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  1. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by Uvania View Post
    Me as a casual player: I go get 220 items from korthia, 226 from timewalking cache and 239 from shadowlands dungeon event and also do the weekly world boss which gives me around 230ish ilvl which is plenty to run normal SoD if i ever feel like or doing m+ keys between 8-12 with ease.
    Cause you are actually trying to play the game and you are hindered from lack of familiars to progress together and faster, but you are ACTUALLY trying, therefor you can see how in 20 days you progressed a bit , and close to 230, which is enough to melt Korthia with and eventually push to 235 eventually, since you dont have a faster way.

    Whiners on here, and on other platforms, cant accept that if they havent subbed for 6 months and are 200 item level when they were supposed to be 226+ by the end of the previous patch, the moment they log on, they shoudnt do any sort of content or progression, and the active players must accept them into every content, without any qualifications because they paid 13e.

    They are also deluded by videos and streamers, newsflash, those dudes have people that they play with, thats why it looks so easy, and they are also similarly/highly skilled, most of the players arent, people arent equal in-game.

    Thats why no one , including Blizzard takes most of the whiners seriously, they have the data of the players, they can see when players are full of shit.

    Last time Blizzard responded to such a "casual returner, too much life to play WoW", the CM literally exposed him that he was full of shit since he hasnt done anything and yet he was still complaining, and all hell broke loose.

    There is no winning, thats why its better to just ignore them, and now and then when things get too low intellectually, poke some fun about it.
    Last edited by potis; 2021-09-11 at 05:14 PM.

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by potis View Post
    Cause you are actually trying to play the game and you are hindered from lack of familiars to progress together and faster, but you are ACTUALLY trying, therefor you can see how in 20 days you progressed a bit , and close to 230, which is enough to melt Korthia with and eventually push to 235 eventually, since you dont have a faster way.

    Whiners on here, and on other platforms, cant accept that if they havent subbed for 6 months and are 200 item level when they were supposed to be 226+ by the end of the previous patch, the moment they log on, they shoudnt do any sort of content or progression, and the active players must accept them into every content, without any qualifications because they paid 13e.

    They are also deluded by videos and streamers, newsflash, those dudes have people that they play with, thats why it looks so easy, and they are also similarly/highly skilled, most of the players arent, people arent equal in-game.

    Thats why no one , including Blizzard takes most of the whiners seriously, they have the data of the players, they can see when players are full of shit.

    Last time Blizzard responded to such a "casual returner, too much life to play WoW", the CM literally exposed him that he was full of shit since he hasnt done anything and yet he was still complaining, and all hell broke loose.

    There is no winning, thats why its better to just ignore them, and now and then when things get too low intellectually, poke some fun about it.
    This right here is QFT.

  3. #243
    I've no idea how you struggle with Korthia when my ilvl 205 Mage alt was perfectly capable of sweeping the place of dailies, and it's one of the squishiest classes with a 24 second interrupt and close to no self-healing at all. Obviously I was a lot more careful than as my 245 Warrior main but that's par for the course. Don't engage rares alone and don't pull more than a couple mobs (or find geared people slaughtering everything and stick to them) and you'll be entirely fine. This reeks of a "learn to play" problem and Blizzard shouldn't design the game for people who put on entire essays on forum but can't be assed to find their interrupt button.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

    The internet: where to every action is opposed an unequal overreaction.

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    Define "challenge" please. If you talk about "try to find some extra content for yourself" - then yeah, it's not bad advice. But if you imply "do harder content" - then it's not good advice. Because casual and challenge are incompatible things. Challenge requires things like training and some trial'n'error. And this means more time to play, more discipline, more obligations.
    Casual gamers like to play call of duty or madden or fifa or overwatch etc. Playing call of duty multi-player isn't easy at all, and you still need skill to not just die when you spawn each time. Casual just means that they can pick up the game and play and maybe set it aside when they want. Casual doesn't mean they want to just pet the llamas and sniff flowers.

  5. #245
    From the looks of it, it looks like there are plenty of casual content improvements being made in 9.1.5. I really like the direction they are going making things more alt friendly. Also hello world!

  6. #246
    Quote Originally Posted by GreenJesus View Post
    Casual gamers like to play call of duty or madden or fifa or overwatch etc. Playing call of duty multi-player isn't easy at all, and you still need skill to not just die when you spawn each time. Casual just means that they can pick up the game and play and maybe set it aside when they want. Casual doesn't mean they want to just pet the llamas and sniff flowers.
    He said he died 5 times in a row in Korthia.

