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  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by Valkyrst View Post
    The man has a point. Blizzard does a LOT of grandstanding, whilst also engaging in corporate shillery AND then having this ugly side of engaging in sexual harassment and discrimination. So what he's saying is Blizzard was ACTUALLY woke and diverse, and not just grandstanding, sexual harassment and discrimination wouldn't exist.
    Yes, I got that part 100%. But how would being more diverse and woke prevent people from doing bad stuff, without sounding like "bad behavior" is only a white man problem?

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggressive View Post
    I love how people of politics think that leftist and people of the right think that either side is better. When all actuality both sides are pure shit and both sides are nothing but dirty ass bitches. Neither is better then the other and it is not like either side is angels. Both sides are nothing but wolves ready to get over on the innocent for money. Fuck politics. They have no place in video games.............Not even a little.
    I completely agree. I wish games had never gotten politicised.

  3. #423
    Banned docterfreeze's Avatar
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    In-game changes? What could those be? Is every trace of garrosh going to be removed from the games?

  4. #424
    Still no anti-cheat in Warzone

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    You do realise that the demeaning attitude and ostracisation of them is increasing the risk of this.
    There's no reason to use it as its currently used except for self masturbation. But in the end it just creates more victims.
    This line of reasoning lends credence to the perpetrator's motives and reduces their agency. Society's responsibility is to help the ostracised build resilience, not to curtail society in its ostracisation.

  6. #426
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muxtar View Post
    And that said who? Those exact women that were not promoted? Are you sure that they indeed are better qualified, or they might be just jealous that they didn't get promoted because of skill reasons, and now cover this with discrimination stuff? This thought didn't occur in you head, did it?
    It did. But when the people promoted have a pattern, the discrimination becomes pretty obvious. I mean, are you telling the that the white males in blizzard are ALWAYS more qualified? That would be one hell of a strange coincidence.
    I don't want solutions. I want to be mad. - PoorlyDrawnlines

  7. #427
    Quote Originally Posted by zorkuus View Post
    Yes, I got that part 100%. But how would being more diverse and woke prevent people from doing bad stuff, without sounding like "bad behavior" is only a white man problem?
    They're pretending that diversity always makes things better.

  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by Magnagarde View Post
    That is why people in the West, mainly the US, think that being a leftist is about defunding the police, diversity or whatever other modern buzzword comes to mind. They never knew what leftist politics are because they never had the chance to witness them and are therefor clueless when it comes to reckognizing them.
    USA is a good example of what happens when you only have right and more-right for generations. Anything that looks barely as a socialist thing is looked up as the demon.
    - Syndicates? NO! Better fight for you're labor rights 1v1 you vs an international conglomerate. I'm sure it'd all be OK. The best thing they have are Unions. They're close but they just fight for their associates (they're closer to guilds than to true syndicates).
    - Social security? Nah. Better to care for yourself and if you get ill and have no money to cover the treatment get ready to have a ginormous debt that would be paid until your grandchildren die, or die from that illness.
    - Public education? Bah. You don't need education to be a manual worker. What? You want to be an engeneer? Better be ready to be a slave from the bank that gave you a credit to cost the tuition.

    And the list go on...
    But yeah, beware of the Red Menace.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by Sluvs View Post
    It did. But when the people promoted have a pattern, the discrimination becomes pretty obvious. I mean, are you telling the that the white males in blizzard are ALWAYS more qualified? That would be one hell of a strange coincidence.
    I personally am not surprised that a white dude in his fourties and fifties, who has spent his entire life playing tabletop games, MMOs and videogames in general, gets promoted over Becky that was hired to fill a mandated hiring quota. This pertains to the game development department first and foremost.

  10. #430
    Quote Originally Posted by Phaythos View Post
    Because for everybody to be treated respectfully and in the same way, people with clear advantages in life have to give up some of them. It is as simple as that.
    And as utterly despicable and revolting as that.
    Just imagine: legalized theft and oppression of the perceived "have much" by wannabe moral redistributors of humanity who know better.
    In fact you don't even need to imagine: this happened in the past under communism, and guess what - it ended in bloodshed, poverty and famine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valkyrst View Post
    That is the dumbest fucking take ever. There is a HIGH AS FUCK chance that the ancestors of African-Americans have had it really fucking hard, even going back 50-75 years. So no, 'colour blind' is just an easy way to say, 'I won't treat situations with care and respect, I'll be a dick to everyone'.
    Save me your "care and respect", I'll treat and expect the same from everyone up to the same standards.
    I will not single out some as "poor oppressed victims who need a hug" constantly.
    How patronizing.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormwolf64 View Post
    And how will that improve planet earth? People are so fucked in the head these days. Pitying and sympathizing for eternity, will that help anyone? Maybe they can get a whip and take a crack at slavery? will that make their lives any better? No of course it won't. Moving forward hand is what has to be done. Blaming and guilting is a fools endevour and will continue to breed hate in equal measure to the good it attempts to do.
    It's almost like you have little to no idea what people actually want. Because you look at what a select few people do when it comes to campaigning for rights, and then use that as a sweeping generalisation. I believe in equal rights and progressive rights for all. What does that mean? It doesn't mean going to a white person and saying, 'YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE PLIGHT OF MINORITIES!' Fuck no. It involves something very simple, ensuring everyone has EQUAL opportunity. That doesn't mean handing out jobs or money or status just based on colour. It means providing opportunity without discrimination. And that's the important bit. MANY companies fail in this regard, because they think, 'Christ, I don't want to put in the effort of actually providing equal opportunity, so I'll just skip that and make token appointments'. That breeds resentment. Amongst everyone.

