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  1. #721
    The story is bad, that was my opinion in the first 10 minutes, after the first 30 minutes, after the first hour and after I finished it.
    Cool. Great. Do you have any actual specifics explaining why that you'd like to mention? Or are you just interested in being a contrarian. What the story failed at? Or are you going to just trot out the same lazy, 'ITS BAD ANIME WRITING' 'argument' that people who didn't actually even play the game make because they're mad that another game is popular and not the one they like.

    You can’t say it’s good, you didn’t finish the entire game. So your opinion is just as invalid.
    For a story, you absolutely can say that if you didn't finish the story, your opinion on its quality is worthless lol. And I like how you continue to pretend this is a black and white issue.

    So if someone doesn’t finish something, their reason and opinion as to why they didn’t finish it is invalid?
    Moving the goalposts again I see.

    I guarantee you won’t be saying the same if the person said it was good half way through, as going by your logic, that person is also wrong. But we won’t talk about that.
    We won't because engaging in hypothetical gotchas are something people with no actual point to resort to use to strawman somebody.

    If you want to mindlessly bitch like a 12 year old there's another thread for that.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 11:40 AM.

  2. #722
    Quote Originally Posted by Soikona View Post
    Surely that can be the same way for you? You can’t say a game is good until you have finished literally everything. That 0.1% of content you missed might be the pieces that makes you hate the entire game. You don’t know, so your opinion is invalid…. Going by your logic that is.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The story is bad, that was my opinion in the first 10 minutes, after the first 30 minutes, after the first hour and after I finished it.

    You can’t say it’s good, you didn’t finish the entire game. So your opinion is just as invalid.

    So if someone doesn’t finish something, their reason and opinion as to why they didn’t finish it is invalid?

    God what stupid logic to hold.

    I guarantee you won’t be saying the same if the person said it was good half way through, as going by your logic, that person is also wrong. But we won’t talk about that.
    You want people to take your opinion seriously when you haven't actually experienced the story. Thats like opening a book, reading the first page and saying "well its bad" and being done with it. This goes above an opinion because you are phrasing it as a fact rather than an opinion. Second you didn't finish the story in an hour and a half, you are hyperboling to try and give the illusion of a bad opinion, i do not see how you are any different than Quinn. Had you said you weren't interested in the story than no one would likely care but you intentionally phrased it the way you did to get a reaction out of people who enjoy the story.

    To further drive this point home, i do not know a single game that i could tell the story was good within the first hour of gameplay even TLOU(not to be confused with TLOU2) i couldn't tell how great the story was until i completed it. If you know a game that could tell its story in first 10, 30, or 1 hour i am all ears because the shortest game ive ever played with a good story was undertale and that took over 4 hours.

    Edit: I want to be perfectly clear, no one here cares if you personally dislike the game and do not want to play it(hell prolly a good thing for both you and the community that you aren't a part of it) but for people that are on the fence about it you shouldn't be spreading a narrative that "the story is bad" when you haven't even went through the basic tutorial levels lt alone know what the story is.
    Last edited by Malix Farwin; 2021-08-30 at 12:04 PM.

  3. #723
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    Last edited by srambo; 2021-08-30 at 12:04 PM.

  4. #724
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    This isnt the story, this is MMO fetch quests.

    Edit: and quite literally everyone said the story doesnt really start till the 40s, before than its your typical mmo start.
    Last edited by Malix Farwin; 2021-08-30 at 12:07 PM.

  5. #725
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    It's impressive you typed this many words and still didn't really say anything.

    "This is cheesy" over and over again which quickly devolves into, "THIS IS JUST ANIME" means nothing. What was cheesy? What specific part? What character? What storyline? What part of the game are you talking about?

    Because it it really seems like you're speaking about ARR and not the rest of the entire game lol

    Posts like this are why I have a hard time believing you even played a single second of the game, it's so filled with nonsensical bullshit vague enough to pretend to be some kind of authoritative statement that nobody can even tell what the hell you're talking about.

    Especially funny because after giving zero specifics about anything, you're then just insulting everybody that likes it by implying that you're like some savant level above everyone else because the game didn't impress you like it did the rabble. Nothing like patting yourself on the back while you insult a large swath of people.

    Use a spoiler tag if you have to, but just because I'm curious, specifically tell me what part of the story you actually got to. What the characters were doing, where, when, and who was involved.

