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  1. #621
    Do Riftblades heal too? Would be interesting to see how thats adapted as a heal spec
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  2. #622
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Do Riftblades heal too? Would be interesting to see how thats adapted as a heal spec
    I would assume yes lorewise, but they don't actually seem to have any abilities in the game. Probably because Horde can't actually ever get to Telogrus Rift and Alliance is friendly, so there was no reason to add any (since they would never enter combat). But seeing as they have mana, we can rule out warriors and DKs. That just leaves paladins that use that gearset.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    LMAO if they say that "oh yeah the Riftblades are basically the Void Elf version of a Paladin" next expansion and we get a glyph for them.

    They ARE a weird case tbh; I got the impression they were meant to be warriors, but the fact they added mana bars to them does imply they also cast some sort of spell... and the only class archetype that does that are Paladins.

    IMO I do think they are mostly warriors, as per Riftblade Kelein using Warrior abilities with a bit of void/arcane flavor.
    Maybe if they don't decide to do class skins we could still get a "green fire" questline for them. That would be a great way to flesh out the Void Elf lore and give them a unique thing all their own.

  3. #623
    Quote Originally Posted by FossilFree View Post
    Maybe if they don't decide to do class skins we could still get a "green fire" questline for them. That would be a great way to flesh out the Void Elf lore and give them a unique thing all their own.
    Indeed, they could use the opportunity to add more flavor to the void (and paladins) but yeah, if they are just meant to be warriors with some voidy powers that's just it either tbh.

  4. #624
    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    Indeed, they could use the opportunity to add more flavor to the void (and paladins) but yeah, if they are just meant to be warriors with some voidy powers that's just it either tbh.
    If they are supposed to be void warriors, then we would probably have to look to the Twilight Vindicators for an example of a Void Knight. As a whole though, the Riftblades seem to be a rather muddied concept. The ones in Telogrus have mana, look rather paladin-ish, and lack abilities, while the one from the Island Expeditions looks more warrior-ish and has an odd mix of magic and warrior abilities, but wears paladin shoulders. Lorewise, I guess if a normal paladin is a warrior+holy priest hybrid, it stands to reason that a Void Knight is a warrior+shadow priest hybrid too.

  5. #625
    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    Dude you can make that argument for pretty much every other Class Skin idea in your own list.

    Sure it might be better as their own class, but you can't say stuff like "yes it works for other classes but not for the one I really want, that has to be a class" that's just hypocritical.
    Just try to read 1000 of Teriz posts , Hypocrite is his soulname and by now i almost dead inside after 1001 posts.

    Its goes like "My class idea better than yours,NO u, my dad stronger than your dad, i am older than you thus i am SMARTER"

    So any class idea can become a skin but not a great The Tinkerer.
    Last edited by cocomen2; 2021-09-08 at 03:47 AM.
    I want these classes in new x-pac Necromancer,RuneMaster,Warden,BladeMaster,DarkRanger,Dragonsworn,Alchemist,Bard,Spellbreak er

  6. #626
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post

    Druid = Tinker
    Im glad you finally came around and saw the light. It was starting to concern me that you were just showing a bias towards your prefered class, but anyway, im just pleased you have seen sense. I agree with you that the druid is a perfect class for a Tinker skin - its all there - I mean the mech was always just a reskinned druid shapeshift, which is the core of all the more popular fan concepts i have seen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssria View Post
    I'm the only guy that has a clue as to what's wrong with the game and how it can be fixed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    Size doesn't matter

  7. #627
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    Im glad you finally came around and saw the light. It was starting to concern me that you were just showing a bias towards your prefered class, but anyway, im just pleased you have seen sense. I agree with you that the druid is a perfect class for a Tinker skin - its all there - I mean the mech was always just a reskinned druid shapeshift, which is the core of all the more popular fan concepts i have seen.
    Yeah, as odd of a choice it first seems, it actually makes quite a lot of sense once you really think about how the forms can all have a tech/mech counterpart, and how the Druid's gameplay is pretty flexible since it's always been a hybrid based on adapting Warrior gameplay for Tanking, Rogue gameplay for Feral.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  8. #628
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Only if you want to RP with bow transmogs, otherwise nothing is really being forced. Caster classes can still use other weapons if you prefer it that way.
    So, the bow is a just a cosmetic?

    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    Eh, I'd just allow people to transmog their staves and other weapons into bows which lets you play something that helps fulfill the character concept. I don't think that a lack of an auto shot really kills the concept since, well, using auto shot is going to crap all over your dps anyway.

    Having your majestic Night Elf riding into battle on her big pussycat mount, pulling off her bow and unleash moon magic shots on her enemies and some healing magic on her allies will give a great visual representation of the concept.
    If it'd be a bow user, then auto shot is pretty important.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    I would like to propose a different class skin for the paladin instead of the Spellbreaker mentioned in the OP: the Void Knight.

    Just color the paladin's ability graphic effects black and purple instead of white and gold, and the ability names, and you got yourself a void knight. And then void elves to be "paladins" (quotation marks are important).
    What is a Void-Knight, lore-wise?