    Fostering a progressive society requires effort. It's why some of those who are comfortable see it as a waste of time, because why bother when their glass is already full? Then you have others who are afraid they'll lose out, so they would rather have it like it was in the 'old days'. And so on. It comes to the core question of, 'what's in it for me?' And for many people, if there's nothing in it for them or a sense of perceived loss, you can be damn well sure they won't work towards what is better for everyone. Which is why there's such a schism in society. Everyone wants to look out for number one, which would be fine if there wasn't such a huge disparity in the opportunity to be able to look out for number one.

    No one's asking for things on a plate. They don't want you to feel sorry for them. They don't want you to sympathise with them. They don't want anything magical. Just. A. Chance. To be able to use their skills or to be able acquire skills to fulfil their hopes, dreams and aspirations. But for those people who've never had it that hard, that just sounds like an alien concept. When it shouldn't be. Because struggles are relative. And it doesn't take a genius to know that when someone has it bad, empathy goes a long way. Regardless of colour, religion, gender, sexual orientation. Empathy is understanding that everyone wants to go somewhere in life, and knowingly or unknowingly putting a roadblock is dumb AF.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nimin View Post
    Save me your "care and respect", I'll treat and expect the same from everyone up to the same standards.
    I will not single out some as "poor oppressed victims who need a hug" constantly.
    How patronizing.
    I literally could not give less of a fuck what you think. Because you clearly don't understand what life is actually about. So carry on.

  12. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by pacotaco View Post
    USA is a good example of what happens when you only have right and more-right for generations. Anything that looks barely as a socialist thing is looked up as the demon.
    - Syndicates? NO! Better fight for you're labor rights 1v1 you vs an international conglomerate. I'm sure it'd all be OK. The best thing they have are Unions. They're close but they just fight for their associates (they're closer to guilds than to true syndicates).
    - Social security? Nah. Better to care for yourself and if you get ill and have no money to cover the treatment get ready to have a ginormous debt that would be paid until your grandchildren die, or die from that illness.
    - Public education? Bah. You don't need education to be a manual worker. What? You want to be an engeneer? Better be ready to be a slave from the bank that gave you a credit to cost the tuition.

    And the list go on...
    But yeah, beware of the Red Menace.
    I find it ironic that the tables have turned and that Hollywood is at the forefront of purging the rest of the US, what with the censorship and political persecution people had to endure in the early 20th century. To be fair, most of the people deemed to be far right nowadays are just slightly right-of-centre or just centrist people because the perception shifted drastically in the last 20 years. As it happened to be, most of the people who were deemed radical leftists in the first half of the 20th century were also mischaracterized. Someone who was deemed a liberal in the 90s could, in regards to some of their takes on everyday life, very well be classified as a conservative nowadays. People are being misclassified on a massive scale in my opinion. When you make a mistake from the get-go and can't even set the homework down on paper before starting to solve it, then there's little to no chance to find the right solution.

    The same thing applies to workplace culture; the standards have shifted tremendeously, some of it for the better and some of it for the worse. This is reflected in this latest Blizzard lawsuit.
    Last edited by Magnagarde; 2021-07-28 at 02:27 PM.

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivarr View Post
    This line of reasoning lends credence to the perpetrator's motives and reduces their agency. Society's responsibility is to help the ostracised build resilience, not to curtail society in its ostracisation.
    Everyone already acts at reduced agency due to society... Society shapes us all. I'm not saying that people who do heinous act shouldn't be punished. But society has to be careful not to create them.

    I mean, you can just listen to the most vile crimes and you will see a pattern that they are often unloved, shunned, bullied and never fit in and is having surroundings that actively push them away from fitting in.

    To me it's just common sense if you poke someone enough they will eventually bite back. Using that agency argument in this context is like throwing your hands up in the air and say "we can't do anything" and give up. Which won't solve anything.
    Can we say the same when it comes to schoolshooting? Or do you think we can actually help and prevent these things from happen?
    If we can, society does have an impact... If we can't then society has no impact and there's no reason to bother. But frankly.. Society plays a big role in who we become as a person.
    Last edited by Kumorii; 2021-07-28 at 02:29 PM.

  14. #434
    Old God Al Gorefiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nimin View Post
    Okay, acnowledged. Now get a move on, and stop crying about being a victim.
    Guess what: having a certain skincolor in no way proves that you, your parents, or your grandparents had it rougher than me, my parents, or my grandparents.