    If you're curious of my reasoning, it's because, frankly, I think you're just lying. The only part of the game I can even feasibly understand the complaints (As vague as they were) that you laid out here are either like level 20 quests or some parts of the ARR patch content that everybody universally agrees isn't great. Which, again, goes back to the conversation of you can dislike something but stop pretending you are any authority on the story as a whole when you've seen about 35% of it.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:13 PM.

  6. #726
    Quote Originally Posted by Malix Farwin View Post
    This isnt the story, this is MMO fetch quests.

    Edit: and quite literally everyone said the story doesnt really start till the 40s, before than its your typical mmo start.
    no, that is how the story in ff14 is delivered. a good word to describe it would be TEDIOUS.

    and i got to level 64 and there i was sure the story is just a steamy pile of turds (in my modest opinion ofc lul)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Drindorai View Post
    It's impressive you typed this many words and still didn't really say anything.

    "This is cheesy" over and over again which quickly devolves into, "THIS IS JUST ANIME" means nothing. What was cheesy? What specific part? What character? What storyline? What part of the game are you talking about?

    Because it it really seems like you're speaking about ARR and not the rest of the entire game lol

    Posts like this are why I have a hard time believing you even played a single second of the game, it's so filled with nonsensical bullshit vague enough to pretend to be some kind of authoritative statement that nobody can even tell what the hell you're talking about.
    ok, then you tell me what makes the story so good? show me how its done im all ears

  7. #727
    and i got to level 64 and there i was sure the story is just a steamy pile of turds (in my modest opinion ofc lul)
    What was the story at that level. What were you doing, where, with whom, and why? Specifics please.

    Because unless you were massively overleveled for the MSQ, I am quite aware around what part of the story you were at at level 64 and it's in a part of Stormblood that is pretty universally liked even for other parts of that expansion that drag on or are not as good.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:16 PM.

  8. #728
    no please, you tell me whats so good about the story....why do you think its any good at all? and why do you think its really good? specifics please...show me how its done....type your own review that i will use as a template so i can follow it in my own review then ok?

  9. #729
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ok, then you tell me what makes the story so good? show me how its done im all ears
    I can give you specifics why I like a story or not, but that's not the conversation here. The conversation is throwing out buzzwords and vague generalities and then dismissing something without actually explaining it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    no please, you tell me whats so good about the story....why do you think its any good at all? and why do you think its really ghood? specifics please...show me how its done
    No, sorry, that's not how it's going to go.

    Especially now based on your reaction, I think you're just flatout lying.

    Tell me what you were doing at level 64 in the story. Where were you at, with what characters, what were you doing, and why were you doing it?

    You can dislike the story all you want. You can find 100% of the story cheesy if you want, although I'd begin questioning your ability to analyze everything if you can't discern any nuance in anything and consider everything all cheesy, but if you're going to show up and start making broad statements, I'm interested in why you think something is cheesy, not just that you do.

    The fact that you devolved into just calling the game "anime" already pretty much tells me what you were going for with that post, but I'd love to hear your thought process on literally a single storyline as to why it was cheesy.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:21 PM.

  10. #730
    nice dodge sonny....cya

  11. #731
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    nice dodge sonny....cya
    Come up with a better lie next time, Mr. 21 post account that joined a few days ago and spent their entire post history just mindlessly shitting on the game and insulting the developer.

  12. #732
    i already wrote my review, you didnt...i gave my reasons...you didnt

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    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    ill tell you whats wrong with the story IN MY OPINION, ok?.....its bloated with so much irrelevant crap and gibberish/banter just used as a timesink to prolong content that even the ok parts feel like you just wasted your time watching it all. i found it cheezy, with cheezy characters with cheezy jokes i didnt feel or care one bit about any of them... quests sending you around like an errand boy teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence what happens next usually something totally irrelevant as well.

    ...i can feel the whole story is made to be (morally?) acceptable by ages 10 trough 70 and its slowly and poorly delivered non-interactively in a interactive medium of videogames. maybe its an age difference and im waaay too boomer for a kiddy-cartoonish anime mmo story but anyway, after one month of doing the story and buying the game i just felt like i wasted my time and money how unbearable and unfulfilling it was in the end to even try to finish it. especially after story being hyped up as the holy grail of ff14 it was a huge letdown, and it being so forced on the player and the only possible way to level and develop your character it ruined the whole game for me for good....and i really REALLY liked the raiding in it.


    o yea maybe i should play something i dislike for another month so i can say i dislike it for sure? do you weatch a tv show and after 2 episodes say "i dont like it", or you watch the whole thing, all seasons and then you say "ok i watched 5 season of a show i dont like so now i can for sure say i think its bad"....please stop with this crap.....you dont need to invest 10 years into something bad to find out its bad, ye?
    these are my opinions why i disliked the story....please quote or write yours

  13. #733
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    i already wrote my review, you didnt...i gave my reasons...you didnt
    You gave zero specifics on anything, refuse to even confirm that you are telling the truth because you can't actually explain a plot point despite it being so bad or cheesy or whatever else, and then try to drastically change the subject when asked about it.

