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  1. #721
    The ideas that a) you should give the game a chance beyond ARR and b) putting in dozens of hours into the game is enough to form an opinion can BOTH be true. People are free to like and dislike the things they want. They may not have a fully formed opinion yet, or they may be biased for it. It doesn't matter because someone else's opinion doesn't take away from yours. Anyways, that's my 2 gil.

  2. #722
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittahsmash View Post
    So what is your top 50 better stories than xiv list?
    I'd have to dig into my entire library of rpg/adventure games I've played since the GBA and N64 days. The number was quickly pulled out of my head. I first typed top 10 but quickly realized that was off, even top 30, so to stay safe I chose with 50 games or so I've played with a better story that FFXIV.

    Could be a little more or less but as I said already the story is very shounen like. The way they save some characters from death or how the chosen hero just prevails with sheer willpower and friendship is like some Naruto or Fairytale anime arc.
    The wise wolf who's pride is her wisdom isn't so sharp as drunk.

  3. #723
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    There's also the issue of outcomes needing to fit certain profiles. "We" can't be hurt or killed or otherwise taken out of the game, for instance.
    While I agree with your reply in general, this one seemed like an oddball. How many games let you be hurt/killed/taken out of the game in any meaningful manner?

    There are those games where that is part of the gameplay loop (and as such do not really influence how you feel about the story), and maybe a few games where the ending/near end of the story uses that.

  4. #724
    Quote Originally Posted by Geisl View Post

    Things I don't like:

    - Not sure yet since I've only tried it for about a week or so but probably the biggest barrier to me before was the 'anime/asian-esque aesthetic' although the more I play it and maybe because the characters voice acting and lines are ye'Olde English at times the aesthetic isn't bothering me as much anymore - I am actually cool with it now.
    After ARR all the voice actors change because they moved the voice studio to England from USA. And they are a lot better aswell.

  5. #725
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Consider the end of ARR for example. You're in handcuffs, surrounded by guards, accused of regicide, but did you ever ask, "Oh, what's going to happen to me next?"

    Of course not, you know it's just a cutscene and in a couple minutes you'll be standing at the next quest turn-in and be free to just stop what you're doing and do a leveling roulette or work on your Culinarian.
    I mean feel free to admit you can't be bothered to be sucked into a story but let's stop pretending just being a cynical jaded person about everything is the default state.

    Yeah, can we not gatekeep opinions?

    People are fucking allowed to not like something. You guys constantly coming out of the woodwork to tell them that they're somehow "wrong" about it are being extremely ill-mannered.
    You can have an opinion about anything, and people can dismiss the opinion when its one based on ignorance. You can proudly declare the world that you know for a fact that the Earth is flat and congratulations you sure have an opinion there buddy. But factually you are just wrong and you don't even understand the topic you're talking about.

    Do we have to have this conversation every time a new person stops like 30% way through the game and declares the entire thing bad? Yeah sure your opinion is that you didn't have a good time, congratulations go play another game then. But don't sit there and start making blanket statements about the game if you haven't done even half of anything significant yet -- especially if you haven't even touched the stuff people repeatedly talked about loving the most.

    Enjoy believing the Earth is flat, but stop telling people who are responding to those saying it by going, "No, it's not, you're just factually wrong" that they're just big ole meanies who are gatekeeping opinions.

    @CalamityHeart nailed it better than I could, and more succinctly, with their post:

    There's honest, earnest discussion about what you think are your game's good points, and then there's being an asshole. Learn the difference. Don't be an asshole.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absintheminded View Post
    The ideas that a) you should give the game a chance beyond ARR and b) putting in dozens of hours into the game is enough to form an opinion can BOTH be true. People are free to like and dislike the things they want. They may not have a fully formed opinion yet, or they may be biased for it. It doesn't matter because someone else's opinion doesn't take away from yours. Anyways, that's my 2 gil.
    Agreed 100% and people in this thread are missing the point here.

    People can have a totally valid experience and say, "Yeah I got to level 40 and it wasn't for me, so I quit." Cool, the game isn't for everyone. I know several people who tried it out and couldn't make it out of ARR and just moved on.

