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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Did the level 26s with leveling gear have fun getting 2 shot by you? Or did you leave them alone and only target the other twinks?

    When ppl have a huge advantage before the game even starts, its a miserable experience for the disadvantaged team / players. Thats the same for non twinks vs twinks, and pugs vs premades.
    Do you leave people with worse gear than you alone at 60? Probably not. The difference with lower levels is that it's very easy to get your gear level near or at twink levels.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Farora View Post
    Do you leave people with worse gear than you alone at 60? Probably not. The difference with lower levels is that it's very easy to get your gear level near or at twink levels.
    Ppl that just dinged 70 usually understand they shld get a few lvl 70 pieces before going straight into bgs. The difference between fresh 70s to geared 70s, is not nearly as big as lvl 29s with full blue enchanted gear. Sometimes 3x the hp, weapons enchanted, all that.

    My point is, twinking and premading are both maximizing your advantage before the game even begins.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    And now all the premade babies are crying that they can't put a group together and stomp pugs anymore

    lmao
    Good. 5 man premades still will be a big advantage over a pug though, but obviously a lot less bad.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Syn20 View Post
    This is the route they should have taken years ago. It's not like it's rated content, so as I see it, there is absolutely no legitimate reason for allowing a huge premade group to face against a non-premade.

    If they made premades get 150%, maybe even 200% honor when going against another premade, it wouldn't affect players like me. If they get pitched against a non-premade, reduce their honor gain by 50% and/or give the non-premade players a significant buff for the duration of the battle. What does affect players like me is being pitched against premades.

    More effort = more reward. That's a good system. Getting more honor because you stomped all over an opponent who had no chance of winning - that's a bad system. In the same way that you don't get great PVE rewards for doing easy content, you shouldn't get great PVP rewards because you decided the best course of action was the make the life of other players a misery. This rule already applies to ganking lower level players as well as the XP gained if you're boosting players. It makes sense for it to be consistently applied, and to apply it to premades against non-premades.

    The first time I ever went into the cooking battle brawl, it was against a premade. Absolutely nothing I could do, and I swore to never play it again. An entire event that I've removed myself from because I felt like there was absolutely no hope of winning.

    It's not even the case that premades want to roll through match after match as quickly as possible. They want to keep games rolling for as long as possible because it's worth more. It disrupts the play for people who aren't in a premade because they either take the deserter or they get stuck there while they get farmed (or they run around as a ghost and hope they don't get reported).
    The long premades aren't always just farming either. I've been queued into (the winning side) of griefing premades. The point isn't to win, or even to get honor. They just want to make the other side as mad as they possibly can. Farm AV graveyards for two hours and then camp at the cave until -the entire alliance team- stops ressing and runs around as a ghost. And then stay there an extra 20 minutes even though nobody's getting honor, for the express purpose of hoping they'll start taking deserter buff and forcing in new people that are stuck there.

  5. #25
    premade vs pug was always one of the worst aspects of WoW, hilarious it took them so long to do something about it

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by crazyman2 View Post
    The long premades aren't always just farming either. I've been queued into (the winning side) of griefing premades. The point isn't to win, or even to get honor. They just want to make the other side as mad as they possibly can. Farm AV graveyards for two hours and then camp at the cave until -the entire alliance team- stops ressing and runs around as a ghost. And then stay there an extra 20 minutes even though nobody's getting honor, for the express purpose of hoping they'll start taking deserter buff and forcing in new people that are stuck there.
    This has always been the most confusing aspect of wow for me - And im someone who is more than happy for everyone to play within the rules, even if it is pissing other players off. But this level of dedication to disrupting others enjoyment, with zero benefit to themselves, has always confused me. Few times over the years someone has ganked or tried to gank me, and i have made their life pretty unhappy for a few minutes, maybe even 10 minutes, but quite quickly i think to myself "wait, i was on the way to X to do Y - why the fuck am i wasting my time camping this dudes body?" and i carry on with my play session.

