Dad of 4, which computers to repair/upgrade? How do you manage many accounts?

[Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang]

Hi all,

Back on WoW, playing a bit, and several kids are interested on top of the other games they have, so competition for my one "good" computer is getting high.

Reference games are WoW Retail, WoW WotLK, WoW Classic, Space Engineer, Minecraft and Sims 4. Ideally I'd aim to have 4 to 5 computers able to run Sims 4 and WoW Classic, or even WoW WotLK, if not someday WoW Retail... also Space Engineer has to run on another computer than #1. Besides fixing #2 (and maybe clone the system of #3 to it), what should I do next and in what order? repair #6, #7 or #8? And/or would I be better off upgrading #2 with the i7-4790 from #8 and maybe look for a cheap GPU upgrade?

I have so much to do and so little time available I seek advice on what to do first. Plus having to set up multiple MS and Steam accounts if only for all of them to play Sims 4 at the same time messes with my head. Also space is at a premium at my place so the footprint of #2 and #7 is somewhat problematic.

Following is the current functionnal inventory :

#1 : Custom self-built desktop, Win 11 : i5-8600K, Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev. B cooler, 16GB DDR4 RAM (8GBx2/2), M.2 SSD 500 Go Samsung , Asrock Fatal1ty Z370 Gaming-ITX/ac (has TB3), GTX 1080, in compact Silverstone RVZ02 Raven case, running Win 11 : satisfies even recommended hardware requirements for WoW DF. Plugged into 27' Samsung Space Monitor (QHD, 144Hz, FreeSync). Drive would be easy to swap but for the RAM I'd have to remove the cooler...

#2 : 2nd hand custom prebuilt, Win 10 : i7-7700K, Intel AIO single fan watercooler, 16GB DDR4 RAM (8GBx2/4), NVME M.2 SSD 500 Go WD Black SN850 with heatsink, Asus ATX board (need to recheck reference), GTX 1070, in a full size case, with a dedicated sound card. Previous elderly owner had it to play MS Flight Simulator, and it came without any drives. I wanted to directly graft my son's SSD to it but ran into issues, also maybe there was a RAID I need to find out how to get rid of that messes up with startup, asking me to enter UEFI each time. Daughter runs Sims 4 for now, could run Space Engineer and WoW but her tiny desk is not ideal for me to use.

#3 : 2nd hand Medion prebuilt my brother gifted my 10y old eldest, Win 10 : Intel Pentium G3250, 8 GB DDR3 RAM, 2.5' SSD 500 Go Samsung, MOBO and PSU are probably proprietary, no extra cable for GPU, GTX 750. He's happily playing Minecraft and Lego games on it, but he's stoked on Space Engineer and its unsufficient for even minimal requirements for WoW DF.

#4 : Thinkpad T410s, Win 7 : i5-560M, 8GB DDR3, 1.8' SSD 160 Go Intel, Nvidia 3100M. I used to play WotLK up to ICC25 back in the days so maybe it has more oomph than I give it credit for?

#5 : Thinkpad X201 Tablet, Win 7 : i7-620LM, 3GB DDR3, 2.5' SSD 480 Go.

Here's the vaguely to entirely non functional hardware :

#6 : Acer Predator G9-593 laptop : i7-7700HQ, 16GB DDR4 RAM, M.2 SSD 256 Go, 2.5' 1 To HDD, GTX 1060, the laptop has TB3. The screen got cracked and I've been considering replacing it (already dissasembled), but in the meantime, as I was using it as a desktop plugged to an external monitor, I ran into driver update issues and after several months found a way to output something, but it seems I'd have to do a total reinstall as I'm more or less stuck in safe mode.

#7 : old HP Z420 workstation I got from work : Intel Xeon E5-1620, 16GB DDR3 RAM (EMMC), 2.5 SSD 128 Go Samsung, MOBO and PSU are proprietary, GTX 960. Probably has PSU issues as regularly it will beep error signals when starting, and other times work just fine. If worthwhile I'd have to replace the PSU with a proprietary one or a standard one with adapter.