    But if you're going to then follow that up by saying, "The story of FFXIV is bad, overrated, and its gameplay is shit" people are going to rightfully call you out on your bullshit because you're now making statements based wholly in ignorance having not played the majority of the content.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 04:05 AM.

  6. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    I guess it depends on how you view some of the story elements. You are mostly correct in that the protagonist of a game isn't likely to actually be killed off over the course of the story. There are some cases in single player games where the protagonist might die or be replaced, though.

    As for "taken out of the game"...In an MMO people expect to always be "free" in a manner of speaking. They expect the world to always be accessible, their stuff to always be there, to be able to drop what they're doing at any moment and do something else, etc. That's why there can't be consequence to a lot of the story elements. In a single player game, you might be grabbed and thrown in jail, have your stuff all taken away, and have an entire chapter of the story where you're cut off from the rest of the world.

    Consider the end of ARR for example. You're in handcuffs, surrounded by guards, accused of regicide, but did you ever ask, "Oh, what's going to happen to me next?"

    Of course not, you know it's just a cutscene and in a couple minutes you'll be standing at the next quest turn-in and be free to just stop what you're doing and do a leveling roulette or work on your Culinarian.
    They actually DID have stuff about this pre heavensward.

    Like if you go to the Weavers guild in Ul Dah they'd say hpw they don't buy the idea you did evil crap for a second.

    Most Ul dahns know there systems corrupt as fuck so they are looking the other way/not reporting you(and most "guards" are mercenaries that likely know not to f with you). The other cities leaders assume you are innocent given what they know of you and Ul Dahs whole corrupt shadow leaders thing

  7. #727
    this topic basically invites people to say what they THINK is good / bad about ff14 right? must everyone like it? must everyone think the story is good? of course not...

    and people saying you have to play trough the whole story to have a valid opinion if you like it or not is like saying i should marry someone i went on a date with a few times to truly see if i like them or not. MY ENJOYMENT of ff14 during those month and a half i played it was mediocre, taking in its pros and cons....MY EXPERIENCE was not one of continuous fun and passion and motivation to go further due to the relation of pros and cons I PERCIEVE.

    how can anyone try to tell me i should be enjoying something if i am not? and i can onl share my experience here, what i think is good and what i think is bad, and its has the same validity as your totally positive one. its all just personal experiences here, nothing more, nothing less.
    Last edited by srambo; 2021-08-30 at 05:16 AM.

  8. #728
    If people don't like it, they don't like it. Just let them fucking not like it and move on.
    If you don't like it and want to move on, you're not repeatedly barfing out the same goddamn ignorant attack lines on threads about the game.

    Ill-informed or ignorant opinions are a thing. Just because you have an opinion about something doesn't mean your opinion is valid.

    I've already exactly explained this in my comment that you flatout ignored, but somebody can say, "I didn't like X job because it felt slow." That's a valid opinion and experience to have. However if you follow up with that by dismissing the job and declaring that it's just slow in and of itself, when people are flatout telling you that it turns into something that IS not that? That is not a valid opinion to have.

    Be mad that I accurately compared people declaring an entire game bad after playing 15% of it to idiots thinking the world is flat, I guess. It's the exact same kind of arrogant ignorance.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 10:56 AM.

  9. #729
    What i like about the game is that you can create a character that acts as your avatar in the game and you experience his/her life.

  10. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drindorai View Post
    If you don't like it and want to move on, you're not repeatedly barfing out the same goddamn ignorant attack lines on threads about the game.

    Ill-informed or ignorant opinions are a thing. Just because you have an opinion about something doesn't mean your opinion is valid.

    I've already exactly explained this in my comment that you flatout ignored, but somebody can say, "I didn't like X job because it felt slow." That's a valid opinion and experience to have. However if you follow up with that by dismissing the job and declaring that it's just slow in and of itself, when people are flatout telling you that it turns into something that IS not that? That is not a valid opinion to have.

    Be mad that I accurately compared people declaring an entire game bad after playing 15% of it to idiots thinking the world is flat, I guess. It's the exact same kind of arrogant ignorance.
    Surely that can be the same way for you? You can’t say a game is good until you have finished literally everything. That 0.1% of content you missed might be the pieces that makes you hate the entire game. You don’t know, so your opinion is invalid…. Going by your logic that is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drindorai View Post
    No...sorry, not everything is black and white like y'all keep trying to pretend.

