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  1. #301
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    But she clearly did and did take part, just like the Highmountain Tauren, who stood as Warriors and Eagle Riders for the Honorbound.

    Mayla Highmountain didn't stand against her until after the events of Nazjatar.

    To me, this all sounds a bit racist because your basically saying that every other character can get involved in the story, but not the Nightborne.
    If Thalyssra and the Nightborne joined the Alliance, then she could join the war...you see, this is why I don't like some Alliance fans. Dictating what and who can have lore moments and when.
    I never said that. I said that they should have stayed neutral, joining neither faction. Or only provide “humanitarian” support to the Horde.

    They built their whole fucken “return” to wider Azeroth around becoming better people and no linger being dumb and led by maniacs.

    And they JOINED BIGGEST MANIAC AROUND.

    Its like getting a parole and committing a murder and grand theft auto straight after you came out of prison!
    Last edited by VladlTutushkin; 2021-08-14 at 12:44 PM.

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    I never said that. I said that they should have stayed neutral, joining neither faction. Or only provide “humanitarian” support to the Horde.

    They built their whole fucken “return” to wider Azeroth around becoming better people and no linger being dumb and led by maniacs.

    And they JOINED BIGGEST MANIAC AROUND.

    Its like getting a parole and committing a murder and grand theft auto straight after you came out of prison!
    But how else would they put the peasants and their toaster friends in their place? XD

  3. #303
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    I never said that. I said that they should have stayed neutral, joining neither faction. Or only provide “humanitarian” support to the Horde.

    They built their whole fucken “return” to wider Azeroth around becoming better people and no linger being dumb and led by maniacs.

    And they JOINED BIGGEST MANIAC AROUND.

    Its like getting a parole and committing a murder and grand theft auto straight after you came out of prison!
    Yes and guess what happens to those who stay neutral?

    I repeat - it was all a fair exchange which could have been done better, but the outcome should have still been the same.
    Horde got Highmountain, Nightborne + Suramar
    Alliance got Alleria, Turaylon, Void Elves and Lightforged.

    In the grand scheme, it's fair.

    Could there have been Night Elf incursions into Suramar? Yes. Should we have seen a combined effort of Sin'dorei and Shal'dorei vs Kaldorei? Yes.

  4. #304
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Elisande returning would have made the whole of Suramar pointless.
    Why? She wasn't destroyed by our encounter, and she helped us win against Gul'dan.

    She's powerful and pragmamatic, , and we know she did a cowardly thing by siding with the legion, but she earenestly was trying to save her people not condone their evil, it worked, and the fact she in the ened, like the orcs, like the blood elves, her group of nightborne follow in those footsteps, did wrong for a while and saw the error of their ways.



    Maybe it's becuase i'm not such a big fan of Thalyssra.. she reminds me too much of the kaldorei and Tyrande and Malfurion - all that righteousness and preachy values - which has it's plaec, but for me Elisande fits the horde theme better, and I preferred her coming to her senses and being restored and leading hethe half of her people
    with that sort of mindset.

  5. #305
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Yes and guess what happens to those who stay neutral?

    I repeat - it was all a fair exchange which could have been done better, but the outcome should have still been the same.
    Horde got Highmountain, Nightborne + Suramar
    Alliance got Alleria, Turaylon, Void Elves and Lightforged.

    In the grand scheme, it's fair.

    Could there have been Night Elf incursions into Suramar? Yes. Should we have seen a combined effort of Sin'dorei and Shal'dorei vs Kaldorei? Yes.
    And i said that even if they had to go Horde they shouldnt have sent forces to help genocide those people who just helped them win back their city.

    They fucken betrayed their allies, on the basis of Tyrande being “unpleasant”.

    Its messed up.

  6. #306
    Quote Originally Posted by Beloren View Post

    Maybe it's becuase i'm not such a big fan of Thalyssra..she reminds me too much of the kaldorei and Tyrande and Malfurion - all that righteousness and preachy values
    You didn't pay much attention to her character then, she is very willing to experiment on mentally handicapped people and use them as canon fodder, sure she is preachy, but it is pretty much lip service if you look at it closely.

