I feel optimistic about WoW

[Kalocy Jim]

I really don’t see what part of “last quarter” was all that confusing but to spell it out it would be Q2 and to quote the investor report it self.



What part of that doesn’t support subs rising?

Sometimes even when you present proof, using Blizzard's own investor report, the negative karens still won't believe it. Somehow they are lying, and deceiving the public (which is a felony and illegal in the US to misrepresent company data in an investor report).

[Echo of Soul]

World of Warcraft net bookings again grew a double-digit percentage Y/Y, driven by the launch of Burning Crusade Classic. Subscriber numbers and hours played were higher following the release.

What part of that doesn’t support subs rising?

If you really analyze what they say during these investor calls you'll soon realize that they purposefully try to mislead people in order to make things sound better than they are.

What they're saying here is that after the release of TBC more people subbed to the game and they played a lot more than they did before the release.
Anyone with half a brain could come to that conclusion of what would happen when TBC released.

Okay then, what happened in the months after that? Did the sub count stay the same? Did people play as much?
If the only "data" they can provide is that more people played the game after the release and revenue increased by 10% or more they're leaving a hell of a lot out.

Did TBC cause 100k to return to the game? 1 million?
The "double digit" growth doesn't even say anything. Is it X % of 1 million? 3 million? What is X? How many store mounts, boosts and character copies were there?

The information is pretty much useless, they also say absolutely nothing about retail but their own armory API can tell us that story.

[Relapses]

If you really analyze what they say during these investor calls you'll soon realize that they purposefully try to mislead people in order to make things sound better than they are.

What they're saying here is that after the release of TBC more people subbed to the game and they played a lot more than they did before the release.
Anyone with half a brain could come to that conclusion of what would happen when TBC released.

Okay then, what happened in the months after that? Did the sub count stay the same? Did people play as much?
If the only "data" they can provide is that more people played the game after the release and revenue increased by 10% or more they're leaving a hell of a lot out.

Did TBC cause 100k to return to the game? 1 million?
The "double digit" growth doesn't even say anything. Is it X % of 1 million? 3 million? What is X? How many store mounts, boosts and character copies were there?

The information is pretty much useless, they also say absolutely nothing about retail but their own armory API can tell us that story.

"Don't look at the official numbers, that's what they want you to believe. The unsubstantiated numbers which support my negative opinion are the only real numbers you need to know!"

By the way, tell me how this isn't a conspiracy theory again.

[TidalConflux]

Okay then, what happened in the months after that? Did the sub count stay the same? Did people play as much?
If the only "data" they can provide is that more people played the game after the release and revenue increased by 10% or more they're leaving a hell of a lot out.

Did TBC cause 100k to return to the game? 1 million?
The "double digit" growth doesn't even say anything. Is it X % of 1 million? 3 million? What is X? How many store mounts, boosts and character copies were there?

The information is pretty much useless, they also say absolutely nothing about retail but their own armory API can tell us that story.

Even if we want to go by the API data, all it shows that even with expansions that people praise now (MoP/Legion) -- the game has lost numbers even during these highlights post-Wrath with population peaking at the beginning of the expansion and then dropping.

[Kalocy Jim]

If you really analyze what they say during these investor calls you'll soon realize that they purposefully try to mislead people in order to make things sound better than they are.

What they're saying here is that after the release of TBC more people subbed to the game and they played a lot more than they did before the release.
Anyone with half a brain could come to that conclusion of what would happen when TBC released.

Okay then, what happened in the months after that? Did the sub count stay the same? Did people play as much?
If the only "data" they can provide is that more people played the game after the release and revenue increased by 10% or more they're leaving a hell of a lot out.

Did TBC cause 100k to return to the game? 1 million?
The "double digit" growth doesn't even say anything. Is it X % of 1 million? 3 million? What is X? How many store mounts, boosts and character copies were there?

The information is pretty much useless, they also say absolutely nothing about retail but their own armory API can tell us that story.

Hate to break it to you, but # of characters doesn't equate to number of subscriptions declining.

Maybe with how the game systems work, players would rather not play as many alts as they once did in the past but still play their main. (which is the case in MANY instances, and in fact (and i know this is anecdotial) most of my friends only play 1-2 characters now, instead of 5-7-12 alts they used to focus on.

So yeah, Bellular's "data" video is complete click bait garbage with the intent of making him money and stirring the hate pot so he can make more money on his hate videos. The guy is a complete tool.

[Relapses]

The guy is a complete tool.

Tools have a use. Bellular's videos don't.

[Echo of Soul]

Hate to break it to you, but # of characters doesn't equate to number of subscriptions declining.

Maybe with how the game systems work, players would rather not play as many alts as they once did in the past but still play their main. (which is the case in MANY instances, and in fact (and i know this is anecdotial) most of my friends only play 1-2 characters now, instead of 5-7-12 alts they used to focus on.

