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  1. #521
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    I'm just gonna leave this here, since you guys built your whole concept around the notion of forms:
    Both Bear Form and Demon Form are different from WC3 to WoW. No reason whatsoever that Robo Goblin needs to be done 1:1.

    In every case, they adapt something from one game to fit the mechanics and aesthetic of another. Mechanically, gaining armor, stamina, threat and immunity to polymorph doesn't sound like a crazy way to adapt Robo Goblin to WoW.

  2. #522
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    No, it would be either a tinker or a druid. You couldn't switch between these lol.
    I'm sure Blizzard would find a way to monetize that :P

  3. #523
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    I'm sure Blizzard would find a way to monetize that :P
    Blizzard: With our new Race and Faction + services, you can not only change your race or faction, you can also swap the Class Skin to any other available Class Skin you may have!

    With our new Race and Faction + Premium services, you get the same as above, but also a new toy that when used emotes in fireworks above your character's head "I swear I'm a real < insert Class Skin name >".

  4. #524
    If you, guys, manage to skin all of these abilities and talents with existing Druid abilities and talents, without changing how they work, i'll be very impressed:

    Reduce, Reuse, Recycle
    Regenerate X Scrap every Y seconds. Destroyed Rock-It! Turrets drop Z Scrap, which can be picked up.
    Activate to destroy a target Rock-It! Turret.
    Rock-It! Turret
    X Scrap
    Creates a turret that deals Y damage. Lasts for Z seconds.
    Turrets prioritize the nearest players when first created.
    Deth Lazor
    After X seconds, deal Y damage to enemies in a line. Heal for Z% of the damage dealt, increased to A% against players.
    Xplodium Charge
    Place a bomb that deals X damage to enemies within the target area after Y seconds. Enemies hit are also Stunned for Z seconds.
    Robo-Goblin
    Activate to become immune to CC for X seconds.
    Passive: auto attacks deal Y bonus damage over Z seconds, stacking up to A times.
    Grav-O-Bomb 3000
    After a X seconds delay, pull enemies toward the center of an area and deal Z damage. Abilities deal Y% more damage for Z seconds after casting Grav-O-Bomb 3000.
    Focus Turrets!
    Orders any nearby Rock-It! Turrets to focus the target.
    EZ-PZ Dimensional Ripper
    Activate to gain X damage reduction for Y seconds, reducing damage taken by Z%, and reduce damage dealt by all nearby enemies by A% for B seconds.
    Electroshock Strikes
    Each of your melee attacks inflict additional Nature damage.
    Buster Cannon
    Fire your Buster Cannon. enemies struck by it suffer Nature damage instantly, additional Nature damage every X sec, and their Haste is reduced by Y%. Lasts Z sec.
    Heavy Thrusters
    Activate your heavy thrusters to Blast Off from your current location, and then Crash Down at another location.
    Gigavolt Charge
    Stick a target with a volatile energy charge that inflicts Nature damage every X sec for Y sec. When Gigavolt Charge expires, it triggers a Gigavolt Blast that strikes all targets within line of sight of the target.
    Wormhole Generator
    Teleport a target to a random location up to X yards away.
    Spark Bot
    Call in Spark Bot units to seek out your enemies.
    World Enlarger
    Shrink a target, reducing its damage for X sec.
    Exploding Sheep
    calls down a herd of Explosive Sheep that detonate after a short delay.
    Hyperdrive
    Increases Haste by X% and periodically launches Hyperdrive Discharge at enemy targets, inflicting Nature damage.

  5. #525
    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    Blizzard: With our new Race and Faction + services, you can not only change your race or faction, you can also swap the Class Skin to any other available Class Skin you may have!

    With our new Race and Faction + Premium services, you get the same as above, but also a new toy that when used emotes in fireworks above your character's head "I swear I'm a real < insert Class Skin name >".
    And that's just for Race and Faction. Just wait till you see what they have in store for Genders!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    If you, guys, manage to skin all of these abilities and talents with existing Druid abilities and talents, without changing how they work, i'll be very impressed:
    Why would you have to import them as is? WoW isn't a MOBA.

    I'd even point out how the Demon Hunter takes inspiration from Illidan in HOTS, but doesn't translate mechanics *without changing how they work* straight from HOTS.

    I mean, you couldn't even have a playable WoW class of Tyrande's mechanics in HOTS, because she's practically all skill-shots. Her Sentinel shot travels across the entire map, so are we gonna have POTM that shoot arrows that travel through the entire world of Azeroth until it hits something?
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-08-31 at 06:37 PM.

  6. #526
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    This is just one particular hypothetical, because game mechanics aren't always going to be unique for everything. Haruspex in the lore are literally different from Druids, yet they share the same gameplay and are effectively considered Druids. "The Zandalar know not of druidic ways; nature is to be shaped by their need, not the other way around. Sunwalkers are closer to Druids than they would be to the other Paladins of their order, and only recently have certain Sunwalkers formally made the jump to join the Silver Hand. Yet these concepts could have just as much gotten their own gameplay instead of being a part of existing classes.
    We're talking about a different class entirely, not a different flavor of a class.

