My problem is how unclear the character sylvanas is. First they re-introduce her as the ultra master tactican, who is always one step ahead, no emotions, just smart. But then she makes crap all the time because she yet again has some emotion. That dying nelf in darkshore, tyrande triggering her and the jailor who seems to be the most evil thing until now. I mean, how can you team up with the devil and expect the devil to be not the devil? This is not smart. This is not tactical. This is idiotic and inconsistent. I think this is my personal problem with this whole Sylvanas thing. I see no reason to center almost two full expansions around this idiotic character.
In comparison look how good they portrayed Azshara. She teamed up with N'zoth but always made it clear that she is the Queen. Azshara is a consistent character. Even if one mind not like her, at least she is consistent. Everything she does she does to be the supreme ruler of... uhm... whoever she thinks her underlings are
I think the answer is that "Blizzard" know all of the intricate details that we don't. They know all of the motivations they haven't bothered to share with us. -I'm not defending the writing or the cinematic but I see how they can let it go through. I'm sure they genuinely think they are shocking people and putting in plot twists, telling a story that everyone is going to love in the end. The problem is, its so badly told and paced that people will start putting it down and looking for a better option.
Well I think somewhere along these lines, with a bit different paths, but overall you get the vibe of there not being enough revealed yet to completely understand why she went for the whole thing.
We can assume only for now.
It is likely her plan to save her own ass from being doomed to the maw, but is that only that?
We knew that from WoTLK that she was destined to the realm of torment and not because of her deeds/misdeeds but purely because of reasons outside her control. Same goes for all unwilling Scourge members, they are doomed to maw no matter what. This begs the question whether Forsaken are ultimately the same.
And then what about the others, not everyone is exactly psyched about their fate in the maw. In between dead souls turning into blue humans or being surprise chucked into Maldraxxus like Mograine who questioned and loathed the whole thing, even if he came to accept it. Or who knows what other Shadowlands realms that exist for its purpose, which might not be what the actual being sent there wants, despite earning decent afterlife.
So what Sylv might have meant to do is to reorder the whole thing, because there is in fact a lot to fix there if you look at the thing a bit.
So she found a way to do something there, got in cahoots with Jailer who sold her some story about how he found a way to fix everything and subsequently got "betrayed" last moment, even if the red flags were all there already and she was aware of it, but blinded by goal nearly achieved.
And the fun part this all too is speculation, because we simply don't know her exact motives just yet. Who knows what she might reveal in 9.2, which is making it interesting for me.
Ultimately I believe Blizz will "Kerriganize" her, there were hints already about her being key player vs the Void, which appears to be our big bad existential threat we are yet to really tackle (we killed a few nascent blobs whooptiedo, compared to what we seen in the background of throne of Titans).
So yeah some memes are warranted, but not all for sure.
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If my hunch is correct she decided for herself that a decade of atrocities is better than eternity of atrocities.
She just probably misjudged Jailer as a character and it's really not that surprising, it is very understandable that when your ultimate goal is in sight and that carrot is dangling right in front of your nose - even more intelligent and calculating people might get a bit of a tunnel vision.
It is clear that Jailer wasn't pushing his "hurr durr I gonna be master of all, all shall serve me" agenda right in everyone's face. He instead constructed a story that duped quite a few notables as we have seen. Take Devos for example, Jailer convinced her to join forces by revealing some sort of injustice. Sold her a story, same goes for Sylvanas who probably thought they have similar goals and it's worth the (temporary?) atrocities.
Overall these things that one can completely understand. She got jebaited into doing this whole mess for her misguided reasons with goal that might actually be a good or reasonable goal. Then she had a whole sunk cost fallacy episode and despite red flags forged forward.
So this all clearly backfired and I'm looking forward to 9.2 to hear what she has to say for herself, as well as what was the actual goal all along.
I think your point where she in her pride and vanity thought she was smarter and more cunning than everyone else to the point it blinded her is true too.
Last edited by Gaidax; 2021-07-23 at 09:29 AM.
I still do not see the reason why Sylvanas would team up with the very entity who is responsible for her torment, who is responsible she ended up a banshee to begin with.
Bad case of Stockholm sydrome or just stupid OVER 9000! ?
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IKR? IMO they are legitimate misogynists. The way they write female characters just proves it.
Sylvanas had a STUPID arc from the start for 9.x. First: if she is so evil and self-centered and she wants to own everyone: why would she band with an OBVIOUS narcissistic megalomaniac who was laughing hysterically and spamming the chat with evil things every 2 seconds he was on screen?
The ONLY way this makes sense is that: "yes: Sylvanas IS stupid and she understood how destructive that dude was in the end": but the problem with that is that it makes Sylvanas completely uninteresting because she's not even a child (this is level of stupid that no leader-adult can have).
We do? Could've fooled me.
These are the same guys who said that Sylvanas was a "morally grey" character.. Right before she committed genocide, for what could only at the time be described as spite.Did Blizzard just forget that a lot of their fans are adults now, and that we appreciate a little bit of nuance or moral ambiguity?
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Maybe she, for some reason, doesn't know that Jailer is responsible for the Lich King, or Arthas going all wack..
But she sure as fuck knows who Kel'thuzad is, and why she'd ever accept working with him is beyond me.
I'm confused why anyone is expecting good writing from a video game. It's like you are all Uwe Boll fans.
It's that spite part that destroyed any path back to redemption. They could have written that scene as if she did it with enormous reluctance, as if it hurt her more than anyone else. Just a subtle tell that there was more to it. But instead the scene unequivocally portrayed it as her burning down the tree just because some random night elf taunted her. Sylvanas relished in the act and that made any rationalisation afterwards moot.
https://twitter.com/horseysurprise/s...96296663531523
Last edited by Ivarr; 2021-07-23 at 10:32 AM.
The problem is simply that it's badly written, but also in such a way that it wants the viewer to take it seriously, as if it has meaning, hence why it is judged in such a way. If this was the backstory of banjo-kazooie no one would give a toss, but WoW somehow pretends that it tells an epic story.
You are welcome, Metzen. I hope you won't fuck up my underground expansion idea.
Right, if they turned the whole thing into satirising themselves, like Fast & Furious or Black List is doing then at least it would've been enjoyable. At this point the lore has become so radioactive that satire might just be the only way out of this.
We don't know the full story at this point.
It is clear at least to me that Sylvanas joined the Jailer because she was going to be doomed to the Maw and felt that the Jailer was going to break that and allow people control over their destiny. Through Shadowlands she learned that the Jailer had plans that didn't align with hers. They hinted at this turn with her cutscenes with/about Anduin.
It is well written? Absolutely not. Does it make no sense? Absolutely not.
Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
–The Sith Code
In what world is this a "twist" when it was specifically set up in those Sylvanas/Anduin cinematics from the Torghast questline?