    If someone says the story is bad and hasn't even finished ARR, their opinion is invalid.

    If someone says that a job is bad but hasn't gotten to the current maximum level to see how it plays, their opinion is invalid.

    It would be like someone playing a Mage on WoW and getting to level 30 and complaining the class is slow because they are missing 60% of their abilities.

    Nobody is talking about cutting edge gameplay at the highest end or plot you need to buy a book to find.
    The story is bad, that was my opinion in the first 10 minutes, after the first 30 minutes, after the first hour and after I finished it.

    You can’t say it’s good, you didn’t finish the entire game. So your opinion is just as invalid.

    So if someone doesn’t finish something, their reason and opinion as to why they didn’t finish it is invalid?

    God what stupid logic to hold.

    I guarantee you won’t be saying the same if the person said it was good half way through, as going by your logic, that person is also wrong. But we won’t talk about that.

  11. #731
    The story is bad, that was my opinion in the first 10 minutes, after the first 30 minutes, after the first hour and after I finished it.
    Cool. Great. Do you have any actual specifics explaining why that you'd like to mention? Or are you just interested in being a contrarian. What the story failed at? Or are you going to just trot out the same lazy, 'ITS BAD ANIME WRITING' 'argument' that people who didn't actually even play the game make because they're mad that another game is popular and not the one they like.

    You can’t say it’s good, you didn’t finish the entire game. So your opinion is just as invalid.
    For a story, you absolutely can say that if you didn't finish the story, your opinion on its quality is worthless lol. And I like how you continue to pretend this is a black and white issue.

    So if someone doesn’t finish something, their reason and opinion as to why they didn’t finish it is invalid?
    Moving the goalposts again I see.

    I guarantee you won’t be saying the same if the person said it was good half way through, as going by your logic, that person is also wrong. But we won’t talk about that.
    We won't because engaging in hypothetical gotchas are something people with no actual point to resort to use to strawman somebody.

    If you want to mindlessly bitch like a 12 year old there's another thread for that.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 11:40 AM.

  12. #732
    Quote Originally Posted by Soikona View Post
    Surely that can be the same way for you? You can’t say a game is good until you have finished literally everything. That 0.1% of content you missed might be the pieces that makes you hate the entire game. You don’t know, so your opinion is invalid…. Going by your logic that is.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The story is bad, that was my opinion in the first 10 minutes, after the first 30 minutes, after the first hour and after I finished it.

    You can’t say it’s good, you didn’t finish the entire game. So your opinion is just as invalid.

    So if someone doesn’t finish something, their reason and opinion as to why they didn’t finish it is invalid?

    God what stupid logic to hold.

    I guarantee you won’t be saying the same if the person said it was good half way through, as going by your logic, that person is also wrong. But we won’t talk about that.
    You want people to take your opinion seriously when you haven't actually experienced the story. Thats like opening a book, reading the first page and saying "well its bad" and being done with it. This goes above an opinion because you are phrasing it as a fact rather than an opinion. Second you didn't finish the story in an hour and a half, you are hyperboling to try and give the illusion of a bad opinion, i do not see how you are any different than Quinn. Had you said you weren't interested in the story than no one would likely care but you intentionally phrased it the way you did to get a reaction out of people who enjoy the story.

    To further drive this point home, i do not know a single game that i could tell the story was good within the first hour of gameplay even TLOU(not to be confused with TLOU2) i couldn't tell how great the story was until i completed it. If you know a game that could tell its story in first 10, 30, or 1 hour i am all ears because the shortest game ive ever played with a good story was undertale and that took over 4 hours.

    Edit: I want to be perfectly clear, no one here cares if you personally dislike the game and do not want to play it(hell prolly a good thing for both you and the community that you aren't a part of it) but for people that are on the fence about it you shouldn't be spreading a narrative that "the story is bad" when you haven't even went through the basic tutorial levels lt alone know what the story is.
    Last edited by Malix Farwin; 2021-08-30 at 12:04 PM.

  13. #733
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    Last edited by srambo; 2021-08-30 at 12:04 PM.

  14. #734
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    This isnt the story, this is MMO fetch quests.