    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    Would also be a great way to get Forsaken 'paladins'.
    Forsaken Paladins would use the Light.

    Quote Originally Posted by FossilFree View Post
    Void Knights already exist in the lore too, they are known as riftblades:

    Notice how they use mana, not rage or runes/runic power. They also use plate armor and 1h/shield or 2h weapons.
    They are the Warrior representation of the race.
    NPCs don't usually use other resources.
    I'm tempted to apply for a moderator position, just so i can go moderator on your asses.

  9. #629
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    What is a Void-Knight, lore-wise?
    I thought the idea was self-explanatory? It's a melee fighter who uses void magic to empower themselves, like a paladin empower themselves through holy magic.

    Forsaken Paladins would use the Light.
    Forsaken feel intense pain when channeling the Light, hence why there are no forsaken paladins and so few forsaken priests that aren't shadow priests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons and as a last, drastic measure.
    Oof...

  10. #630
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    So, the bow is a just a cosmetic?
    Considering we're talking about Class Skins, I don't think it would be anything but cosmetic. We're not talking about altering gameplay here, it's literally just adapting visuals.

    If we're talking about adapting visuals to a caster class that has Wands for the sake of having access to Holy Healing abilities to represent that aspect of a POTM, then a bow visual can help complete that tie-in for Night Elf Priests, making a full visual jump. Kinda like how Mages could get the Verdant Spheres from their Artifact weapon, cept we're talking about Class Skin customization instead of 'borrowed power'.

    I mean ideally they could make Bows accessable to Priests too, but I don't see the need if all they really have to do is open up specific transmogs just for the sake of customization and identity, even if they don't really use em.

    Look at Druid. You can get whatever weapons they have and use. Yet do Druids EVER use their weapons? Never. Every Druid spec does not use their weapon at all.

    Or even Spellcasters for the longest time, you never had the ability to spell-cast with your staff out, you just keep it on your back while you wave your arms. I don't know if they've added Staff-based spellcasting anims in current WoW, but I remember that being highly demanded, since there's little point to having a weapon when you always stash it away when you spellcast. So the option of being a 'battle mage' or a 'Druid who can handle themselves in Humanoid form' is mostly RP flavour rather than gameplay.

    The key component here is having access to the visual to represent the class. So Mages have Staves and spellcaster Swords and that still looks cool while standing around, even if they never actually use the damn things in battle. Druids have maces, staves, claws and daggers that they never use, even though it's cool to have em. So would a Night Elf Priest with a bow, to cover some of the POTM visual flavour that the Priest class doesn't really have access to.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    They are the Warrior representation of the race.
    NPCs don't usually use other resources.
    When they're given mana bars, it usually indicates that they're tied to spellcasting somehow. If they were Warrior representations, they wouldn't have a mana bar at all, just like all the other Warrior type NPCs.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-09-14 at 05:26 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  11. #631
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    I thought the idea was self-explanatory? It's a melee fighter who uses void magic to empower themselves, like a paladin empower themselves through holy magic.
    Read carefully.
    Lore-wise.

    Forsaken feel intense pain when channeling the Light, hence why there are no forsaken paladins and so few forsaken priests that aren't shadow priests.
    1. Cult of the Forgotten Shadows preaches about the importance of balancing Light and Shadow.
    2. There is a Holy Forsaken Paladin in Hearthstone.
    3. Calia is an Undead infused by the Light.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Considering we're talking about Class Skins, I don't think it would be anything but cosmetic. We're not talking about altering gameplay here, it's literally just adapting visuals.

    If we're talking about adapting visuals to a caster class that has Wands for the sake of having access to Holy Healing abilities to represent that aspect of a POTM, then a bow visual can help complete that tie-in for Night Elf Priests, making a full visual jump. Kinda like how Mages could get the Verdant Spheres from their Artifact weapon, cept we're talking about Class Skin customization instead of 'borrowed power'.

    I mean ideally they could make Bows accessable to Priests too, but I don't see the need if all they really have to do is open up specific transmogs just for the sake of customization and identity, even if they don't really use em.

    Look at Druid. You can get whatever weapons they have and use. Yet do Druids EVER use their weapons? Never. Every Druid spec does not use their weapon at all.

    Or even Spellcasters for the longest time, you never had the ability to spell-cast with your staff out, you just keep it on your back while you wave your arms. I don't know if they've added Staff-based spellcasting anims in current WoW, but I remember that being highly demanded, since there's little point to having a weapon when you always stash it away when you spellcast. So the option of being a 'battle mage' or a 'Druid who can handle themselves in Humanoid form' is mostly RP flavour rather than gameplay.

    The key component here is having access to the visual to represent the class. So Mages have Staves and spellcaster Swords and that still looks cool while standing around, even if they never actually use the damn things in battle. Druids have maces, staves, claws and daggers that they never use, even though it's cool to have em. So would a Night Elf Priest with a bow, to cover some of the POTM visual flavour that the Priest class doesn't really have access to.