#8 : old Lenovo H50 workstation I got from work : Intel i7-4790, 8GB DDR3, no drive yet, MOBO and PSU are proprietary, GT 745. Won't start up with only error signals, PSU is most likely dead. If worthwhile I'd have to replace the PSU with a standard one with adapter, or cannibalize its CPU and RAM.

In addition, I have the following spare parts :

#9 : 2x8GB DDR4 sticks matching the ones in #1, brand new
#10 : M.2 NVME 2 To Samsung 980 Pro with heatsink, brand new (meant for #1, but hesitant on wether to clone or reinstall, luckily M.2 slot should be easily accessible).
#11 : 2.5' SSD 480 Go Adata, second hand
#12 : GTX 550 Ti (lol)
#13 : 3 FHD external monitors for the kids in total

It's getting a little pressing, given that one kid ruined the Nintendo Switch cartridge holder pins, so all the multiplayer games are unavailable, adding to my list of to do/maybe get a new one.

Separately, I'm suspecting trouble connecting so many PCs via the Wifi of a puny internet box. For now I've reduced the load by directly wiring the Smart TV, but I'm wondering if I should look for a dedicated wireless router.

[Gaidax]

All of the above is just hot trash.

Your "best" system has a 7 years old CPU and 8 years old GPU and the rest are even worse. You can use #1 and #2 as is, just give them to your youngest, they won't give a fudge anyway - I imagine they just browse internet and play basic games, they will be plenty happy with that.

And for the rest - buy budget laptops with modern I5s (gen 12/13), iGPUs like 3060 and 16GB RAM. These will kick living daylights out of anything you can assemble from those trash piles.

Will save you space, and most importantly - time and energy dealing with nonsense. You can hook existing monitors and peripherals to them and they can play all the games they want all day long on fair settings without issues for 2-3 years to come.

There is little point trying to sort out those heaps of trash, you got there with 8 years museum pieces being your best options there. Like your only viable for anything pieces of trash are #1 and #2, which probably would go best for the youngest, the rest is prime garbage disposal material.

You can repurpose one of the desktops to be a file server, stick all that storage you have lying around into it and have everyone put their trash there.

[Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang]

Thanks for the reply. I am keenly aware of my collection being all antiques (and I like antiques). I should have specified that I have heavy budgetary constraints for the coming year, so ideally I aim to reach "something" with no budget or maybe a few tens of bucks.

I've been eyeing the laptop and prebuilt market for a while now, and seen the likes of i7-12700F + RTX 3080 for less than 1k for example, laptops with an i7-12650H + RTX 3060 starting in a similar price range. But even the cheapest budget laptops available, with Ryzen 7 6800H + RTX 3050 Ti, at around 600, are currently not an option as far as budget is concerned, particularly if we're talking not one but several machines.

[Linkedblade]

#1 and #2 are fine. Probably cant install win11 on them, but win10 let's you control them using Microsoft Family Safety.

#6 isnt bad if you have the $50 or so to buy a replacement.

Honestly, none of it's terrible, if you get it to play the games they want, then it's fine.

I'm not trying to plug anything here, but Amazon Fire tablets for kids is perfect. They're usually in the $100-150 price range, come with a case, have decent parental controls, and the parent only has to by a game once for all the kids on the family plan. You get a year free of all their kid content. And the warranty is a free replacement for practically any reason.

Nintendo's warranty isn't bad either. I got a dead switch replaced for $100 under warranty.

If you're definitely looking for pc's, I'd look out for some ebay deals on refurbed dell optiplex or hp prodesk and get them in a small or mid tower and slap in a 5600xt or rtx3050 or something like that. Or look for some refurbed laptops with similar specs to what Gaidax was saying. I like the desktops better, but the kids will probably like the portability.