    Being "color blind" denies the victim card based on stuff that happened centuries ago to people who looked like them - hence why they hate it.
    We can and should be promoting minorities and underprivileged people into higher positions. Because it's historically rarely ever been a thing and that is entirely from discrimination. Even the minorities of today that are highly regarded like.. Neil Degrassi Tyson? Faced a fuckton of opposition and racism, in his OWN words. Nobody ever heard of a black scientist omg!

    The shift into this didn't just happen overnight on the internet. Something's got to get done because it's getting to be bullshit for too many people that their dreams can't be met because mom and dad were wrong skin color.

  15. #435
    Quote Originally Posted by zorkuus View Post
    Yes, I got that part 100%. But how would being more diverse and woke prevent people from doing bad stuff, without sounding like "bad behavior" is only a white man problem?
    For you to decipher that bit, you'd need to realise that diversity isn't something that involves putting the 'white man' down, no matter how much FOX News tells you otherwise. Because diversity isn't about exclusion. It's the precise opposite. And true diversity doesn't involve 'let's just give Becky the job cos she a woman AND gay'. It involves, 'Becky's CV looks as good as Joe's. How about we interview both, and identify who the very best candidate is for the job without any preconceived preferences, biases or requirements to fulfil a HR mandate?' Equal opportunity is just that. EQUAL opportunity. Not give something to someone because they're different and we need different. That's an easy tick mark on the HR mandate. That's wrong, that's dumb and that's destructive. And it's counterintuitive to diversity. Best person for the job, yes. Even if that means fostering a progressive environment to cater to the unique requirements of a person. And it's that bit that people struggle with. 'WHAT YOU WANT ME TO NOT MAKE DICK JOKES IN FRONT OF THE NEW FEMALE HIRE? I CAN'T DO THAT! IT TAKES AWAY FROM WHO I AM!' It doesn't, it's just respectful.

    Asmongold actually hit the nail on the head in a video the other day. He mentioned how he's automatically more reserved and careful around woman when he speaks, because he understands the value of boundaries and differences in what people are comfortable with and not comfortable with. The issue is that a lot of people are stubborn. And when they're asked to extend understanding towards something that is potentially at odds with what they consider 'normal', they rebel. They see it as a threat to their status quo. When it's not really, unless they see being respectful and potentially respecting the boundaries of others as 'woke shit'. It's really not, though. It's just showing an amount of compassion and care about how others feel.

    And before someone comes in and goes, 'OH BUT THAT FEMINAZI CALLED ME A TOXIC MALE FOR NO REASON'. I get that can happen. There are some people who make their entire identity about a particular viewpoint. Same as 'incels' and 'Trumpers' etc etc. They're not the 'radical left' as FOX likes to call them. They're just people with a severe case of identity crisis. And sometimes you have to just stage left and avoid them. 99/100 they're just posturing because they're insecure AF. I've experienced it too, and I'm progressive AF. I just kinda...walk away. Because I know who I am.
    Last edited by Valkyrst; 2021-07-28 at 02:32 PM.

  16. #436
    over a decade to make changes but only when stock prices start to dip do they take action.

  17. #437
    Old God Al Gorefiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkyrst View Post
    For you to decipher that bit, you'd need to realise that diversity isn't something that involves putting the 'white man' down, no matter how much FOX News tells you otherwise. Because diversity isn't about exclusion. It's the precise opposite. And true diversity doesn't involve 'let's just give Becky the job cos she a woman AND gay'. It involves, 'Becky's CV looks as good as Joe's. How about we interview both, and identify who the very best candidate is for the job without any preconceived preferences, biases or requirements to fulfil a HR mandate?' Equal opportunity is just that. EQUAL opportunity. Not give something to someone because they're different and we need different. That's an easy tick mark on the HR mandate. That's wrong, that's dumb and that's destructive. And it's counterintuitive to diversity. Best person for the job, yes. Even if that means fostering a progressive environment to cater to the unique requirements of a person. And it's that bit that people struggle with. 'WHAT YOU WANT ME TO NOT MAKE DICK JOKES IN FRONT OF THE NEW FEMALE HIRE? I CAN'T DO THAT! IT TAKES AWAY FROM WHO I AM!' It doesn't, it's just respectful.
    Who would have thought making people not be assholes involved so much politics

  18. #438
    And yet I don't see any of you tools complaining about other companies and industries with horrid working conditions with selfish CEO's....i.e. Bezos and Amazon. And I bet you all wear Nike........CHIna. If only were really serious about justice

  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    But society has to be careful not to create them.
    What measures would you use to impose this norm?

  20. #440
    Quote Originally Posted by Valkyrst View Post
    For you to decipher that bit, you'd need to realise that diversity isn't something that involves putting the 'white man' down, no matter how much FOX News tells you otherwise.
    Let me stop you right there. I'm not some american fox goon. I'm not on the right. I'm finnish and pretty left leaning. I'm not who you think I am. So I didn't read the rest of your post, which I assume was just more strawman.

    I am sick and tired of behavior exactly like this. People jumping on the gun when they hear just one bad thing (which actually even wasn't the thing they think it was). Try to think beoynd strawmen McFly.

    Fuck you.
    Last edited by zorkuus; 2021-07-28 at 02:35 PM.

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