    - - - Updated - - -



    When they're given mana bars, it usually indicates that they're tied to spellcasting somehow. If they were Warrior representations, they wouldn't have a mana bar at all, just like all the other Warrior type NPCs.
    So, a PotM, or a Night Warrior, would have a bow on its back without any use?
    That would be like Death Knights with cosmetic-only Runeblades or Demon Hunters with cosmetic-only Warglaives.
    I'm tempted to apply for a moderator position, just so i can go moderator on your asses.

  12. #632
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    If it'd be a bow user, then auto shot is pretty important.
    Why? It's just a mechanic. Hunters fire more arrows. This class would be more inclined to focus magic through the bow.

    Forsaken Paladins would use the Light.
    The 'paladin' in this case is just using Paladin as the base for a Class Skin. It wouldn't actually be a Paladin.

  13. #633
    Quote Originally Posted by jellmoo View Post
    Why? It's just a mechanic. Hunters fire more arrows. This class would be more inclined to focus magic through the bow.
    Look at my comment to Triceron.
    That would be the equivalent of not giving Dark Rangers a bow.

    The 'paladin' in this case is just using Paladin as the base for a Class Skin. It wouldn't actually be a Paladin.
    Look at my comment to lelenia.
    Lore-wise, there is no justification for your suggestions.
    I'm tempted to apply for a moderator position, just so i can go moderator on your asses.

  14. #634
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    Read carefully.
    Lore-wise.
    You answered it for me in your next sentence.

    1. Cult of the Forgotten Shadows preaches about the importance of balancing Light and Shadow.
    2. There is a Holy Forsaken Paladin in Hearthstone.
    3. Calia is an Undead infused by the Light.
    1. Your argument actually strengthens mine, as the Cult of Forgotten Shadows actually preaches that the use of Shadow (Void) is necessary as well. It's not about practicing both Light and Shadow at the same time.
    2. Hearthstone also has Ragnaros as an elemental of the Light. Hearthstone is not WoW.
    3. Calia is not your average forsaken. She is a special case. As far as we know, the only one of her "kind".
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons and as a last, drastic measure.
    Oof...

  15. #635
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    You answered it for me in your next sentence.


    1. Your argument actually strengthens mine, as the Cult of Forgotten Shadows actually preaches that the use of Shadow (Void) is necessary as well. It's not about practicing both Light and Shadow at the same time.
    2. Hearthstone also has Ragnaros as an elemental of the Light. Hearthstone is not WoW.
    3. Calia is not your average forsaken. She is a special case. As far as we know, the only one of her "kind".
    You suggested Void Knight.
    The Cult of the Forgotten Shadow preaches against going too far into the shadows.

    and it still doesn't answer what a Void Knight is in lore.
    I'm tempted to apply for a moderator position, just so i can go moderator on your asses.

  16. #636
    The Insane Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    You suggested Void Knight.
    The Cult of the Forgotten Shadow preaches against going too far into the shadows.
    No. It preaches the use of void magic without losing yourself to it. Perfect for void knights.

    and it still doesn't answer what a Void Knight is in lore.
    A void knight, in the lore, is a knight who empowers themselves with the magic of the Void, similarly how a paladin empowers themselves with the Light. If that doesn't answer your question, make it more specific.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons and as a last, drastic measure.
    Oof...

  17. #637
    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    Look at my comment to Triceron.
    That would be the equivalent of not giving Dark Rangers a bow.
    Again, why? Not everyone uses equipment the same way. One class fires a ton of arrows. That's their thing. Another class uses their bow differently. As a conduit for magic. A way to cast devastating spells or healing magic.

    Look at my comment to lelenia.
    Lore-wise, there is no justification for your suggestions.
    Okay? Create the lore. Why not? Lore comes from somewhere. Void wasn't a thing. Then it was. They created that. If they want to create a dude that uses the Void in melee combat or what not, do it. Stuff gets created all the time.

  18. #638
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    You often show up to poke and prod at other posters when their arguments are not sound, but you should keep an eye on your own arguments, as well.

    It is not confirmed that the warlocks lost the metamorphosis skill and had their demonology spec completely remade because of the demon hunter. That's an assumption. For all we know, the rework idea might have come first, and then the developers decided to make the demon hunter class a reality.
    Let's not do mental gymnastics to try and debunk what is very clearly what happened. Yes I'm still salty about it because it was the most fun I had playing as demo with meta just immolation auraing it up power leveling friends.

    Now I'm forced to play as an elf if I want that playstyle but even that doesn't work since I enjoy range classes as tanking becomes crotch watching and melee have to dance to avoid death more than a Russian ballerina.

    Fact is - they took meta and turned it into a bastardized version of lock tanking and a rogue with glide. What their intentions were dont matter, that's what happened.

  19. #639
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inoculate View Post
    Let's not do mental gymnastics to try and debunk what is very clearly what happened.
    Except is not "what is very clearly what happened". This is nothing but an assumption stated as fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons and as a last, drastic measure.
    Oof...

  20. #640
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    Except is not "what is very clearly what happened". This is nothing but an assumption stated as fact.
    Same expansion warlock loses Metamorphosis that magically appears as the entire basis of another class. Yes, completely unrelated.

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