Edit: I didn't realize we were talking international, my bad. Not sure what still applies.

[Gaidax]

Okay in that case.

Take #3 and #8 and combine them into one rig with 16GB RAM and buy GPU that does not use external power. For example, something from this list: https://pcmecca.com/best-low-power-g...xternal-power/ - most of that list is like 250 bucks for brand new, so second hand you'd get it for like a hundred if not less. These are 5 years old GPUs, but are still reasonable for budget light FHD gaming.

If #8 does not boot, put its CPU into #3 - it's the same generation CPUs, so there is a good chance #3 motherboard will work with I7-4790. Good news is that I7-4790 and G3250 came out almost same month, so likely existing BIOS in that motherboard there already supports 4790, so you may not even need BIOS upgrade.

Of course, purchase thermal paste too, so you can reapply it. You also might want to reuse cooler from #8 if possible, because I feel that Pentium garbage in #3 is probably cooled by the absolutely atrocious stock cooler that might not cut it for I7-4790. Pentium G3250 is absolutely worst of that CPU generation and I7-4790 is almost the best there was.

Provided this works, what you will get is still a hot trash, given CPU arch from 11 years ago, but at least if you upgrade GPU - it will be enough for somewhat recent light silly games for kids. It will be a passable, better-than-nothing option. But still 4790 in 2024, man, don't expect anything.


Also, about this bit: And/or would I be better off upgrading #2 with the i7-4790 from #8 and maybe look for a cheap GPU upgrade?. 4790 is a downgrade there and it won't work with that motherboard anyway guaranteed. Whereas there is a decent chance it will work for #3, at least.

[Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang]

#1 and #2 are fine. Probably cant install win11 on them, but win10 let's you control them using Microsoft Family Safety.

#6 isnt bad if you have the $50 or so to buy a replacement.

Honestly, none of it's terrible, if you get it to play the games they want, then it's fine.

I'm not trying to plug anything here, but Amazon Fire tablets for kids is perfect. They're usually in the $100-150 price range, come with a case, have decent parental controls, and the parent only has to by a game once for all the kids on the family plan. You get a year free of all their kid content. And the warranty is a free replacement for practically any reason.

Nintendo's warranty isn't bad either. I got a dead switch replaced for $100 under warranty.

If you're definitely looking for pc's, I'd look out for some ebay deals on refurbed dell optiplex or hp prodesk and get them in a small or mid tower and slap in a 5600xt or rtx3050 or something like that. Or look for some refurbed laptops with similar specs to what Gaidax was saying. I like the desktops better, but the kids will probably like the portability.

Edit: I didn't realize we were talking international, my bad. Not sure what still applies.

Thanks for the reply. I recently managed to get Win 11 on #1 as it has a Gen 8 CPU (still getting adjusted), #2 and #6 with their Gen 7 won't take it so far per MS.

#6 I'm gonna try to reinstall, maybe on a blank drive I have lying around, before I fix the screen (I know the references, but I'm a bit wary of the "equivalent" lottery, as I've already replaced a dead screen in the past). That laptop, and all the others, still have the convenience of built-in DVD-players, ideal for controlled offline entertainment.

I'm not looking into tablets for kids ATM, we've had a Samsung A7 which had a good Kids Mode, but too many instances of pathological/sneaky use of those at grandparents/friends, etc... The physicality of computers allows for a better monitoring. Plus its good they learn to use keyboard and mouse as well as basic computer functionning.

The Switch is out of warranty alas. Replacing the part seems doable, I'm just a bit wary of bricking an otherwise functional console (plus its the very good looking Animal Crossings special edition), plus spending up to 60 in the parts and tools when I've seen brand new v2s for about 220 might not be the wisest choice.

I don't have to look far for used workstations. Since our office switched everybody to laptops last years, I've already manifested interest for the remaining disused workstations (HP Z240, and other Dell, Lenovo and HP with 7 to 8th Gen i7 and various Quadro GPUs we use for CAD).