    Why anybody is still taking the bait pushing this thread is beyond me. (but it's fun to read)

  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by potis View Post
    Cause you are actually trying to play the game and you are hindered from lack of familiars to progress together and faster, but you are ACTUALLY trying, therefor you can see how in 20 days you progressed a bit , and close to 230, which is enough to melt Korthia with and eventually push to 235 eventually, since you dont have a faster way.

    Whiners on here, and on other platforms, cant accept that if they havent subbed for 6 months and are 200 item level when they were supposed to be 226+ by the end of the previous patch, the moment they log on, they shoudnt do any sort of content or progression, and the active players must accept them into every content, without any qualifications because they paid 13e.

    They are also deluded by videos and streamers, newsflash, those dudes have people that they play with, thats why it looks so easy, and they are also similarly/highly skilled, most of the players arent, people arent equal in-game.

    Thats why no one , including Blizzard takes most of the whiners seriously, they have the data of the players, they can see when players are full of shit.

    Last time Blizzard responded to such a "casual returner, too much life to play WoW", the CM literally exposed him that he was full of shit since he hasnt done anything and yet he was still complaining, and all hell broke loose.

    There is no winning, thats why its better to just ignore them, and now and then when things get too low intellectually, poke some fun about it.
    And i havent been playing casually all years either, i used to be a hardcore raider up to MoP release and my current account is from mid-WoD (did a ragequit at WoD release and perm deleted my old account) and i've only been playing casually since i made a new account again to prevent burning out of content and being annoyed over the little things in the game being bad.

    BUT one thing i noticed very quickly going from WoW Classic to TBC Classic is how casual unfriendly it is, it was like hitting a concrete wall trying to get out of my quest greens/blues when i was 3 weeks late to 70 and the grind is INSANE so few drops in instances, limitations like that does not happen on retail which is why i prefer this version of the game over TBC Classic.

  8. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by Uvania View Post
    BUT one thing i noticed very quickly going from WoW Classic to TBC Classic is how casual unfriendly it is, it was like hitting a concrete wall trying to get out of my quest greens/blues when i was 3 weeks late to 70 and the grind is INSANE so few drops in instances, limitations like that does not happen on retail which is why i prefer this version of the game over TBC Classic.
    Thats because retail design shifted for people exactly like you (Literally 11 years ago, but ye, lets blame SL), Blizzard isnt stupid, but all these people in here generally have no clue and cant even read official posts from years ago but rather complain about non-existent problems.

    Its more important for returning players to be endgame ready in no-time (For Blizzard, no-time-catch-up is a few weeks/month, compared to attunements and forcing people to play 1 year old content) or to engage in the endgame, than Little Billies to play Skyrim in WoW because WoW is only about endgame, but despite being a 17 year old game, people still dont get that, they play and cry about it, but dont get it, the game shifted to patch-gear reset for this very reason, but somehow its too hard to grasp.

    And no matter what you say about it, there is always that one claiming how much fun he is having pretending he never did any endgame content since Vanilla, yet he somehow has 5000 posts complaining about WoW.
    Last edited by potis; 2021-09-11 at 09:32 PM.

  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    No, it's game's problem, because it's entry skill threshold is too high. Some people say, that I'm bad player. I analyzed my performance in other games and I can't call myself bad player. My pure skill is actually average. It's Wow, that is way too complex and overall hard game. I guess, I'm just too old for games, that require lots of stuff to be learned to be played properly. Yeah, age makes us casual. It's real truth. Not because I don't have time to learn things, but because my brain no longer wants learning.
    Dude, I’m in my 40’s and still improving my wow skills. I’m constantly learning new things in general as well; I’ve been immersed in how error correction codes work recently because the mathematics are amazingly cool.

    Wow is nowhere near a game that requires a high level of technical mastery to start playing, but it is deep enough to allow people who want to take the effort to learn to do so to achieve some pretty amazing feats of coordination and solo play.

    From all of your posts, you don’t seem to care to do any deep dive into game mechanics, rather treating your interaction with the game at a superficial level, much like the “play Mario for a half hour” style of gamer.

    This is ok, of course. Some game designs allow for that level of play.

    Wow is not that game. It is a persistent world; when you are not playing, other people are. When you log in and do one thing and log out, someone else does that same thing 6 dozen times over hours of playtime.

