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  1. #681
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    From wowprogress: # of guilds that have downed a raid boss on N or above, in the last two tiers:

    CN: 44345
    SoD: 22765

    And if non-raiding players were even more likely to quit, this could be generous.
    It gets more grim if you look at characters that log in and do anything that triggers the armory.(that can be a toon that just checks mission tables).

    Raiders have sustained their population much better then most.

  2. #682
    Quote Originally Posted by Ange View Post
    This is why forums really suck for WoW. People like you mention LEGION like its introduced WEEKLY CHORES as a PUNISHMENT and not to bring back casual players who had nothing to do in WoD and demanded a change because the servers were empty and only the small and tiny raiding community was actively playing the game.

    The changes in LEGION worked and lots of casual players had again something to enjoy while playing regularly.

    To turn the solution of dead/WoD servers - weekly chores, random gearing progression that happens outside of raiding (RAID-OR-DIE) was the whole point of LEGION and a clear success.

    I get that not everyone did play before LEGION as MMO-C seems to attract a lot of new players to the forums, but at least look it up why some changes were made and why the game is still using them.

    It would be best, if people discussed the current game they at least know and not magically turn the past expansions into EVIL DEV DECISION LAND, because changes had good reasons behind them and made the game more enjoyable to more people.
    Go back few years when legion released and read up on the dumb decision that blizzard made to make legendaries completely reliant on RNG. You had 0 control on which one you get first. Not to mention that there were legendaries that add 0 dps.

  3. #683
    Legion wasn't a perfect expansion by any means. It was, however, a very good one.

  4. #684
    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    Legion wasn't a perfect expansion by any means. It was, however, a very good one.
    It had a lot of shitty systems just like BfA and SL but it also had a lot of good content which made those systems a lot easier to look past.

  5. #685
    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    Legion wasn't a perfect expansion by any means. It was, however, a very good one.
    Well better to say it became a good one. It was horse shit at the start.

  6. #686
    I disagree. It improved, as all expansions do, but patch 7.0 was faaaar better than 4.0, 6.0, 8.0, or 9.0.

    Just my opinion of course!

  7. #687
    Quote Originally Posted by InflaterMouse View Post
    Pretty sure half the player base didn't quit. Further a lot of them are grandstanding against the issues the company has been having, or using that as an excuse. From all the info I can find on active log in account status I only see the population fluctuating 500,000 or so of a total pop world wide of around 6 mil. I mean there could be other data but that is the data I can find. But if you have info I am generally interested, post your links.
    They had none. They don't even understand simple fact that these magical 50% COMES to experience new expansion and most of them isn't even interested playing same game for two years.. or two . Comparing current population to launch population is massive manipulation. I could understand using imperfect methods to compare expacs 10 months in, but I haven't see anyone doing this.

    How I know this? Just check this forum two years ago, four years ago, six years ago. Sometimes even same threads pop up. Then compare official numbers Blizzard reveal (I know, we don't have many info - but it is regular). Expansions keep losing 50% players after 2 months yet every expac sells the same. Hmmmmm.

  8. #688
    Sure, lots of people play each expansion for 90 days. That may, in fact, be the best way to play WoW. You're running through completely new content once and then you out.

    That said, the problem is subscription numbers are trending steeply downwards overall, not the players lost a couple months after each expansion. Fixing that is tough; WoW is an extremely old game.

    IMO, they should switch to buy2play following the Elder Scrolls Online model where you buy each expansion, can either subscribe or buy each content patch, and sell lots of cosmetics.

    Also they should fully support and release the console ports which they must have had running for many years now. Even if it takes a full year of open beta testing and development to get them right.

  9. #689
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    They had none. They don't even understand simple fact that these magical 50% COMES to experience new expansion and most of them isn't even interested playing same game for two years.. or two . Comparing current population to launch population is massive manipulation. I could understand using imperfect methods to compare expacs 10 months in, but I haven't see anyone doing this.

    How I know this? Just check this forum two years ago, four years ago, six years ago. Sometimes even same threads pop up. Then compare official numbers Blizzard reveal (I know, we don't have many info - but it is regular). Expansions keep losing 50% players after 2 months yet every expac sells the same. Hmmmmm.
    There are numerous websites I have seen which can be googled that show it near 6mil world wide pretty consistently for like 10 months. I will watch the videos he posted when I get home but it must be conflicting data. I know a lot of people lay up after AOTC, I mean a lot but it has been that way since teh AOTC achieve came out.

  10. #690
    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    I disagree. It improved, as all expansions do, but patch 7.0 was faaaar better than 4.0, 6.0, 8.0, or 9.0.