- - - Updated - - -

Okay in that case.

Take #3 and #8 and combine them into one rig with 16GB RAM and buy GPU that does not use external power. For example, something from this list: https://pcmecca.com/best-low-power-g...xternal-power/ - most of that list is like 250 bucks for brand new, so second hand you'd get it for like a hundred if not less. These are 5 years old GPUs, but are still reasonable for budget light FHD gaming.

Thanks for the list. There might be some disused GTX 1050 Ti in my family I could put to use. Will look at the rest if not.

If #8 does not boot, put its CPU into #3 - it's the same generation CPUs, so there is a good chance #3 motherboard will work with I7-4790. Good news is that I7-4790 and G3250 came out almost same month, so likely existing BIOS in that motherboard there already supports 4790, so you may not even need BIOS upgrade.

Of course, purchase thermal paste too, so you can reapply it. You also might want to reuse cooler from #8 if possible, because I feel that Pentium garbage in #3 is probably cooled by the absolutely atrocious stock cooler that might not cut it for I7-4790. Pentium G3250 is absolutely worst of that CPU generation and I7-4790 is almost the best there was.

Provided this works, what you will get is still a hot trash, given CPU arch from 11 years ago, but at least if you upgrade GPU - it will be enough for somewhat recent light silly games for kids. It will be a passable, better-than-nothing option. But still 4790 in 2024, man, don't expect anything.

Thanks for the advice. I've been wondering about the difference in thermals between the two if I were to swap the CPUs, I already have some thermal paste lying around, I'll check if its still good enough.

Also, about this bit: And/or would I be better off upgrading #2 with the i7-4790 from #8 and maybe look for a cheap GPU upgrade?. 4790 is a downgrade there and it won't work with that motherboard anyway guaranteed. Whereas there is a decent chance it will work for #3, at least.

My bad, I made a typo and wrote #2 instead of #3 obviously.

End of the year I might be able to get myself a new computer if I feel the need (for now I'm still finishing some BfA questlines, 4y hiatus does that to you, already past lv55 with just the Mechagnome Allied Race questline, before I've even touched the Nzoth questline or Shadowlands...). I do like the occasional raid, and to explore with max viewing distance in QHD if not 3840x1600 (I was doing the latter on a 40' TV I used as a monitor back then, pushing the Acer Predator quite a bit, since then I've got a 49' OLED TV, but that might not be that ergonomic, compared to the curved 3840x1600 monitors we have at work).

I've done a bit of research, and I guess to optimize for typical WoW loads I should aim to build myself a system around a Ryzen 7 7800x3d (those are less than USD400 here, and 58003xd are found under USD300). I wonder how much of an improvement it would be to just swap CPU+MOBO+cooler and reuse my other best components, considering the cost could be as low as USD400-500, with room for later RAM and GPU upgrades (still wondering which would be adequate). Ideally I'd wish to make it as compact as #1, but that might be too tedious given the silly sizes of modern GPUs...

[Linkedblade]

#2 might have a tpm module socket, and that would let it run win11.

The Microsoft controls are pretty good on win10.

And speaking about windows there are some versions like tiny 10 and tiny11 that are the regular windows without all the bloat. May work a bit better on the older hardware.

[Gaidax]

I've done a bit of research, and I guess to optimize for typical WoW loads I should aim to build myself a system around a Ryzen 7 7800x3d (those are less than USD400 here, and 58003xd are found under USD300). I wonder how much of an improvement it would be to just swap CPU+MOBO+cooler and reuse my other best components, considering the cost could be as low as USD400-500, with room for later RAM and GPU upgrades (still wondering which would be adequate). Ideally I'd wish to make it as compact as #1, but that might be too tedious given the silly sizes of modern GPUs...

7800X3D is DDR5 only, so you will also need to buy DDR5 RAM if you do that.

