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  1. #1

    Sanctum of Domination Lag Update

    Sanctum of Domination Lag Update
    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
    For the past several weeks, we’ve received and acted on reports of lag in the Sanctum of Domination raid, particularly during the Sylvanas encounter. We’ve been working hard to understand and resolve the issues, but we overlooked telling you that. We apologize for that oversight, and we will strive to do better in the future.

    The most common complaint we received was that there was a burst of lag when Sylvanas is first engaged. Our server performance group dug into those reports, and we found the cause – there are a higher-than-usual number of calculations being done at the start of the fight to facilitate the complex mechanics of the encounter. We’re looking into ways we can potentially improve this, but we have to be careful to not change the design or mechanics of the encounter. While this is something that we think we can improve over time, there will still be a few seconds of server lag on pull for now.

    Outside of that moment, our main challenge in diagnosing these lag reports came from the fact that lag was reported in almost every phase of the fight, and we were unable to reproduce that lag in our test cases. In addition to examining our own internal testing, when we utilized our performance analysis tools on actual live raids that reported they were experiencing lag, the server always appeared to be functioning smoothly. This guided our focus elsewhere.

    What we eventually discovered is that the Sylvanas fight in particular is very messaging-heavy, the mechanics involved require sending many frequent updates to the player’s game clients, which in itself isn’t a problem. However, we discovered that an unrelated change to how we organize and distribute server processes across our server hardware, combined with accumulated changes over time to how our hardware server infrastructure is organized, resulted in our server processes being more concentrated across our hardware.

    We believe all of these factors combined to make the messaging overload happen more commonly and cause lag.

    With our most recent weekly maintenance, we’ve deployed several changes to how we distribute server processes across our infrastructure, which should alleviate this potential source of lag. Please let us know about your experiences in Sanctum of Domination going forward, especially if you can capture video of any new misbehavior.

    Thank you very much for your valuable feedback!

  2. #2
    "We've been working-"
    lol

  3. #3
    The Patient Codah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrinnersGrin View Post
    "We've been working-"
    lol
    Man, this is the most normal, milquetoast yet honest update they've ever done. Just technical details to help the average playerr underrstand what's going on and OF COURSE the first comment is some negative shit.

  4. #4
    I don't really raid but I appreciate the update regardless

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Fleugen View Post
    In many ways it's BECAUSE it's such an honest update that I doubt it's legitimacy immediately.

    Why, exactly, are they choosing NOW to do an "honest, milquetoast" update? When it was weekly with the dev watercooler, that was expected, but now? Now it reads as an attempt to reconnect with a playerbase who has turned Blizzard away for obvious reasons.
    Or maybe... because they actually put work into an issue that affected many players and wanted to share some insight into how this shit work under the hood?

    Jeez you guys are hilarious sometimes. Always this negativity...

  6. #6
    The Unstoppable Force Puupi's Avatar
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    And then there are Korthia and desmowhatever, so god damn laggy almost all of the time. Don't make me mention the world boss, too. Okay I did.

    Why does Blizzard keep creating world bosses from patch to another when they are just complete dogshit lagfests which wow/the server infrastructure can't handle.

    They are:
    1. Stupid loot lotteries
    2. Lagfests themselves
    3. Lag the whole server
    4. Not challenging at all
    5. Not fun
    6. A chore

  7. #7
    It's a classic case of how some things may not be as simple as they appear. As tends to be the case with any game (or any program, structure, etc.), the source of the problem could be masked by multiple other systems or the infrastructure itself. While many people would say "it's easy, just fix X and Y!" when there's a problem, it's really not uncommon that fixing X and Y is neither easy nor guaranteed to not mess up other aspects of the game. Usually this gets written off as 'spaghetti code' (which is legitimate in some cases), however this issue described in the blue post is a different beast... yet it could have the same issues as 'spaghetti code' despite being completely different in nature.

    Regardless, more updates concerning issue and acknowledging that there are issue are a step in the right direction in terms of Blizz-player communication. One of the major issues with the state of the game is that communication between Blizz and the players has been horrid as of late, whether it's communicating what's actually going on with the game, what the intentions of Blizz are, and suggestions/feedback between both parties just to name a few.

  8. #8
    Scarab Lord SinR's Avatar
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    tl;dr our hardware can't even handle the encounters we design anymore

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by SinR View Post
    tl;dr our hardware can't even handle the encounters we design anymore
    This would certainly be the tl;dr if you literally didn't read or understand the post, yeah.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Codah View Post
    Man, this is the most normal, milquetoast yet honest update they've ever done. Just technical details to help the average playerr underrstand what's going on and OF COURSE the first comment is some negative shit.
    we haven't gotten consistent communication in years. them "overlooking" it and admitting fault ONCE isn't enough for people like me. we want CONSISTENT communications. even a "everything seems fine" post is better than nothing and we don't even get that.