    Just my opinion of course!
    I would go as far as saying legion was good from the start, with the exception of legendary drop mechanics and the first 4 weeks of artefact weapon grinding for off specs. 7.2 was imho even a down grade, as the class order questlines came to an end in a rather unsatisfying mount quest for the most part (some exceptions though), making it clear they can't keep the pace up and neither the broken shore nor the raid was that great (instafail mechanics). Mage tower became entertaining towards the last patch while the idea of the nethercrucible was ass, Argus was mostly fine since most classes were fun to play with easy to "max" artefact weapons and finally sensible legendary acquisition.
    #1) MMO-C should be glad that the British Empire is no more, because they'd want a piece of all the copium trade here.
    #2) Angry players come to the forums to complain about the game... but what loser only comes to the forums to complain about the forums and its users?
    #3)Felating Blizzard too eagerly may lead to oxygen deficiency and worst case asphyxiation. Long-term effects range from delusions up to cerebral necrosis. #4) The WoW playerbase doesn't deserve housing.

  11. #691
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    Quote Originally Posted by InflaterMouse View Post
    There are numerous websites I have seen which can be googled that show it near 6mil world wide pretty consistently for like 10 months. I will watch the videos he posted when I get home but it must be conflicting data. I know a lot of people lay up after AOTC, I mean a lot but it has been that way since teh AOTC achieve came out.
    All sub numbers are guesswork. Doesn't matter if they show that "WoW is dead" or "best expansion ever". There is no official data and there hasn't been for years - neither for WoW or its' competitors.

  12. #692
    Look how quickly blizzard pulls out all the PROPER changes when the authorization comes from above.

    Sub numbers dropping low = remove the bullsh*t unfun awful mechanics and restrictions.

    Corporations and management is cancer.

  13. #693
    I'd imagine an intern doing Find and Replace on "Mac'Aree" is remarkably easier than a balance parse on whatever class you're all whining about this week.

  14. #694
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    even mage tower is back hahahah that blizzard its just funny right now

  15. #695
    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksej89 View Post
    Look how quickly blizzard pulls out all the PROPER changes when the authorization comes from above.

    Sub numbers dropping low = remove the bullsh*t unfun awful mechanics and restrictions.

    Corporations and management is cancer.
    Sure all corporations have this is some capacity but to be fair blizzard is the only company i see deliberately antagonizing their own player base
    Last edited by Miross; 2021-09-09 at 06:36 PM.

  16. #696
    Quote Originally Posted by Falkeshall View Post
    I'd imagine an intern doing Find and Replace on "Mac'Aree" is remarkably easier than a balance parse on whatever class you're all whining about this week.
    There's voice to be replaced as well so no, not really. This incurred a real cost.

  17. #697
    Quote Originally Posted by Miross View Post
    Sure all corporations have this is some capacity but to be fair ,blizzard is the only company i see deliberately antagonizing their own player base,
    they just wanna slow down the playtime because they don't want to invest proper $ into affording proper talent, resources and time that can design a properly fun game.

    for blizz games are a gas-station casino at this point, how to keep someone cheaply hooked instead of how to actually provide a quality product that customers will want to use for years because its genuinely good.
    Last edited by Aleksej89; 2021-09-09 at 04:29 PM.

  18. #698
    Quote Originally Posted by Strike3rd View Post
    Go back few years when legion released and read up on the dumb decision that blizzard made to make legendaries completely reliant on RNG. You had 0 control on which one you get first. Not to mention that there were legendaries that add 0 dps.
    I was sitting pre-bad luck protection on 2 legendarys for 3 months just like 99.9% of the playerbase, despite grinding everything in that time. I know very well what happened in LEGION

    Not sure if you can even tell how much played time this means, but you might be able to figure it out. Legendary progression after having all 26 legos:

    After the bad-luck-protection you only needed 90-100 days to get ALL-26-LEGENDARYS - EVERYTHING in just 3 months

    And most of the progress was done with world-tour-raids and not with M+ spamming, so it was done for the week in 2-3 hours in one session. Is that you huge issue with LEGION?

    Only content tourist and extreme casuals moaned about legendarys after the first few months o zero drops because of the hard cap.

    28.11.2017 26+5 legos


    09.03.2018 57 legos
    Last edited by Ange; 2021-09-09 at 05:06 PM.
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  19. #699
    Because its too late.

    And because it doesnt show new direction - it simply continues the same broken progression for wow.

    implement shitty systems - ignore feedback - find out the systems are shitty and make them better - expansion ends/make up new shitty systems

  20. #700
    Quote Originally Posted by Ange View Post
    Only content tourist and extreme casuals moaned about legendarys after the first few months o zero drops because of the hard cap.[/IMG]
    The fact that you had to play the fucking game that much to potentially get a Legendary that completely changes the way you play your character is 100% unacceptable. There is nothing fun about submitting yourself to the RNG Gods more than a dozen times and hoping you get the one you want. Maybe that's the kind of shit you like to do but it's incredibly arrogant and totally dismissive of one of Legion's most valid criticisms to frame the argument that just because you could means that you had to. The fact that it was RNG in the first place is the precise reason many people felt dissuaded to engage with content.
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