    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    Both Bear Form and Demon Form are different from WC3 to WoW. No reason whatsoever that Robo Goblin needs to be done 1:1.

    In every case, they adapt something from one game to fit the mechanics and aesthetic of another. Mechanically, gaining armor, stamina, threat and immunity to polymorph doesn't sound like a crazy way to adapt Robo Goblin to WoW.
    Yet, even their WoW adaptations don't match each other. Why is that if they're simply tanking forms?

    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Why would you have to import them as is? WoW isn't a MOBA.
    They wouldn't. But, the general idea is there.
    Go on, have a try.

  7. #527
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    If you, guys, manage to skin all of these abilities and talents with existing Druid abilities and talents, without changing how they work, i'll be very impressed:
    But why on earth would we?

  8. #528
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    They wouldn't. But, the general idea is there.
    Go on, have a try.
    I'll try as soon as you explain to me how Tyrande's mechanics would work as a WoW class without changing how they work in HOTS. Then at least I know the level of bullshit you consider acceptable.

  9. #529
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    Another question.

    Why do people keep using HotS as some kind of source that would need to be used in WoW as a 1:1 transfer? Why do others accept the mention of HotS as admissible at all?

    It's a different game, something existing there doesn't have to exist in WoW does it?
    Last edited by AcidicSyn; 2021-08-31 at 06:41 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Minikin View Post
    "Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never....BURN IT"
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathandira View Post
    You are kinda joe Roganing this topic. Hardly have any actual knowledge other than what people have told you, and jumping into a discussion with people who have direct experience with it. Don't be Joe Rogan.

  10. #530
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    Yet, even their WoW adaptations don't match each other. Why is that if they're simply tanking forms?
    I'm not sure what you mean here? What WoW adaptions do you mean?

  11. #531
    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    But why on earth would we?
    Because it's an arbitrary hoop to jump through - an imagined standard set to ensure all ideas adhere to rules that do not exist.

  12. #532
    Quote Originally Posted by AcidicSyn View Post
    Another question.

    Why do people keep using HotS as some kind of source that would need to be used in WoW as a 1:1 transfer? Why do others accept the mention of HotS as admissible at all?

    It's a different game, something existing there doesn't have to exist in WoW does it?
    It's an ill-thought out response to wanting Class abilities from other games to be acknowledged in any formal adaptation of that class in WoW. And it's understandable to want to have Dark Ranger abilities if WoW adapts a playable Dark Ranger. I think he just didn't think it through that WC3 and HOTS mechanics don't actually translate 1:1 into WoW at all, and we've never seen a case where any ability was actually straight up taken out and worked as-is without modification for WoW. Everything has to be adapted because they're literally different games.

    These kind of responses come directly from people who don't understand anything about Game Design or Gameplay mechanics. They only want Classes be playable with all their abilities in tact without any consideration of how it would actually work in WoW. And without actually thinking about it themselves, they'll openly challenge others to do so, for the purpose of discrediting them when they fail to achieve the implausible. It's a bad faith argument.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-08-31 at 06:49 PM.

  13. #533
    Quote Originally Posted by draugril View Post
    Because it's an arbitrary hoop to jump through - an imagined standard set to ensure all ideas adhere to rules that do not exist.
    I mean, if somebody's attitude is "Any playable Tinker added to the game has to play exactly, EXACTLY I say, like this NPC does" then the very notion of a Class Skin isn't going to cut it for any possible class.

    Since we've clearly established that a Class Skin obviously requires some level of compromise, this isn't exactly a 'GOTCHA!'.

  14. #534
    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    I mean, if somebody's attitude is "Any playable Tinker added to the game has to play exactly, EXACTLY I say, like this NPC does" then the very notion of a Class Skin isn't going to cut it for any possible class.

    Since we've clearly established that a Class Skin obviously requires some level of compromise, this isn't exactly a 'GOTCHA!'.
    To be fair, the very notion of a NEW CLASS isn't going to cut it either. No CLASS in the game plays 1:1 like an NPC with all their mechanics. Everything still has to be adapted back into something that makes sense for a Playable Class.

    Breath of Sindragosa is an adaptation of being able to 'summon a Frostwyrm into battle'. The actual mechanic that Arthas has? He literally SUMMONED A RAID BOSS. That is not something that will fly for a Player Character.

  15. #535
    Class skins would honestly bring so much flavor to the game.

    While I'm normally in favor of opening up restrictions, I think some would have to be Racial-locked.

    Tauren and Highmountain unlock the 'Sunwalker Skin' for Paladins, Priests and Balance Druids.

    Zandalari and Darkspear unlock the 'Loa Priest' skin for Priests, Paladins, Mages, Warlocks, Druids and Shaman.

    Draenei and LFD could unlock Naaru themed Class Skins for Mages, Priests, Paladins, Monks!

