legion is good in of itself, but because it came after WoD.

    and to smaller extend the launch of SL was overrated because BfA had another exodus.
    Shadowlands was not overrated after BFA. Shadowlands is perhaps the least popular WoW expansion yet, worse than BFA because for all of BFA's faults, people were still talking about it. You hardly see anyone talking about Shadowlands outside of WoW forums. Everyone who hated on BFA also hates on Shadowlands. At its core, Shadowlands is just a continuation of BFA, just without the saving grace BFA had with the player's investment in the Horde and Alliance storylines.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Unlimited Power View Post
    Even the Halfhill farm was seen as a potential precursor to an actual housing system which unfortunately resulted in Garrisons.
    I loved Halfhill and the Garrisons, though for different reasons.

    I consider Halfhill Farm to be my Sunwalker's home (along with Thunder Bluff). I had my hearthstone set to the Halfhill Inn, and at the end of each play session I would hearth back to the farm and log out there (or TB). It's my headcanon that 5.4 was the end of WoW: there was no more war or craziness after Garrosh's defeat, and my Sunwalker retired to Halfhill and lived happily ever after.

    I quite liked Garrisons. For the first time in WoW, the player was finally recognized as being so instrumental to their faction's military victories, and was given an appropriate place in the military leadership, being appointed a general who was pretty much the chief commander of their faction's expedition to Draenor (not unlike how Bolvar and Saurfang led their factions in Northrend, or Admiral Taylor and Nazgrim led the Pandaria expeditions). I loved going around, finding the place to setup camp, directing the little lumberers to clear away the land, choosing which buildings to erect, the Suikoden-esque gameplay of finding NPCs to recruit and sending them back to my garrison and then coming back to see them chilling, seeing my castle expand and get bigger and more populated. I feel very attached to the Alliance garrison on my Alliance main, and even after WoD I would still hearth back there to log off.

    Garrisons were good content. It's just that they weren't meant to be the endgame content, but because the only endgame content was raiding, and most people don't raid, people concentrated on garrisons.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    Incorrect. Cata lost millions before MoP launched. MoP regained subscribers during the expansion
    Not true, it's even backed up by your own graph.
    MoP did not regain the players that quit during Cataclysm. Cataclysm lost 3 million subscribers.

    Mists of Pandaria, as you can see on your graph, only regained a measly 900k subscribers at launch.

    Throne of Thunder released at the 5th of march 2013. Looking at your own graph it already lost 2 million subscribers till then.
    It did not regain subscribers at all. It kept tumbeling to around 6 and a half million subscribers until WoD regained 4 million subscribers.

    Its time to cut the bullshit.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Smith View Post
    I loved the Brawler's Guild
    I liked the idea of the Brawlers Guild: hard, singleplayer content. Unfortunately, WoW has never executed it well. The BG fights don't feel like they were tuned to really challenge your knowledge of your class and your skill to use its abilities. Instead, it feels like each fight is about using a gimmick to defeat the boss. The other problem with the Brawlers Guild was that it was singleplayer content, but you couldn't do it on demand. You had to wait in line for other people to do their fights, and watching other people play singleplayer content isn't fun.

    The Mage Tower got it right. The fights weren't gimmicky, weren't reliant on you figuring out the "right" talent your were supposed to use. They were about truly understanding your toolkit and figuring out the best way to make use of it, and there were multiple different talents or strats you could go for. You could do Mage Tower content at will, no waiting on other people involved. I loved the Mage Tower. Unfortunately, the WoW dev team is run by people who think that removing stellar content enhances their game.

  9. #189

  10. #190
    It was a disaster. Cataclysm and MoP were when WoW started to bleed subscribers. This says how much both were hated.
    English is not my main language so grammar errors might happen.

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by sam86 View Post
    MoP has the worst launch, that is fact
    The TBC and WoD launches were worst. When TBC launched, everyone was funneled into the same zone and it was impossible to kill boars in Hellfire Peninsula because they died before you had a chance to target and attack them... and that was assuming the servers were still up. After TBC, every WoW expansion after (up until Shadowlands) used instances starting scenarios, and placed players on different sides of the continent.

    The WoD launch was literally unplayable due to the queue times, and because garrison servers kept bugging out and DCing people.

    People meme about the infinite line of Gyrocopters in MoP but it was still playable.

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    The TBC and WoD launches were worst. When TBC launched, everyone was funneled into the same zone and it was impossible to kill boars in Hellfire Peninsula because they died before you had a chance to target and attack them... and that was assuming the servers were still up. After TBC, every WoW expansion after (up until Shadowlands) used instances starting scenarios, and placed players on different sides of the continent.

    The WoD launch was literally unplayable due to the queue times, and because garrison servers kept bugging out and DCing people.

    People meme about the infinite line of Gyrocopters in MoP but it was still playable.
    MoP had pandas at level 1. I launched that way and it was laggy but not extremely. I bet we were about half of the population that reduced the load because there were a ton of healers and tanks that wanted to start a monk for end-game.

  13. #193
    I remember how much I hates Panda. Going back, you realize how great it was, and now I just hate they removed so much of it with the cloak questline.

  14. #194
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overlordd View Post
    I see that youtube hid the dislikes now but I rechecked last week and it had close up to 36k dislikes (!).

    .... No... no they did not hide the dislikes...
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    My ideas are objectively good

  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by Baroclinic View Post
    I remember how much I hates Panda. Going back, you realize how great it was, and now I just hate they removed so much of it with the cloak questline.
    This ends up being the thing for every single expansion sadly. There are always things that prevent you from realizing the good things we have at the time.

    The horrible Legiondary RNG and artifact power grind prevented many from realizing how good Suramar was as a zone sized city.

    And then of course when the expansion ends you quickly forget the bad parts and only remember the good stuff, which leaves us with players convinced a given expansion was flawless when in reality it was treated just the same as current ones are now.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  16. #196
    Personally I very much enjoyed MoP. The daily grind at first was rough, but the scenery, music, and dungeons/raids were very cool. I also enjoyed the story until the very end, which was used as a justification to set up WoD, which is where WoW’s lore/writing reeeeeeeeally started its tailspin.

  17. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    This ends up being the thing for every single expansion sadly. There are always things that prevent you from realizing the good things we have at the time.

    The horrible Legiondary RNG and artifact power grind prevented many from realizing how good Suramar was as a zone sized city.

    And then of course when the expansion ends you quickly forget the bad parts and only remember the good stuff, which leaves us with players convinced a given expansion was flawless when in reality it was treated just the same as current ones are now.
    The Suramar culture was too weird. It was like listening to zombies speaking to you. Creepy in a bad way by design.

  18. #198
    Mists big critics complained about the grinding, dailies, and shoe horned in poor quality content like scenarios so while not beloved it looks incredible now that blizzard has tripled down on the negatives.

  19. #199
    Quote Originally Posted by I HATE CHAOS View Post
    shoe horned in poor quality content like scenarios
    ... What? The scenarios were great! From a content standpoint, it was incredibly refreshing: low pressure content you could queue for and complete with any combination of roles. And content wise, it told a lot of fun stories, like inventing new brews, infiltrating ancient treasure troves, or seeing other operations in the war (such as Varian fighting the Zandalari in the Eastern Kingdoms, or True Horde locating the heart of Y'shaarj).

  20. #200
    I loved the story because its where Anduin and Wrathions looove started. IMO Wrathion should be the one who saves anduin from jailer. That would save shadowlands horrible storyline for me.

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