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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by lazypeon100 View Post
    I think recognizing there is a pervasive cultural problem amongst a large segment of men in the video game industry (both those who work for it simply just enjoy games) is important to acknowledge. How do you expect to work towards a solution if we don't acknowledge there's a bigger problem at large with many in the community itself that fosters this type of behavior?

    I mean, we make jokes about Call of Duty lobbies and what not, but people also joke about rape, the old "get in the kitchen woman" crap, and it's pretty well known that women in gaming are often treated poorly.

    I absolutely think the first step to fixing any of this is first acknowledging that there's a problem at large to begin with, not push it aside. "Collateral guilt" isn't a thing. Just because you're a man doesn't mean you're guilty by default or can't help change things for example.
    My honest reaction to the lobby/discord/voicecom thing is that most people treat eachothers as shit on those - especially random strangers - and that anything possible that can be used against eachother will be used against eachother. If they find out someone is a women that is then cannon fodder for them. I dont its specifically targettet against women as much as its just people using whatever they can against eachother

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    At what point did you get "past issue" when there was an investigation in the last two years that turned up the same results, and Josh also said he felt like his reports were doing nothing, meaning nothing was changing.



    *insert Anakin gif here*. You know what one.
    the I hate you one. But I don't really.
    Because he was clearly refering to Mikes entire leadership period.v

    The investigation taking place in the last two years doesnt mean the investigation was centered around things that happened in these last two yearsv

    Are you literally trying to bully me with the meme thing or? Its kinda sus.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    My honest reaction to the lobby/discord/voicecom thing is that most people treat eachothers as shit on those - especially random strangers - and that anything possible that can be used against eachother will be used against eachother. If they find out someone is a women that is then cannon fodder for them. I dont its specifically targettet against women as much as its just people using whatever they can against eachother
    i just wish more people would get this. They meme bad word dont use and then act surprised that people use it as an insult.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Chelly View Post
    Key point: "no one serious"



    Right, without giving any examples why they think it was done shoddily. All they said was that "it's false" - and you take their word for it, instead of the dozens of employees confirming it's correct?
    They actually did give some examples like poor communication and false allgeations. As for the "no one serious" part. It doesnt work like that.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    My honest reaction to the lobby/discord/voicecom thing is that most people treat eachothers as shit on those - especially random strangers - and that anything possible that can be used against eachother will be used against eachother. If they find out someone is a women that is then cannon fodder for them. I dont its specifically targettet against women as much as its just people using whatever they can against eachother
    Ah yes. Because it's never happened before that everything in a lobby is fine until someone hears a female voice. No one has ever said "I just don't feel like talking as a female on an online game".

    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    Because he was clearly refering to Mikes entire leadership period.v

    The investigation taking place in the last two years doesnt mean the investigation was centered around things that happened in these last two yearsv
    Except again, reports don't feel ignored if something was fixed.

    Are you also missing that Alex Afrasiabi was named as one of the biggest offenders and he only left Blizzard a year ago?


    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    Are you literally trying to bully me with the meme thing or? Its kinda sus.
    And totally. The response that was under Video Games's quote. That was towards Video Games.

    At what point did you think that would be directed at you...

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    Ah yes. Because it's never happened before that everything in a lobby is fine until someone hears a female voice. No one has ever said "I just don't feel like talking as a female on an online game".



    Except again, reports don't feel ignored if something was fixed.

    Are you also missing that Alex Afrasiabi was named as one of the biggest offenders and he only left Blizzard a year ago?




    And totally. The response that was under Video Games's quote. That was towards Video Games.

    At what point did you think that would be directed at you...
    They seemingly didn't "take this serious" till the investigation started. Which was when Alex quit as well.

    What's been going on FAR predates the investigation, which is the point.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    Ah yes. Because it's never happened before that everything in a lobby is fine until someone hears a female voice. No one has ever said "I just don't feel like talking as a female on an online game".



    Except again, reports don't feel ignored if something was fixed.

    Are you also missing that Alex Afrasiabi was named as one of the biggest offenders and he only left Blizzard a year ago?




    And totally. The response that was under Video Games's quote. That was towards Video Games.

    At what point did you think that would be directed at you...
    Did you have trouble understanding what i wrote?
    I literally said it was cannon fodder - and thats not good. But i dont think its BECAUSE they are female for the most part - as much as i think its because those kind of places are inherently toxic and people will use anything they can against eachother.

    I'm honestly not sure what you mean by the 2nd paragraph. I'm not sure how those two things chance anything i said.