    They practice, develop skills, and get better simply due to effort applied. It is madness to think that a game design like that should give maximal reward to the most minimal effort.

    I can see from your posts that you don’t seem to “get” this, continually arguing for a level of accessibility that normalizes outcomes rather than opportunity. Fundamentally your argument is spurious. There are games designed so that everyone can “win” regardless of effort, but a persistent world MMO is not that kind of game, and cannot be designed in that way.

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    As for me, minimal requirement - is flying in Korthia/Maw. Flying from at least at 20lvl would be nice too, because 30 isn't even old 60. Leveling is fast till 20, so no flying is bearable there, but 30 requires one whole location to be completed in order to get to it and it ruins whole fun. It won't fix current reward structure, but at least will make content more bearable.

    Other QOL changes would be nice. Such as instant portals, connecting all locations with Oribos. Flying in Oribos. No "no mount" rooms in Oribos. No weird "loading screen" between Oribos floors. More gear rewards during leveling, as leveling via dungeons causes falling behind and making content too hard as result. Overall faster leveling. I was able to level with Heirlooms via 1.5 locations back in Legion. Now I have to complete all 4 locations, that is long and boring. Remove Covenant campaign requirement from Coventant rewards - they should be obtainable via Anima only. Remove souls. Remove gifts. Give 1k anima for completing every calling. Overall increase of Anima rewards.

    And only then it's possible, that SL's casual content will be bearable.
    yeah, we arent getting flying there anytime soon. if ever. but hey, keep hoping i guess.

  11. #251
    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    Some people say, that I'm bad player. I analyzed my performance in other games and I can't call myself bad player. My pure skill is actually average. It's Wow, that is way too complex and overall hard game.
    Show me your analysis please.

  12. #252
    Op, I repeat again: just leave the game.

    You are searching/hoping for an ARPG development progression, this will never happen in WoW, people who play solo will always be the underdog ww because the game it’s not meant to be played solo after a certain point.

    I would love to see something like D3 rifts, but this won’t ever happen because people that do difficult party content will never accept that people that do solo content will have their same gear, they are more pleased in showing their ilvl than in doing the content itself.

    While in arpgs gear is only a tool to do harder stuff and nobody cares if you are as geared as me even if I do way more difficult content, in WoW gear is the ultimate end, if highest gear was in M+5, no one would go past that, even people pretending they do that for the sake of overwhelming the difficulty.

    Just throw the sponge on the ring.

  13. #253
    Anything outside of Mythic+, Raiding or PVP is casual content at this point. And no, 9.1.5 isn't the patch for actual content. This patch is simply tweaking things, making the base gameplay easier to get into and lowering the hurdles.

    Actual assets to create content ... quests, story, lore, voice acting, art, scripting ... look for those in 9.2.

  14. #254
    Quote Originally Posted by Doombringer View Post
    Anything outside of Mythic+, Raiding or PVP is casual content at this point.
    It's ridiculous that they got rid of casual PvP. Sticking a rating on everything was a massive fuck up.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
    Get your COVID booster. It works so much better than horse paste.

  15. #255
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    It's ridiculous that they got rid of casual PvP. Sticking a rating on everything was a massive fuck up.
    They didnt get rid of casual pvp. Its just casual pvp isnt fun becouse you will get insta killed in single global as ungeared char. But this is caused by massive itemlvl inlfation which is caused by 4 raid difficulty levels which exist becouse casual community demanded raiding to be cuttered for them. If anything casuals can only blame themself for state of PvP.

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by Feral Druid ist Op View Post
    i have 2 kids and a GF, somehow i can manage to raid in a wr 50 range and take 2 weeks off ones year and have a happy family live and you tell me you dont have a GF/Wife/Uncle/Gradpa who can look over your kid for 2hrs ones a week? thats sad
    Everyone has difference situations. In my situation, my nearest family lives about 1000 miles from me. Having family nearby is generally for people who never leave their region, which isn't the case for many people. Others may not have the best family who you would trust, either. Furthermore, not everyone's job allows for taking time off whenever you want. While it may be relatively easy to make the time for yourself (I managed to do something similar to you when I was hardcore raiding top US 30-50, but I still had a lot of time limitations), for the vast majority of people it probably isn't.