  7. #307
    Quote Originally Posted by Beloren View Post
    Why? She wasn't destroyed by our encounter, and she helped us win against Gul'dan.

    She's powerful and pragmamatic, , and we know she did a cowardly thing by siding with the legion, but she earenestly was trying to save her people not condone their evil, it worked, and the fact she in the ened, like the orcs, like the blood elves, her group of nightborne follow in those footsteps, did wrong for a while and saw the error of their ways.



    Maybe it's becuase i'm not such a big fan of Thalyssra.. she reminds me too much of the kaldorei and Tyrande and Malfurion - all that righteousness and preachy values - which has it's plaec, but for me Elisande fits the horde theme better, and I preferred her coming to her senses and being restored and leading hethe half of her people
    with that sort of mindset.
    She was destroyed as echos of her spells appear in the Maw and within Torghast.

    I'd say she's dead and she has no place to join ranks with the Sin'dorei.
    The Sin'dorei reached out to the Nightborne people under Thalyssra, who they helped liberate from Elisande.

    Lor'themar and Liadrin would leave Elisande's "echo" to rot. They don't like her. Only Sylvanas would recruit somebody like her, but then Forsaken fans would complain.

    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    And i said that even if they had to go Horde they shouldnt have sent forces to help genocide those people who just helped them win back their city.

    They fucken betrayed their allies, on the basis of Tyrande being “unpleasant”.

    Its messed up.
    They didn't.

    The Horde forces involved during the WoT, were:
    Forsaken
    Orcs
    Tauren
    Trolls
    Blood Elves
    Goblins

    Nobody else was involved. Thalyssra and Lasan didn't get involved until after Lordaeron was destroyed.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2021-08-14 at 12:54 PM.

  8. #308
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    I never said that. I said that they should have stayed neutral, joining neither faction. Or only provide “humanitarian” support to the Horde.

    They built their whole fucken “return” to wider Azeroth around becoming better people and no linger being dumb and led by maniacs.

    And they JOINED BIGGEST MANIAC AROUND.

    Its like getting a parole and committing a murder and grand theft auto straight after you came out of prison!
    Yep the Nightborne were really portrayed as massively hypocrital and ungrateful with BFA with them basically expecting their brethren to fawn over their fooststeps after having seemingly abandonned them during the War of the Ancients and doing nothing to justify themselves, having hidden away for more than 10 millenias and helped recently the Burning Legion, joining the Horde under Sylvanas, without checking the Horde history and despite it being very difficult to not notice that she was a malevolent bitch just like Azshara and Ellisande, and being accomplices in her heinous crimes and showing no remorse for it.

  9. #309
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    But how else would they put the peasants and their toaster friends in their place? XD
    Which proves that Tyrande was right about them. They havent changed and are exactly as evil and violent as they were under Azshara and Elisande.

    Only problem that plot refuses to acknowledge it. Same as with Daelin being all around right when he predicted that Horde will never stop killing Alliance if allowed to grow.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    She was destroyed as echos of her spells appear in the Maw and within Torghast.

    I'd say she's dead and she has no place to join ranks with the Sin'dorei.
    The Sin'dorei reached out to the Nightborne people under Thalyssra, who they helped liberate from Elisande.

    Lor'themar and Liadrin would leave Elisande's "echo" to rot. They don't like her. Only Sylvanas would recruit somebody like her, but then Forsaken fans would complain.



    They didn't.

    The Horde forces involved during the WoT, were:
    Forsaken
    Orcs
    Tauren
    Trolls
    Blood Elves
    Goblins

    Nobody else was involved. Thalyssra and Lasan didn't get involved until after Lordaeron was destroyed.
    They shouldnt have being involved at all. They could have easily said that while they support the horde they dont have the troops to spare.

    Because they just had two civil wars!

    Anduin for example straight up refused to assist night elves so its not impossible to say “sorry, but i am low on units, cant help” and avoid being complicit to this shitshow.