    I also didn't realize you were the guy who actually argued the game will die when Asmongold stops playing it, so that's pretty funny too.

  14. #734
    so you expect that i, who already wrote a post about my opinions....go into them further and in more detail, while you didnt write a single reason not even a vague one why the story is good? why is this?

  15. #735
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    so you expect that i, who already wrote a post about my opinions....go into them further and in more detail, while you didnt write a single reason not even a vague one why the story is good? why is this?
    Just because you want to change the subject away from you lying about the game, new account, doesn't mean that's what I'm going to do.

    The ONLY actual specific detail you mentioned was that the story has you "teleporting around the world so each person can tell you one sentence." Which is both a total mischaracterization of what actually happens, but also examples of stuff happening SIMILAR to that are done in the very beginnings of the game.

    Still waiting for you to specifically tell me what you were doing in the story at level 64. I'll give you a hint: You were probably with Yugiri.

  16. #736
    Err, this is tilting pretty far into the 'being an asshole' half of the meter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soikona View Post
    The story is bad, that was my opinion in the first 10 minutes, after the first 30 minutes, after the first hour and after I finished it.
    I get what I think you're trying to say here, but... proudly declaring "I hated the story from the MINUTE I started it and NEVER stopped hating it!" is, uh... not really the best way to convince the people you want to share your opinion with that you're... worth... listening to. I'm an optimist, and I try to give people the benefit of the doubt whenever I can, sometimes to a naive extent. It's fine to not like the game or the story, I can't stress this enough. But if you're ten minutes out the gate, having talked to a grand total of zero major characters, or even dipped a toe into the plot beyond just walking around and having one conversation with Tuto Rial, your friendly neighborhood innkeeper, and you're already like "I hate this." then it's like... *throws hands up* what the fuck. How. Were you even giving it a chance? Did you want to?

    And it stains the rest of your experience that subsequent thirty minutes, hour, all the way to however long it took you to finish whatever you finished before you stopped playing. It just makes it seem like you came into the story ready to hate it, biased against this 'new' experience you were looking to try, and as soon as the hate flag was even slightly triggered, nothing else mattered, which isn't worthwhile to discussing the game. That's just how it reads to me. Feel free to correct me.

    On the other end of that...

    Quote Originally Posted by Drindorai View Post
    For a story, you absolutely can say that if you didn't finish the story, your opinion on its quality is worthless lol.
    Nooooot necessarily... For someone saying that this kind of stuff is not a black or white issue, this is tilting noticeably over into white. There is absolutely a point between the start of the story and the end of one where someone can say, meaningfully and validly, that they think it's not a good story and they didn't like it. I'm no writing genius, I'm not going to pretend I know exactly where that point is. It's definitely before the halfway mark of the story. And I want to say that if you're like a handful of hours or so into the story, you've probably hit that point by then. But it has to exist. Because being forced to reserve judgment until you've hit the back cover of a book is just as senseless to me as deriding that same book when you're barely past the front cover, especially when that book is as big as FFXIV.
    Last edited by CalamityHeart; 2021-08-30 at 12:34 PM.

  17. #737
    im waiting for you to write why you think the story is good vaguely like i wrote to you vaguely why i think the story is bad, and then we can geet deeper into a discussion,....but lets face it, you dont want any discussions....we touched your sensitive spot and now you gonna just repeat "tell me what you were doing in the story at level 64" over and over again and thats probably as far as you can intellectually go. it was a pleasure talking with you, as im sure it will be to the next person lucky enough to hear your opinion on something, altho we didnt hear any reasons ... like....at all.