    As for the last part - well since entire thing was about me

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    They seemingly didn't "take this serious" till the investigation started. Which was when Alex quit as well.

    What's been going on FAR predates the investigation, which is the point.
    I don't know about you, but June 2020 isn't 2 years ago.

    https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Alex_Afrasiabi

    And yes, it obviously predates the investigation. But it was also going on during the investigation is the point.

  8. #208
    Weeb Queen Video Games's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    Are you literally trying to bully me with the meme thing or? Its kinda sus.
    I thought boys liked getting bullied? There's been a couple animes about it

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    The problem is making this a gender issue to start with. It used to be race issues now its gender issues.v

    These things are much easier to sort if americans would stop pointing fingers and putting people into boxes of collateral guilt
    What are you even talking about?
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Except he is literally pretending it didnt happen by saying "if i had known i would have done something!" except he did know, for a long time, and he didnt do anything, so he is literally pretending it did not happen, stop trying to suck off mike.
    Thats a hot take.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    You think that is it? Get ready to choke on that popcorn cause fucking. https://twitter.com/devolore/status/...223285760?s=20

    - - - Updated - - -



    And yet.... https://twitter.com/devolore/status/...223285760?s=20

    Fuck..../chocking on the popcorn. This shit is wild.
    People on this thread only get pissed at you when you don't agree with them...FACT

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    Did you have trouble understanding what i wrote?
    I literally said it was cannon fodder - and thats not good. But i dont think its BECAUSE they are female for the most part - as much as i think its because those kind of places are inherently toxic and people will use anything they can against eachother.
    how do you ask if I've having trouble understanding what you wrote, when you're literally ignoring what I said.

    Your "example" was saying "well lobbies are always toxic". To which I pointed out you could even have a normal lobby that just freaks out the moment they hear a female voice.

    Again, sticking your head in the sand about it doesn't change that.

    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    I'm honestly not sure what you mean by the 2nd paragraph. I'm not sure how those two things chance anything i said.
    Because obviously it was still ongoing if one of the biggest culprits was still there.

    Quote Originally Posted by ClassicPeon View Post
    As for the last part - well since entire thing was about me
    Except what was typed was literally right under a quote of Video Games.

    Although a bit ironic considering the situation that you would somehow try to make it about you.

  13. #213
    ThE OlD GuArD AnD OLd BlIzZaRd WaS PeRfEcTiOn!


    Seems myths are being challenged in real time here.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Chelly View Post
    This comment has a bunch of them linked.
    https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comment..._frat/h62n78j/

    And it's not even up-to-date.
    I've read many of the tweets from this list, and the other tweets from the posters on this subject. Many of the posts mentioned that overall they were content working at Blizzard, and in particular to read that from an ex developer who, as evident from her profile, is something many posters on MMO would angrily call ''super woke''. She worked there for 10+ years.

    I was never a Blizzard fan, I was always a WoW fan, and never quite considered the 'Old Blizzard' as a construct. Granted, I never really gave it much thought, but I always separated the developers and community managers (back in the day, even game masters) as the true working class in the company. From the part of the lawsuit about frat boy culture and cubicle visits, I can't get the right picture on how much of this was happening among the workers who I've described above as a true working class. IMHO, I think the brunt of this was occurring in the ''upper echelons'', firstly because of the timeframe, the general attitude and awareness before metoo and situations like those and also, because harassment in big companies almost always comes from top to below, no matter it's nature.

    I was always disgusted about the upper management, across all companies. But I sympathized with the 'so called 'lower workers'', who actually do the majority of the intended work. The same situation is with Blizzard and it's developers. I think the majority is good people, tho I do suspect there has been inappropriate behavior there as well. I work for a public, city owned company, and the uppers are notoriously infamous for their greed, corruption, nepotism and lack of actual skills for the job they were heavily paid for. But majority of my coworkers and me, we were on the ''front line'' for the citizens, trying to do our best job, helping and advising people. And we were the ones who took most of the hate and resentment for the actions of our superiors. In reality, we were just ''regular'' citizens, trying to earn for a living and being honest. We have a big chain of supermarkets, who's boss was the richest man in the country, but corrupted as well, he is now in exile to avoid prosecution. The amount of time I've seen people yelling and being rude to cashiers (almost 100% woman) was staggering - as if the action of that man were in any way their fault, those cashiers live on a small salary and often fall of their feet from the overwork and the amount of stuff they need to do other then just keeping till check.

    My point is, while I am contemplating leaving WoW for time being, part of me feels like ''punishing'' them will just go on the backs of the ''average worker'' in Blizzard, as is the case in my, and I suspect many more countries when boycotts are included. Since I still like the game, a part of me also thinks I am giving myself excuses to keep playing. But too many companies have issues like this, and I am not seeing Amazon taking a dip in their business.