  10. #310
    Quote Originally Posted by Terrorthatflapsinthenight View Post
    Yep the Nightborne were really portrayed as massively hypocrital and ungrateful with BFA with them basically expecting their brethren to fawn over their fooststeps after having seemingly abandonned them during the War of the Ancients and doing nothing to justify themselves, having hidden away for more than 10 millenias and helped recently the Burning Legion, joining the Horde under Sylvanas, without checking the Horde history and despite it being very difficult to not notice that she was a malevolent bitch just like Azshara and Ellisande, and being accomplices in her heinous crimes and showing no remorse for it.
    As were the Lightforged Draenei, but I suppose we have to let that slide..
    We all know that if they joined the Alliance, then you'd be like "oh well it's fine. Cry more Horde babies!"

    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    - - - Updated - - -
    They shouldnt have being involved at all. They could have easily said that while they support the horde they dont have the troops to spare.

    Because they just had two civil wars!

    Anduin for example straight up refused to assist night elves so its not impossible to say “sorry, but i am low on units, cant help” and avoid being complicit to this shitshow.
    Lightforged shouldn't have been involved either, by your logic.

    Only sending a healer or two.

    In fact, no allied race should have been involved. Defo not the Alliance ones anyway.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2021-08-14 at 12:59 PM.

  11. #311
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    Which proves that Tyrande was right about them. They havent changed and are exactly as evil and violent as they were under Azshara and Elisande.

    Only problem that plot refuses to acknowledge it. Same as with Daelin being all around right when he predicted that Horde will never stop killing Alliance if allowed to grow.
    You made a mistake, you used the words "Tyrande was right" in that order. We are talking about the woman who believed whiny bitchy malfurion howling for mercy was her real husband, or had to be lectured by a youngin defective toaster, who never really led an army in his life but somehow was better.

    Intelligence is pretty much non existent in the wow universe, but Tyrande is a grade A moron even in that setting, how she hasn't forgotten to breathe astounds me sometimes.

    Same as with Daelin being all around right when he predicted that Horde will never stop killing Alliance if allowed to grow.
    True, but it is also applicable to his own race of broken toasters and other broken titan tools, they too are genocidal stealing little pyjaks

  12. #312
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    As were the Lightforged Draenei, but I suppose we have to let that slide..



    Lightforged shouldn't have been involved either, by your logic.

    Only sending a healer or two.

    In fact, no allied race should have been involved. Defo not the Alliance ones anyway.
    Why “defo not the Alliance” btw?

    Also its unfair to compare a defending side to an attacking especially when attacking side made it clear that they are out for blood and will not stop until you are all Final Solutioned (if you know what that means).

  13. #313
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    You made a mistake, you used the words "Tyrande was right" in that order. We are talking about the woman who believed whiny bitchy malfurion howling for mercy was her real husband, or had to be lectured by a youngin defective toaster, who never really led an army in his life but somehow was better.

    Intelligence is pretty much non existent in the wow universe, but Tyrande is a grade A moron even in that setting, how she hasn't forgotten to breathe astounds me sometimes.



    True, but it is also applicable to his own race of broken toasters and other broken titan tools, they too are genocidal stealing little pyjaks
    Even Vereesa Windrunner had more sense than Tyrande and that's saying something, for Vereesa.

    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    Why “defo not the Alliance” btw?

    Also its unfair to compare a defending side to an attacking especially when attacking side made it clear that they are out for blood and will not stop until you are all Final Solutioned (if you know what that means).
    Void Elves were few and far between
    Lightforged had only just finished a 25,000 year war.

    If the Shal'dorei and Highmountain have no place in the war, then the Alliance ones defo do not.

    And I still helped the Lightforged and they're traitorous idiots, who never should have gotten help, if they were just going to join the Alliance.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2021-08-14 at 01:04 PM.

  14. #314
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    You made a mistake, you used the words "Tyrande was right" in that order. We are talking about the woman who believed whiny bitchy malfurion howling for mercy was her real husband, or had to be lectured by a youngin defective toaster, who never really led an army in his life but somehow was better.