  11. #11
    Pit Lord Mrbleedinggums's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aceperson View Post
    we haven't gotten consistent communication in years. them "overlooking" it and admitting fault ONCE isn't enough for people like me. we want CONSISTENT communications. even a "everything seems fine" post is better than nothing and we don't even get that.
    Gee its almost like they're now fucking starting to fix their shit together with the change on how they're running the business.... or are you people going to bitch about everything like companies or people can't ever change and then when they do "WHY DIDNT YOU DO THIS EARLIER?!"
    "Why of course the people don't want war…. But, after all… it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."

  12. #12
    I'm just happy to be participating in the beta! Thank you for keeping us updated, I look forward to trying the encounter once it's finished

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by exochaft View Post
    It's a classic case of how some things may not be as simple as they appear. As tends to be the case with any game (or any program, structure, etc.), the source of the problem could be masked by multiple other systems or the infrastructure itself. While many people would say "it's easy, just fix X and Y!" when there's a problem, it's really not uncommon that fixing X and Y is neither easy nor guaranteed to not mess up other aspects of the game. Usually this gets written off as 'spaghetti code' (which is legitimate in some cases), however this issue described in the blue post is a different beast... yet it could have the same issues as 'spaghetti code' despite being completely different in nature.

    Regardless, more updates concerning issue and acknowledging that there are issue are a step in the right direction in terms of Blizz-player communication. One of the major issues with the state of the game is that communication between Blizz and the players has been horrid as of late, whether it's communicating what's actually going on with the game, what the intentions of Blizz are, and suggestions/feedback between both parties just to name a few.
    "The most common complaint we received was that there was a burst of lag when Sylvanas is first engaged. Our server performance group dug into those reports, and we found the cause – there are a higher-than-usual number of calculations being done at the start of the fight to facilitate the complex mechanics of the encounter. We’re looking into ways we can potentially improve this, but we have to be careful to not change the design or mechanics of the encounter. While this is something that we think we can improve over time, there will still be a few seconds of server lag on pull for now."

    this is literally admitting their servers aren't able to compute the numbers their game generates.

    "What we eventually discovered is that the Sylvanas fight in particular is very messaging-heavy, the mechanics involved require sending many frequent updates to the player’s game clients, which in itself isn’t a problem. However, we discovered that an unrelated change to how we organize and distribute server processes across our server hardware, combined with accumulated changes over time to how our hardware server infrastructure is organized, resulted in our server processes being more concentrated across our hardware."

    this is your part about it being a coding error. so in trying to act like a know-it-all, you come out as half wrong. maybe learn what you're talking about before insulting others?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mrbleedinggums View Post
    Gee its almost like they're now fucking starting to fix their shit together with the change on how they're running the business.... or are you people going to bitch about everything like companies or people can't ever change and then when they do "WHY DIDNT YOU DO THIS EARLIER?!"
    one update doesn't equate to consistency. do you know what consistency means?

  14. #14
    How about fixing world boss lags in locations? I guess, this lags are caused by system bloat.

  15. #15
    Scarab Lord SinR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nzx View Post
    This would certainly be the tl;dr if you literally didn't read or understand the post, yeah.
    If you had read the second paragraph, the most COMMON COMPLAINT is the lag at the start of the fight due to servers not being able to process.

    "there are a higher-than-usual number of calculations being done at the start of the fight to facilitate the complex mechanics of the encounter."
    We're all newbs, some are just more newbier than others.

    Just a burned out hardcore raider turned casual.
    I'm tired. So very tired. Can I just lay my head on your lap and fall asleep?
    #TeamFuckEverything

  16. #16
    Nice to see them being "really nice" and communicative, all of the sudden :P

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    And then there are Korthia and desmowhatever, so god damn laggy almost all of the time. Don't make me mention the world boss, too. Okay I did.

    Why does Blizzard keep creating world bosses from patch to another when they are just complete dogshit lagfests which wow/the server infrastructure can't handle.

    They are:
    1. Stupid loot lotteries
    2. Lagfests themselves
    3. Lag the whole server
    4. Not challenging at all
    5. Not fun
    6. A chore
    You in my raid the other day where auto attacks would of killed it if everyone didn’t crash at about 4% lol it was like 30 sec + to get a move off

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by aceperson View Post
    we haven't gotten consistent communication in years. them "overlooking" it and admitting fault ONCE isn't enough for people like me. we want CONSISTENT communications. even a "everything seems fine" post is better than nothing and we don't even get that.
    People acting like whiny little twats over a lag update is precisely why they don't bother.

  19. #19
    this doesn't make sense, since she doesn't do anything during the first 10sec of the pull. Whats there to calculate?

    The lagg is at the pull, not when she uses mechanics.

  20. #20
    I wish we still had Ghostcrawler's watercooler blog posts to inform us of their design philosophies in WoW. This is at least a welcome attempt to keep players mildly informed about the goings-ons in WoW development.
    Quote Originally Posted by AZSolii View Post
    "yes, let's piss him off because he loves his long hair. Let us twirl our evil mustaches amidst the background music of honky-tonk pianos! GENIUS!"
    Quote Originally Posted by Culexus View Post
    Yes i hate those sneaky account thieves that come to my house and steal my computer in order to steal some wow money! Those bastards! *shakes fist*

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