  18. #738
    Quote Originally Posted by CalamityHeart View Post
    Nooooot necessarily... For someone saying that this kind of stuff is not a black or white issue, this is tilting noticeably over into white. There is absolutely a point between the start of the story and the end of one where someone can say, meaningfully and validly, that they think it's not a good story and they didn't like it. I'm no writing genius, I'm not going to pretend I know exactly where that point is. It's definitely before the halfway point of the story. And I want to say that if you're like a handful of hours or so into the story, you've probably hit that point by then. But it has to exist. Because being forced to reserve judgment until you've hit the back cover of a book is just as senseless to me as deriding that same book when you're barely past the front cover, especially when that book is as big as FFXIV.
    And as I, and others, have been saying all along, saying, "I didn't like what of the story I saw" is perfectly acceptable. I know people who are like that and quit before finishing ARR. But to then generalize it into, "The story of FF14 is bad" is where people push back against it, especially if you only saw about 20% of it.

    There is a notable difference between, "I didn't like my experience with this thing" and "this thing is bad." I'm not sure how else to explain it if you cannot see the difference. One is clearly framing it as a personal opinion about something subjectively while the other is, if not explicitly, than implicitly making what is very close to an objective statement.

    You can find ARR's story to be bad, or cheesy, or 'too anime,' or whatever and stop playing the game. Go for it, you do you. I hope you find a game or something that you like better. Not liking a lot of ARR is a pretty common reaction. But if you then begin going, "FF14's story is bad!" when people are talking about stuff you aren't even aware of, you're essentially arguing from a place of overall authority on a subject when you've experienced a fraction of it.
    Last edited by Drindorai; 2021-08-30 at 12:42 PM.

  19. #739
    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    no, that is how the story in ff14 is delivered. a good word to describe it would be TEDIOUS.

    and i got to level 64 and there i was sure the story is just a steamy pile of turds (in my modest opinion ofc lul)
    Lol what, is this an actual statement, it's lazy at best, completely contradictory is prolly what i can best describe it. First you say you played an hour and now you say you went up to level 64(quite literally impossible, even if you boost it takes you to 70). You mention "fetch quests" as an excuse and then say they are "tedious" you have actually said a single thing about the story.

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    Quote Originally Posted by srambo View Post
    i already wrote my review, you didnt...i gave my reasons...you didnt

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    these are my opinions why i disliked the story....please quote or write yours
    You arent talking about the story here, you are talking about how MMOs quests work, quite literally not a single thing you have post is related to story at all to the point where i could copy and paste it and apply it to anything.

  20. #740
    Quote Originally Posted by Drindorai View Post
    And as I, and others, have been saying all along, saying, "I didn't like what of the story I saw" is perfectly acceptable. I know people who are like that and quit before finishing ARR. But to then generalize it into, "The story of FF14 is bad" is where people push back against it, especially if you only saw about 20% of it.

    There is a notable difference between, "I didn't like my experience with this thing" and "this thing is bad." I'm not sure how else to explain it if you cannot see the difference. One is clearly framing it as a personal opinion about something subjectively while the other is, if not explicitly, than implicitly making what is very close to an objective statement.

    You can find ARR's story to be bad, or cheesy, or 'too anime,' or whatever and stop playing the game. Go for it, you do you. I hope you find a game or something that you like better. Not liking a lot of ARR is a pretty common reaction. But if you then begin going, "FF14's story is bad!" when people are talking about stuff you aren't even aware of, you're essentially arguing from a place of overall authority on a subject when you've experienced a fraction of it.
    Maybe it's me that's looking at it from the wrong angle, but here's my opinion.

    For any given player, 'the story', as far as it's being discussed here, is equal to however much of the story that they actually got through before they stopped playing. So when someone says "...FFXIV's story is bad!", the "What I saw of..." that prefixes that is usually implied, from their perspective. I don't think anyone in their right mind thinks that they're any sort of authority on parts of the game that they haven't played, or parts of the story they haven't experienced. But at the same time, I think that those same people can probably be forgiven for thinking that what they missed was going to be just as unfun as what they managed to get through, when they say the game's bad. At the very least, I don't think those people are really worthy of the kind of scorn that they're getting. At least, not most of the time. There are shitty takes floating around about the game that don't really deserve the benefit of the doubt.

    What I'm getting at is that on a surface level, I don't see a significant difference between "I didn't like what of the story I saw." and "The story of FF14 is bad." The latter statement is nested within the former, from my perspective. And so the ideal response to the latter, for me, is almost never "Well, did you play the whole entire game? No?! Fuck you!" or similar sentiments.

    I dunno, that's just the lens I view these sort of discussions from.
    Last edited by CalamityHeart; 2021-08-30 at 01:54 PM.

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