    Intelligence is pretty much non existent in the wow universe, but Tyrande is a grade A moron even in that setting, how she hasn't forgotten to breathe astounds me sometimes.



    True, but it is also applicable to his own race of broken toasters and other broken titan tools, they too are genocidal stealing little pyjaks
    Devs using Tyrande as a scapegoat and a “assigned wrong party” in their “moral stories” only show their own incompetence.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Even Vereesa Windrunner had more sense than Tyrande and that's saying something, for Vereesa.



    Void Elves were few and far between
    Lightforged had only just finished a 25,000 year war.

    If the Shal'dorei and Highmountain have no place in the war, then the Alliance ones defo do not.
    “More sense” how?

    In whole BfA Tyrande have only pursued purely understandable and justified retribution. No matter how people try and twist it.

  15. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    Why “defo not the Alliance” btw?

    Also its unfair to compare a defending side to an attacking especially when attacking side made it clear that they are out for blood and will not stop until you are all Final Solutioned (if you know what that means).
    If you want to use this argument, then consider history, humanity or the better term "broken toasters" are an invading defective force that slaughtered natives and stole their land, continuing to do so for thousands of years. I can understand the argument what the horde does is shitty, but in the narrative itself the most important core alliance race got to its position of power, through genocide and shady backdoor deals.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    Devs using Tyrande as a scapegoat and a “assigned wrong party” in their “moral stories” only show their own incompetence.
    Tyrande was an idiot from day one, not just wow.

  16. #316
    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    If you want to use this argument, then consider history, humanity or the better terms broken toasters are an invading defective force that slaughtered natives and stole their land, continuing to do so for thousands of years. I can understand the argument what the horde does is shitty, but in the narrative itself the most important core alliance race got to its position of power, through genocide and shady backdoor deals.
    And they got there because high elves needed big, hairy, hunky dudes between them and trolls.

    Go blame the blood elves and their kind.

  17. #317
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    “More sense” how?

    In whole BfA Tyrande have only pursued purely understandable and justified retribution. No matter how people try and twist it.
    Vereesa kept her mouth shut whilst Tyrande was doing her usual, moronic thing of making enemies.

    But twice over, Tyrande's people pushed races to the opposing faction and in both instances, pushed to Sylvanas.
    (Blood Elves in the Ghostlands, Nightborne in Suramar.) At least she deserves a standing ovation for best recruitment officer for the Horde.

    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    And they got there because high elves needed big, hairy, hunky dudes between them and trolls.

    Go blame the blood elves and their kind.
    Nah, I blame night elven hostile spies who illegally invaded a neutral land and attacked the residents.

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    And they got there because high elves needed big, hairy, hunky dudes between them and trolls.

    Go blame the blood elves and their kind.
    This started long before the elves, in fact humans are older than the high elves as a race, heck maybe even the elves in general. The humans had no land on their own, each scrap of land they ever sat on was stolen from someone else.

    I can blame the elves for the continued existence of the toasters though, if they hadn't settled in QT and had beef with their green cousins, said green cousins would have kicked out the toasters from their turf.

  19. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Vereesa kept her mouth shut whilst Tyrande was doing her usual, moronic thing of making enemies.

    But twice over, Tyrande's people pushed races to the opposing faction and in both instances, pushed to Sylvanas.
    (Blood Elves in the Ghostlands, Nightborne in Suramar.) At least she deserves a standing ovation for best recruitment officer for the Horde.
    You know, perhaps Alliance is better off without a race as fickle and untrustworthy as nightborne.

    If anything, she kept Alliance from making a mistake.

    If we talking like that now.

  20. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by VladlTutushkin View Post
    You know, perhaps Alliance is better off without a race as fickle and untrustworthy as nightborne.

    If anything, she kept Alliance from making a mistake.

    If we talking like that now.
    And there we have it...it's more about wanting Nightborne in the Alliance and not being happy with the result. I am more than happy that the Shal'dorei are in the Horde. At least we've got some Night Elves who can actually fight.

    It's almost like you want the game to just purely be about the Alliance races (which it is, with the over-focus on Humans) and the Horde be an afterthought.

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