    It happens in all games - riot shield gangs, people blocking others into doorways in fps, people blinding teammates with flash bangs in counterstrike, feeding in a moba - and honestly, it can be pretty godamn funny at times, but only in small doses. Those who intentionally group up and set out on a long campaign of harassment and abuse, while gaining nothing at all themselves, is really strange to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyanion View Post
    In no way are you entitled to the 'complete' game when you buy it, because DLC/cosmetics and so on are there for companies to make more money
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Others, including myself, are saying that they only exist because Blizzard needed to create things so they could monetize it.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Yizu View Post
    As a solo player i dont think this is good, some people play this game for a reason, why not just make it premades more than 5 will only queue into premades and same faction pm
    Lol, imagine that. Premades dodging premades dodging premades. Premades just don't fight against other premades unless there are better rewards then you're basically doing retail.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizah View Post
    why so mad bro

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by munkeyinorbit View Post
    Lol, imagine that. Premades dodging premades dodging premades. Premades just don't fight against other premades unless there are better rewards then you're basically doing retail.
    You know what killed Twinking? Making them fight other twinks. You know what killed premades? Making them fight other premades. You are right that Blizzard eventually realised this an offered Rated BG's as a solution to this, allowing Premade Vs Premade competition, and rewarding that higher level of competition with higher rewards.

    #SomeChanges

    Turns out, people didn't like twinking because its just some silly fun, no, they liked it because they could and would absolutely STOMP the competition. Premades are the same, the whole "I just love playing with my friends and having a laugh" line is absolute bullshit, people like it because they had a HUGE advantage over a group of disorganized pugs. It is no different to people saying "LFR must remain, its how i experience the story and i love seeing the story that way!" and then the loot quality was reduced and WW3 almost started.
    Last edited by arkanon; 2021-07-21 at 03:42 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyanion View Post
    In no way are you entitled to the 'complete' game when you buy it, because DLC/cosmetics and so on are there for companies to make more money
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Others, including myself, are saying that they only exist because Blizzard needed to create things so they could monetize it.

  9. #29
    Wow, this is maybe one of the best PVP changes to have happened to this game in.. forever?

    I'd love to see fresh classic servers with that change in a year or two down the road

  10. #30
    Stood in the Fire AkundaMrdal's Avatar
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    Nice, I might give another try to BG's with this change. I tried them once, waited in que for almost 1h 15 minutes only to get raped by Apes premade, l left after few minutes and decided to never set a foot in them, untill Blizzard will do something about it.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Motorman View Post
    Going to BGs solo is a free decision.
    Going to BGs premade is a free decision.

    So why should two decisions that were made freely not be equal but one of them should prevail by being catered for, pumpered and protected?
    Granted, allowing people to join in large groups would have been even better - conditional on them only being matched against other big groups. That way, everyone would be catered for equally.

    Having said that, I can't imagine anyone would even still try to queue up in large groups then.

    That way, I can understand Blizzard made a judgement call, and probably didn't want to implement a feature that would either never be used at all, or only be used if players found some way of abusing it (queue in large groups, but then win trade)

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Most Pre mades don't want to fight other pre mades, they want to roflstomp pugs for easy honor.

    If you want to have Pre made vs. Pre made bg's, you need to add extra honor to them to offset the (likely higher) queuetimes and that additional effort of building a pre made.
    nothing was more boring than when we did WSG premades instead of AV. literally thousands of games, annd sub 8 minutes roflstomps, most were 6 minutes. average time on my addon was 7 minutes 22 seconds over 500 BG's, meeting real premades is so much fun, and im sad to see that go, but the reality of things is, u had to wargame to get that experience anyways.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by TheUnrealDonald2 View Post
    Wow, this is maybe one of the best PVP changes to have happened to this game in.. forever?

    I'd love to see fresh classic servers with that change in a year or two down the road
    Same! I loved doing battlegrounds in classic, but so many times I had to alt tab for 10 minutes because my group was getting stomped by an organised, over geared group on discord.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Motorman View Post
    Going to BGs solo is a free decision.
    Going to BGs premade is a free decision.

