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  1. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by Jamais View Post
    I've read many of the tweets from this list, and the other tweets from the posters on this subject. Many of the posts mentioned that overall they were content working at Blizzard, and in particular to read that from an ex developer who, as evident from her profile, is something many posters on MMO would angrily call ''super woke''. She worked there for 10+ years.

    I was never a Blizzard fan, I was always a WoW fan, and never quite considered the 'Old Blizzard' as a construct. Granted, I never really gave it much thought, but I always separated the developers and community managers (back in the day, even game masters) as the true working class in the company. From the part of the lawsuit about frat boy culture and cubicle visits, I can't get the right picture on how much of this was happening among the workers who I've described above as a true working class. IMHO, I think the brunt of this was occurring in the ''upper echelons'', firstly because of the timeframe, the general attitude and awareness before metoo and situations like those and also, because harassment in big companies almost always comes from top to below, no matter it's nature.

    I was always disgusted about the upper management, across all companies. But I sympathized with the 'so called 'lower workers'', who actually do the majority of the intended work. The same situation is with Blizzard and it's developers. I think the majority is good people, tho I do suspect there has been inappropriate behavior there as well. I work for a public, city owned company, and the uppers are notoriously infamous for their greed, corruption, nepotism and lack of actual skills for the job they were heavily paid for. But majority of my coworkers and me, we were on the ''front line'' for the citizens, trying to do our best job, helping and advising people. And we were the ones who took most of the hate and resentment for the actions of our superiors. In reality, we were just ''regular'' citizens, trying to earn for a living and being honest. We have a big chain of supermarkets, who's boss was the richest man in the country, but corrupted as well, he is now in exile to avoid prosecution. The amount of time I've seen people yelling and being rude to cashiers (almost 100% woman) was staggering - as if the action of that man were in any way their fault, those cashiers live on a small salary and often fall of their feet from the overwork and the amount of stuff they need to do other then just keeping till check.

    My point is, while I am contemplating leaving WoW for time being, part of me feels like ''punishing'' them will just go on the backs of the ''average worker'' in Blizzard, as is the case in my, and I suspect many more countries when boycotts are included. Since I still like the game, a part of me also thinks I am giving myself excuses to keep playing. But too many companies have issues like this, and I am not seeing Amazon taking a dip in their business.

    So what do you think would be the best course of action?
    There is no right answer so something you need to figure out yourself.

    Of the names i have seen being mentioned doing the actuall harassment most of them are no longer at Blizzard, but im sure there are still idiots there, you can never get ride of all but that goes for every workplace, but im also sure its a safer and better place to work at after all this came out then before.

  2. #222
    "real people have been harmed, and some women had terrible experiences."

    based mike insinuating women arent people :^)

  3. #223
    Quote Originally Posted by Logwyn View Post
    That's why they make millions of dollars. To know these things and fix them and to keep them from happening.
    No, the old leadership got millions because they founded the company and were hugely successful. But anyone that came after that should have earned their money by knowing those things.

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Alamhaoingaturlife View Post
    "real people have been harmed, and some women had terrible experiences."

    based mike insinuating women arent people :^)
    As funny as it is to joke on, I do think that should be given the benefit of the doubt as bad sentence structure.

  5. #225
    i am going to say i am cautiously optimistic about Mike here. i am going to take the opinion that he was kept in the dark about a lot of things. he also seems to not be named in the lawsuit.

    also i dont trust Lore at all. i have to look into something that caught my attention on the official forums.

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    Do you realize that the whole lawsuit is about what was happening when Mike Morehaime was at helm of the company? A guy heading the company for 28 years did not know what was going on? Really? You believe that?

    Even Lore called out his bullshit straight out.

    https://twitter.com/devolore
    Lmao. According to that tweet it also means Lore knew about it aswell.

    Look at what Cher is saying to him now.

    https://twitter.com/cherthedev/statu...16459925868548

    These guys are trying to eat each other now so they prove themselves innocent before it's too late.

  7. #227
    Can I just point out how all this corporate woke bullshit that Blizzard has gleefully lead the vanguard in during the past couple of years was nothing but pandering and lecturing to the customer, nothing of it was a sincere human idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Lmao. According to that tweet it also means Lore knew about it aswell.

    Look at what Cher is saying to him now.

    https://twitter.com/cherthedev/statu...16459925868548
    With his fucking pronouns in the bio.

    It's vacuous bullshit. All of it.

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Lmao. According to that tweet it also means Lore knew about it aswell.