    On that note, I have to reaffirm that the absolutely hardest aspect of mythic raiding is maintaining a roster, not the skill required to do the content even at decently high raiding levels. Some of the absolutely best players and raiders I've seen were never hardcore mythic raiders, they were actually casuals. This is where the definitions of the term casual really gets lost, as people tend to relate it to skill level... which is completely wrong. A casual player just doesn't have the ability to devote a lot of time to the game, no matter how good they are at the game. The way mythic raiding itself is structured compared to normal/heroic raiding just makes it that much harder for someone of the more casual time commitment to participate, no matter how great of a player they may be.
    “Society is endangered not by the great profligacy of a few, but by the laxity of morals amongst all.”
    “It's not an endlessly expanding list of rights — the 'right' to education, the 'right' to health care, the 'right' to food and housing. That's not freedom, that's dependency. Those aren't rights, those are the rations of slavery — hay and a barn for human cattle.”
    ― Alexis de Tocqueville

  17. #257
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias1337 View Post
    They didnt get rid of casual pvp. Its just casual pvp isnt fun becouse you will get insta killed in single global as ungeared char. But this is caused by massive itemlvl inlfation which is caused by 4 raid difficulty levels which exist becouse casual community demanded raiding to be cuttered for them. If anything casuals can only blame themself for state of PvP.
    There's nothing about PvE gear inflation that requires PvP to be casual-hostile. Consider WoD.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
    Get your COVID booster. It works so much better than horse paste.

  18. #258
    Quote Originally Posted by exochaft View Post
    Everyone has difference situations. In my situation, my nearest family lives about 1000 miles from me. Having family nearby is generally for people who never leave their region, which isn't the case for many people. Others may not have the best family who you would trust, either. Furthermore, not everyone's job allows for taking time off whenever you want. While it may be relatively easy to make the time for yourself (I managed to do something similar to you when I was hardcore raiding top US 30-50, but I still had a lot of time limitations), for the vast majority of people it probably isn't.

    On that note, I have to reaffirm that the absolutely hardest aspect of mythic raiding is maintaining a roster, not the skill required to do the content even at decently high raiding levels. Some of the absolutely best players and raiders I've seen were never hardcore mythic raiders, they were actually casuals. This is where the definitions of the term casual really gets lost, as people tend to relate it to skill level... which is completely wrong. A casual player just doesn't have the ability to devote a lot of time to the game, no matter how good they are at the game. The way mythic raiding itself is structured compared to normal/heroic raiding just makes it that much harder for someone of the more casual time commitment to participate, no matter how great of a player they may be.
    I agree with both of your points, but single parents should have other problems than deal with WoW or MMOs in general cuz you need to invest in to them short term like we hardcore raider do (playing 2 weeks for 15+ hrs) or in a log trem like normal players do (2-3Hrs a day).
    As for taking time off, in Germany we have 28 days of vacation that must be complied with by law and you can tell you boss stuff like " i want this summer of count that in ill tell you the exact date 2 months in advance"

    and yes we hardcore raider are for the most part giga casuals we log in twice a week to raid and log off for the next reset we play many less hrs than a avr. WoW player do. And that's why it's so funny when they say the cant do a normal mode raid cuz they have time constraints, like for real you dont even have to clear with the Flex lockouts nowdays, do 2 bosses log off do 2 more bosses later.

    The problem with this kind of players that call themself "Casuals" here is not Time they are just willingly bad, they know that they are bad and will most likely get kicked out of a pug/guild but wont admit it or just hate ppl in general and refuse to do grp content.

    i have meet some of those in low keys on my alt a dude did 1.2k dps on a 220 mage (my main class) so itryed to help him out like i do on our class discord and he told me "fuck off tryhard i dont care" lol and this kind of ppl will come here and make a post about "mythic raider mentioned my low dps in keys game is so toxic, we need solo content mythic gear now!"
    Last edited by Feral Druid ist Op; 2021-09-12 at 08:46 PM.
    I.O BFA Season 3


  19. #259
    Quote Originally Posted by Feral Druid ist Op View Post
    The problem with this kind of players that call themself "Casuals" here is not Time they are just willingly bad, they know that they are bad and will most likely get kicked out of a pug/guild but wont admit it or just hate ppl in general and refuse to do grp content.
    That's likely true, but an implication that they should not then count would be incorrect. What matters is how numerous they are. If bad players are the great majority of players, then not catering to them because they aren't deserving would be suicidal for Blizzard.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
    Get your COVID booster. It works so much better than horse paste.

  20. #260
    We should be able to buy heroic gear with Valor points that we get from daily heroics and LFR

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