    So why should two decisions that were made freely not be equal but one of them should prevail by being catered for, pumpered and protected?
    Imo, the game is supposed to be fun. Players should be able to log on a queue up for some casual fun and have a reasonable chance at winning. Gettiny matched against premades really isn't fun, neither is having to log on and forn a 10 man group for casual content

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    It is no different to people saying "LFR must remain, its how i experience the story and i love seeing the story that way!" and then the loot quality was reduced and WW3 almost started.
    This always gave me a good chuckle, smoke & mirrors masking the narrative that they find meritocratic reward systems oppressive.

  16. #36
    Blademaster Chibitoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Most Pre mades don't want to fight other pre mades, they want to roflstomp pugs for easy honor.

    If you want to have Pre made vs. Pre made bg's, you need to add extra honor to them to offset the (likely higher) queuetimes and that additional effort of building a pre made.
    Yes agree, would be neat if it were a pool that was shared with your raid, and therefore running less people and winning would give you more

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Did the level 26s with leveling gear have fun getting 2 shot by you? Or did you leave them alone and only target the other twinks?

    When ppl have a huge advantage before the game even starts, its a miserable experience for the disadvantaged team / players. Thats the same for non twinks vs twinks, and pugs vs premades.
    Who gives a fuck? This is moronic. Of course they're disadvantaged, they're level 26 playing against players who are level 29, should everyone be equal in level as well? Let's do stat templates again, because you all loved that so much.

    Stop playing an MMO for "competitive" PvP. Especially stop playing an MMO for "competitive" PvP in the pug mode that intentionally isn't balanced for. It's so beyond boring seeing these same dumbass complaints almost 16 years later - you wanna know one of my most enjoyable memories of Vanilla? Queuing a random BG on my level 11 rogue, seeing a level 19 twink rogue absolutely destroying everyone, and realising what's possible when you actually put some effort in. I still remember the guy's name too. Seems like the attitude today in that same situation would be to cry about how I 'deserve' to do exactly as much damage as he did without anywhere near the time or effort investment.

  18. #38
    Good change for the solo player.

    Why no premade queue for groups larger than 5? Now its literally impossible to play a bg with a full group of guildies.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    This has always been the most confusing aspect of wow for me - And im someone who is more than happy for everyone to play within the rules, even if it is pissing other players off. But this level of dedication to disrupting others enjoyment, with zero benefit to themselves, has always confused me. Few times over the years someone has ganked or tried to gank me, and i have made their life pretty unhappy for a few minutes, maybe even 10 minutes, but quite quickly i think to myself "wait, i was on the way to X to do Y - why the fuck am i wasting my time camping this dudes body?" and i carry on with my play session.

    It happens in all games - riot shield gangs, people blocking others into doorways in fps, people blinding teammates with flash bangs in counterstrike, feeding in a moba - and honestly, it can be pretty godamn funny at times, but only in small doses. Those who intentionally group up and set out on a long campaign of harassment and abuse, while gaining nothing at all themselves, is really strange to me.
    I've learned that sometimes people are just assholes and like to do asshole things, purely for the sake of assholery.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Motorman View Post
    Going to BGs solo is a free decision.
    Going to BGs premade is a free decision.

    So why should two decisions that were made freely not be equal but one of them should prevail by being catered for, pumpered and protected?
    So why not then have the people that like the same playstyle play against one another? ie Solo vs Solo and Premade vs Premade. Isn't that perfectly equal?

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Nzx View Post
    Who gives a fuck? This is moronic. Of course they're disadvantaged, they're level 26 playing against players who are level 29, should everyone be equal in level as well? Let's do stat templates again, because you all loved that so much.

    Stop playing an MMO for "competitive" PvP. Especially stop playing an MMO for "competitive" PvP in the pug mode that intentionally isn't balanced for. It's so beyond boring seeing these same dumbass complaints almost 16 years later - you wanna know one of my most enjoyable memories of Vanilla? Queuing a random BG on my level 11 rogue, seeing a level 19 twink rogue absolutely destroying everyone, and realising what's possible when you actually put some effort in. I still remember the guy's name too. Seems like the attitude today in that same situation would be to cry about how I 'deserve' to do exactly as much damage as he did without anywhere near the time or effort investment.
    I have 0 problem with twinks. All I did was point out the similarities between twinking and premading, which is maximizing your advantages before you even enter the bg, often at the expense of the enjoyment of the other side. No need to be mad lmao

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