    So what do you think would be the best course of action?

  15. #215
    Weeb Queen Video Games's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamais View Post
    I've read many of the tweets from this list, and the other tweets from the posters on this subject. Many of the posts mentioned that overall they were content working at Blizzard, and in particular to read that from an ex developer who, as evident from her profile, is something many posters on MMO would angrily call ''super woke''. She worked there for 10+ years.

    I was never a Blizzard fan, I was always a WoW fan, and never quite considered the 'Old Blizzard' as a construct. Granted, I never really gave it much thought, but I always separated the developers and community managers (back in the day, even game masters) as the true working class in the company. From the part of the lawsuit about frat boy culture and cubicle visits, I can't get the right picture on how much of this was happening among the workers who I've described above as a true working class. IMHO, I think the brunt of this was occurring in the ''upper echelons'', firstly because of the timeframe, the general attitude and awareness before metoo and situations like those and also, because harassment in big companies almost always comes from top to below, no matter it's nature.

    I was always disgusted about the upper management, across all companies. But I sympathized with the 'so called 'lower workers'', who actually do the majority of the intended work. The same situation is with Blizzard and it's developers. I think the majority is good people, tho I do suspect there has been inappropriate behavior there as well. I work for a public, city owned company, and the uppers are notoriously infamous for their greed, corruption, nepotism and lack of actual skills for the job they were heavily paid for. But majority of my coworkers and me, we were on the ''front line'' for the citizens, trying to do our best job, helping and advising people. And we were the ones who took most of the hate and resentment for the actions of our superiors. In reality, we were just ''regular'' citizens, trying to earn for a living and being honest. We have a big chain of supermarkets, who's boss was the richest man in the country, but corrupted as well, he is now in exile to avoid prosecution. The amount of time I've seen people yelling and being rude to cashiers (almost 100% woman) was staggering - as if the action of that man were in any way their fault, those cashiers live on a small salary and often fall of their feet from the overwork and the amount of stuff they need to do other then just keeping till check.

    My point is, while I am contemplating leaving WoW for time being, part of me feels like ''punishing'' them will just go on the backs of the ''average worker'' in Blizzard, as is the case in my, and I suspect many more countries when boycotts are included. Since I still like the game, a part of me also thinks I am giving myself excuses to keep playing. But too many companies have issues like this, and I am not seeing Amazon taking a dip in their business.

    So what do you think would be the best course of action?
    Stop being soft and stop giving companies money if you don't want to. It's that easy

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Rngmonster The God View Post
    And you still believe you would know EVERYTHING in a company of that size ? Really ?
    If I was the CEO of a major gaming company and my employees were doing absolutely revolting things... yes, I'd know what was going on that company.

    You Blizzard fanboy apologsts are forgetting that this isn't some random employee disconnected to the rest of the organization. IT. WAS. HIS. COMPANY.

  17. #217
    Legendary! Logwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ablib View Post
    Not sure how Cher Scarlett's response means Morhaime is a liar. She didn't state who reprimanded her for cc'ing the CEO. It's also highly unlikely he read the email.

    So....what her take on it looks like, is she emails the CEO on a matter, and some low level scrub manager, slaps her wrist for "ZOMG, you just sent that to the CEO?!?!?"

    That's what it reads like anyways. She's free to clarify the record.

    "Attitude reflects leadership". If the people at the top promote a company culture that promotes certain behavior they are as at fault as those below. If they do not know what is going on below them then they are not effective leaders. IMHO do not deserve their millions of dollar salaries and deserve jail time if approbriate.

  18. #218
    The Insane Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    ** EDIT **

    At the current point in the thread the following was just posted from Lore, which outright states that Morhaime knew.


    - Source

    I'm leaving what was below (albeit stricken out to show that is no longer my belief) because I believe it's important to own your past positions.
    Figured something like this would come out shortly.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  19. #219
    Legendary! Logwyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rngmonster The God View Post
    Yeah since you can obviously trust anyone instantly in such cases.. gosh you are such a whiny man..



    And you still believe you would know EVERYTHING in a company of that size ? Really ? What an absolutely bullshit comment to make.
    That's why they make millions of dollars. To know these things and fix them and to keep them from happening.

  20. #220
    If these accusations are real, Blizzard is getting what they deserve. If these accusations are false, Blizzard is getting what they deserve because now they know what it's like to get in a world of sh** based on false accusations like they did to Quinton Flynn.

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