  16. #536
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    To be fair, the very notion of a NEW CLASS isn't going to cut it either. No CLASS in the game plays 1:1 like an NPC with all their mechanics. Everything still has to be adapted back into something that makes sense for a Playable Class.

    Breath of Sindragosa is an adaptation of being able to 'summon a Frostwyrm into battle'. The actual mechanic that Arthas has? He literally SUMMONED A RAID BOSS. That is not something that will fly for a Player Character.
    That's the rub though, isn't it? If a brand new Tinker class was added to the game that didn't perfectly match the NPC on a 1:1 basis, would it also not be valid?

  17. #537
    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    That's the rub though, isn't it? If a brand new Tinker class was added to the game that didn't perfectly match the NPC on a 1:1 basis, would it also not be valid?
    Not according to the standards set by certain posters. Which is hilarious when you realize that virtually all abilities poached from other sources are altered in some way - it's the thematic Blizzard strives to capture, not pedantic adherence to previous mechanics that cannot possibly be transitioned to this genre.

  18. #538
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    If you, guys, manage to skin all of these abilities and talents with existing Druid abilities and talents, without changing how they work, i'll be very impressed:
    But why does it have to be exact abilities? You're making a statement of fact that WoW's currently-non-existing tinker class has those exact abilities, and that is an factually wrong statement to make.

    We don't have to adapt all those abilities you made up in your mind because those abilities don't exist because the class that they're supposed to belong to does not exist.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
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  19. #539
    Gonna take this opportunity to hash out some actual Class Skin ideas to discuss

    Class concepts are generally Blank Slates when it comes to game mechanics. We have 'Brewmasters' that Heal and Demon Hunters that Tank, so let's open up all possibilities and discuss them.

    Shadow Hunters
    - Represented by Vol'jin, Rokhan
    - Voodoo themes and Dark spirit magic that is not-quite-necromancy
    - Lots of Loa themes, so possible connections to animals/spirit animals.
    - Traditionally uses 1-handed throwing Glaives, Vol'jin mentions using Daggers
    - Has assortment of Heals and CC abilities.

    Tanking - I don't see this being a very viable option, though it's possible. Any thoughts on viability of Tanking specs?
    Melee DPS - Very viable.
    Ranged DPS - Possible, not very likely. Guns/Bows seem too specific to adapt
    Caster DPS - Viable. Dark spirit magic is open to explore here
    Healer - Viable. They already have heals and support abilities from WC3

    So which classes would you see adapting a Shadow Hunter to? I would again say that I'm keeping concepts open to adapting any Class, so there's no wrong options here. We might get an odd fit for a class that we never considered before.

    My picks for possible classes in no particular order:

    Shaman
    - Obvious connection to Shadow Hunters already with Chain Heal and Hex. Elements could easily be adapted to a more traditional Voodoo vibe. Also has the Melee/Caster/Healer specs that would fit. I think this could be a strong Core class

    Monk
    - There's a lot of strong concepts here for adapting Windwalker and Mistweaver that could be interesting. I'd be interested in seeing them add unique animations for some moves too, like a more Capoiera based set of kicks and martial arts. Channeled healing spells would work well, Statues and August Celestials can be adapted to various Loa, and brews make total sense with a Witchdoctor connection.
    - Brewmaster would be the interesting one to adapt here. Adapt, or consider cutting this spec entirely? It's an odd fit no matter how I see it

    Rogue
    - Lots of Shadowy goodness, and poisons and bleeds could be adapted as dark magic inflictions. Stealth wouldn't be too out of place for a class that works in the Shadows.
    - Very little use of magic though. Gameplay-wise I'd say it's not as strong of a match as Monk or Shaman

    Priest
    - Double down on the Healer aspect, full support class. Let's go ham with the heals, and theme the whole thing with Voodoo and Loas. Any ranged attacks could simply adapt Glaive Throwing visuals rather than traditional spellcasting, like Divine Star being a Shadow Glaive that saps energies from enemies and redirects it to allies.
    - Shadow spec is prime for being adapted to Voodoo. Shadow Form could temporarily grant you a Bwonsamedi-like form, boosting your Voodoo abilities. Already has lots of mind control and fears, which fits a Shadow Hunter motif.
    - No real Phys Melee damage spec however, but I think this still has strong potential as a class adaptation


    Shaman seems to be the best fit on the outset. I think my personal pick would be the Monk however, since I think there is a lot more strong potential for thematic tie-ins and adaptability for a very stylized Shadow Hunter that would use exotic hand-to-hand combat skills and acrobatic maneuvers. I'd also love to see how Celestials could be adapted to various Loa themes for added effect. Mistweaver adapted to dark spirit magic visuals would be a treat too, taking a traditionally soothing aesthetic and giving it a complete Voodoo makeover.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-08-31 at 11:16 PM.

  20. #540
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Shadow Hunters
    I think the only class that really fits the Shadow Hunter as a base for their class skin is the shaman class, and even then it's not a perfect fit since the WC3 shadow hunters have a ranged attack in the form of throwing their weapons. But we could just make them use those bladed weapons in melee and leave ranged solely for spellcasting.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

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