    Look at what Cher is saying to him now.

    https://twitter.com/cherthedev/statu...16459925868548

    These guys are trying to eat each other now so they prove themselves innocent before it's too late.
    What are you even on about.

    She clearly says she was under the impression from something she was told.

    And Lore literally said right after what you posted that he knew and reported everything he saw.
    https://twitter.com/devolore/status/1418870901999902723

    Don't try twisting that around.

  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldielocks View Post
    I mean he clearly states that he failed them. Even if he knew or not, it was his job to know. Either he was a bad person or a bad president. Not good.

    This response is better than others I’ve seen, but it doesn’t really matter anyways. People are out for blood. He can show a picture of himself deep bowing with his forehead touching the floor and someone would say “not enough.”
    If he knew about it and did nothing to stop it, or worse enabled retribution against the accusers, then it doesn't matter how low he bows or how contrite he can be or what type of "champion" he could be going forward. I would be that someone who would say it was not enough.

    That said, very few stories have only one side, which is one of the reasons we have courts. I'm not going to sit here and cast judgement on him. My hope is that whoever is guilty in this ordeal will be found out and punished accordingly.

    "Take the time to sit down and talk with your adversaries. You will learn something, and they will learn something from you. When two enemies are talking, they are not fighting. It's when the talking ceases that the ground becomes fertile for violence. So keep the conversation going."
    ~ Daryl Davis

  10. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivarr View Post
    Can I just point out how all this corporate woke bullshit that Blizzard has gleefully lead the vanguard in during the past couple of years was nothing but pandering and lecturing to the customer, nothing of it was a sincere human idea.
    I feel so fucking nice knowing it was all bullshit from the get go. It literally all started after the Blitzchung controversy. All the fucking pandering. They were just trying to save face.
    It was too damn obvious.

  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivarr View Post
    With his fucking pronouns in the bio.

    It's vacuous bullshit. All of it.
    Again, he literally said he reported anything he saw. Is he perfect, no. But acting like he's suddenly the culprit is just trying to twist the situation around.

  12. #232
    If everybody knew, and it was so wide spread, it shouldnt be to hard to show some hard evidence. Words are nice and all but dont matter

  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    If everybody knew, and it was so wide spread, it shouldnt be to hard to show some hard evidence. Words are nice and all but dont matter
    I mean, that's literally what testifying is about and witnesses. That's called evidence.

  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    What are you even on about.

    She clearly says she was under the impression from something she was told.

    And Lore literally said right after what you posted that he knew and reported everything he saw.
    https://twitter.com/devolore/status/1418870901999902723

    Don't try twisting that around.
    Twisting? Against who? It seems to me like Mike knew about it. Lore knew about and while he did report it, he didn't report it to the right people.

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    If everybody knew, and it was so wide spread, it shouldnt be to hard to show some hard evidence. Words are nice and all but dont matter
    Yeah and since they are being sued im sure the hard evidence is saved for the court room.

  16. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Twisting? Against who? It seems to me like Mike knew about it. Lore knew about and while he did report it, he didn't report it to the right people.
    Except that wraps back right into what this case is about.

    If you read the court case, they literally list off that the employees felt as if HR was useless, that no reports were ever handled, etc.

    You can't report it to the right people if the right people don't exist.

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Twisting? Against who? It seems to me like Mike knew about it. Lore knew about and while he did report it, he didn't report it to the right people.
    who else is he supposed to report it to? like, it's pretty obvious this is a problem with the management at nearly every level.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    I mean, that's literally what testifying is about and witnesses. That's called evidence.
    Testifying in court maybe. However even that isnt enough to convict someone of such a serious crime. All the current stuff? has no weight

  19. #239
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    Again, he literally said he reported anything he saw. Is he perfect, no. But acting like he's suddenly the culprit is just trying to twist the situation around.
    Not my intention of pointing him as a culprit. That would be shooting the messenger. I'm glad that people like him are now airing the dirty laundry.

  20. #240
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    Except that wraps back right into what this case is about.

    If you read the court case, they literally list off that the employees felt as if HR was useless, that no reports were ever handled, etc.

    You can't report it to the right people if the right people don't exist.
    Quote Originally Posted by uuuhname View Post
    who else is he supposed to report it to? like, it's pretty obvious this is a problem with the management at nearly every level.
    Someone on the outside. Kotaku, Polygon, IGN, Jason Schreier, idk. He used to be a big wow youtuber iirc. Someone would've listened.

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