    Edit: and quite literally everyone said the story doesnt really start till the 40s, before than its your typical mmo start.
    Last edited by Malix Farwin; 2021-08-30 at 12:07 PM.

  15. #735
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    It's impressive you typed this many words and still didn't really say anything.

    "This is cheesy" over and over again which quickly devolves into, "THIS IS JUST ANIME" means nothing. What was cheesy? What specific part? What character? What storyline? What part of the game are you talking about?

    Because it it really seems like you're speaking about ARR and not the rest of the entire game lol

    Posts like this are why I have a hard time believing you even played a single second of the game, it's so filled with nonsensical bullshit vague enough to pretend to be some kind of authoritative statement that nobody can even tell what the hell you're talking about.

    Especially funny because after giving zero specifics about anything, you're then just insulting everybody that likes it by implying that you're like some savant level above everyone else because the game didn't impress you like it did the rabble. Nothing like patting yourself on the back while you insult a large swath of people.

    Use a spoiler tag if you have to, but just because I'm curious, specifically tell me what part of the story you actually got to. What the characters were doing, where, when, and who was involved.

    If you're curious of my reasoning, it's because, frankly, I think you're just lying. The only part of the game I can even feasibly understand the complaints (As vague as they were) that you laid out here are either like level 20 quests or some parts of the ARR patch content that everybody universally agrees isn't great. Which, again, goes back to the conversation of you can dislike something but stop pretending you are any authority on the story as a whole when you've seen about 35% of it.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:13 PM.

  16. #736
    Quote Originally Posted by Malix Farwin View Post
    This isnt the story, this is MMO fetch quests.

    Edit: and quite literally everyone said the story doesnt really start till the 40s, before than its your typical mmo start.
    no, that is how the story in ff14 is delivered. a good word to describe it would be TEDIOUS.

    and i got to level 64 and there i was sure the story is just a steamy pile of turds (in my modest opinion ofc lul)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Drindorai View Post
    It's impressive you typed this many words and still didn't really say anything.

    "This is cheesy" over and over again which quickly devolves into, "THIS IS JUST ANIME" means nothing. What was cheesy? What specific part? What character? What storyline? What part of the game are you talking about?

    Because it it really seems like you're speaking about ARR and not the rest of the entire game lol

    Posts like this are why I have a hard time believing you even played a single second of the game, it's so filled with nonsensical bullshit vague enough to pretend to be some kind of authoritative statement that nobody can even tell what the hell you're talking about.
    ok, then you tell me what makes the story so good? show me how its done im all ears

  17. #737
    and i got to level 64 and there i was sure the story is just a steamy pile of turds (in my modest opinion ofc lul)
    What was the story at that level. What were you doing, where, with whom, and why? Specifics please.

    Because unless you were massively overleveled for the MSQ, I am quite aware around what part of the story you were at at level 64 and it's in a part of Stormblood that is pretty universally liked even for other parts of that expansion that drag on or are not as good.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:16 PM.

  18. #738
    no please, you tell me whats so good about the story....why do you think its any good at all? and why do you think its really good? specifics please...show me how its done....type your own review that i will use as a template so i can follow it in my own review then ok?

  19. #739
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ok, then you tell me what makes the story so good? show me how its done im all ears
    I can give you specifics why I like a story or not, but that's not the conversation here. The conversation is throwing out buzzwords and vague generalities and then dismissing something without actually explaining it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    no please, you tell me whats so good about the story....why do you think its any good at all? and why do you think its really ghood? specifics please...show me how its done
    No, sorry, that's not how it's going to go.

    Especially now based on your reaction, I think you're just flatout lying.

    Tell me what you were doing at level 64 in the story. Where were you at, with what characters, what were you doing, and why were you doing it?

    You can dislike the story all you want. You can find 100% of the story cheesy if you want, although I'd begin questioning your ability to analyze everything if you can't discern any nuance in anything and consider everything all cheesy, but if you're going to show up and start making broad statements, I'm interested in why you think something is cheesy, not just that you do.

    The fact that you devolved into just calling the game "anime" already pretty much tells me what you were going for with that post, but I'd love to hear your thought process on literally a single storyline as to why it was cheesy.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:21 PM.

  20. #740
    nice dodge sonny....cya

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