5800X3D works with DDR4, will be plenty enough for WoW, as far as GPUs go down the road, since you're on a budget then some previous gen mid-range AMD card will be fine enough. Nvidia is better nowadays, but more expensive. AMD GPU is a budget choice, that will probably give more for the same money.

Although you'd need to compare whatever you intend to buy to 1080 you have, it's not that horrible of a card - it's old, but higher end old - you will need to see whether buying a midrange from previous gen will actually give a meaningful upgrade.

---

Keep in mind, by buying 5800X3D you invest into a dead AM4 socket, this is an upgrade dead-end. Whereas if you splurge a bit more on 7800X3D, you get AM5 socket motherboard (and DDR5), which opens upgrade path at least until 2025 CPUs if not more. It is also possible to optimize budget by choosing a weaker CPU like 7600X and then banking on upgrade 3 years down the road.

7600X is roughly as good as 5800X3D and is cheaper (although you'd need DDR5 RAM and AM5 motherboard, which negates that benefit), but you won't be stuck with a dead platform you won't be able to upgrade in the future.

Now of course 7800X3D is quite a bit juicier than 7600X, but it's also 150 bucks more expensive. And either of them would feel good compared to your ancient 8600k anyway.

[Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang]

#2 might have a tpm module socket, and that would let it run win11.

The Microsoft controls are pretty good on win10.

And speaking about windows there are some versions like tiny 10 and tiny11 that are the regular windows without all the bloat. May work a bit better on the older hardware.

It reportedly has the tpm 2.0, but for now is not on the MS list of officially supported CPUs. If #2 and #6 are worth it, guess I'll leave them on Win 10 until support ends, and then maybe fiddle to have them run Win 11.

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7800X3D is DDR5 only, so you will also need to buy DDR5 RAM if you do that.

5800X3D works with DDR4, will be plenty enough for WoW, as far as GPUs go down the road, since you're on a budget then some previous gen mid-range AMD card will be fine enough. Nvidia is better nowadays, but more expensive. AMD GPU is a budget choice, that will probably give more for the same money.

Yeah opting for the 5800X3D would allow to save not only on CPU and MOBO, but also reuse available RAM and still provide a very substantial boost and some years of relevancy.

I still have to do research on AMD GPUs as I am not familiar with those yet.

Although you'd need to compare whatever you intend to buy to 1080 you have, it's not that horrible of a card - it's old, but higher end old - you will need to see whether buying a midrange from previous gen will actually give a meaningful upgrade.

Looking into it, barring the features it still compares to an RTX 3060, and is a bit behind an RTX 4060, so not that bad still.

What kind of current GPU one should aim for with WoW's next expansion with QHD@144Hz in mind?

Keep in mind, by buying 5800X3D you invest into a dead AM4 socket, this is an upgrade dead-end. Whereas if you splurge a bit more on 7800X3D, you get AM5 socket motherboard (and DDR5), which opens upgrade path at least until 2025 CPUs if not more. It is also possible to optimize budget by choosing a weaker CPU like 7600X and then banking on upgrade 3 years down the road.

7600X is roughly as good as 5800X3D and is cheaper (although you'd need DDR5 RAM and AM5 motherboard, which negates that benefit), but you won't be stuck with a dead platform you won't be able to upgrade in the future.

Now of course 7800X3D is quite a bit juicier than 7600X, but it's also 150 bucks more expensive. And either of them would feel good compared to your ancient 8600k anyway.

I've been wondering about aiming directly for AM5 for the upgrade path, but then if I opt for a cheap AM4, when I feel the need for upgrading I could just build myself a newer system and hand the AM4 to my eldest.

[mbit2]

Hopping to win11 is joining a public OS betatest. Smarter to stay on 10 for now next 1-2 years.

#7 xeon absolutely works for wow. Server processor only means supports ecc and no internal gpu. Used to play wow with a xeon in cata at ~120fps and yours is newer than what i had back then, wow classic is the wotlk engine. Only gpu might be a bit too weak but you can test it before making changes.