So yeah, Bellular's "data" video is complete click bait garbage with the intent of making him money and stirring the hate pot so he can make more money on his hate videos. The guy is a complete tool.

Exactly. A lot less characters play now than they did back in January. That should not happen, players should play more alts as time goes on, not fewer.
In every version of WoW that has released people have focused on their mains in the beginning and as they run out of things to do they start to dabble with alts. Numbers of characters should go up by a lot over time if sub count remained the same.

[Kalocy Jim]

Exactly. A lot less characters play now than they did back in January. That should not happen, players should play more alts as time goes on, not fewer.
In every version of WoW that has released people have focused on their mains in the beginning and as they run out of things to do they start to dabble with alts. Numbers of characters should go up by a lot over time if sub count remained the same.

Are you purposely ignoring the premise?

Characters =/= Number of Subs.

1 Person (1 sub) can play MULTIPLE characters. Each of those characters count toward the "data" of active characters. People with subscriptions don't have to play 12 characters.

What does it matter if they are playing 12 characters or 1? They are still paying a sub and playing the game. lol I thought that would be obvious but apparently it isn't for you.

[Godric]

Tools have a use. Bellular's videos don't.

I mean someone who finds validation in damage control through jabs haughtily attempted on every other page would find his videos useless without question. So speak for yourself.

But let us not forget. It’s the people unsubbing that are forcing a change in the game for good. Let’s not deceive ourselves. Though I wouldn’t put it past you.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

The information is pretty much useless, they also say absolutely nothing about retail but their own armory API can tell us that story.

If you want a further look go to the transcript and read through it your self they even mention retail there and how it and classic are ahead of other years.

The strength in Classic added to ongoing deep engagement
in the modern game following the Q4 Shadowlands launch and launch of its first major content update in June.
And as a result, WoW remains on track for much stronger engagement this year than is typical outside of a
modern expansion year

Other then that you can complain about the reports all you want but they are the final say on the matter as they are the only Info we have on the actual numbers that isn't guess work.

[Relapses]

I mean someone who finds validation in damage control through jabs haughtily attempted on every other page would find his videos useless without question. So speak for yourself.

But let us not forget. It’s the people unsubbing that are forcing a change in the game for good. Let’s not deceive ourselves. Though I wouldn’t put it past you.

Yes, the mighty unsubscribers who love to do nothing but talk about the game they no longer play and criticize the ones who do play it for ... not quitting. Fuck dude, how dare somebody come to a fucking fan run forum and discuss a game they enjoy.

[Kalocy Jim]

Yes, the mighty unsubscribers who love to do nothing but talk about the game they no longer play and criticize the ones who do play it for ... not quitting. Fuck dude, how dare somebody come to a fucking fan run forum and discuss a game they enjoy.

I don't even mind that people don't like the game. Thats perfectly fine. I am just trying to be optimistic and positive about some really optimistic and positive changes that Blizzard is making to the game currently.

I guess i'd rather be a happy person / customer than a sad, triggered, mad at the world type of person, especially when it comes to the games I love and play.

[Relapses]

I don't even mind that people don't like the game. Thats perfectly fine. I am just trying to be optimistic and positive about some really optimistic and positive changes that Blizzard is making to the game currently.

I guess i'd rather be a happy person / customer than a sad, triggered, mad at the world type of person, especially when it comes to the games I love and play.

Sadly there are more disgruntled exes on this forum than there are people like you or me. In fact, there are so many disgruntled exes on this site that the very idea of not hating WoW in its current state is so offensive people will accuse you of trolling for thinking that. There is some weapons grade cognitive dissonance going on here.

[Trbn]

Relapses is pathetic created echo chamber with troll account and keep spamming useless posts

wouldn't be surprised that it's his alt account

[Relapses]

Relapses is pathetic created echo chamber with troll account and keep spamming useless posts

wouldn't be surprised that it's his alt account

Why yes, the idea that there is more than one person posting on this forum with a positive opinion of the game is so far-fetched that the only reasonable explanation is that I'm posting on an alt account.

[Luxeley]

Blizzard has botched so many things over the last 10 years, I can't possibly say I am optimistic. The majority of the good changes we're seeing in patch 9.1.5 should've happened straight out of the gate at launch. It took Blizzard nearly a year to pivot on stupid design choices which is completely unacceptable. The massive drop in sub #'s clearly dictates the community's disgust. During the alpha and beta, one common thread and concern kept surfacing: the marriage and inflexibility of covenant switching. Blizzard stuck by their guns. Refused to change a flawed implementation (yet again) of a new system and paid the price, which in turn the players pay the price cause their friends quit and pugs become harder to find.

A big difference between Legion and Shadowlands is the fact that Blizzard immediately two flawed systems within the first 4-6 weeks in Legion. They fixed the idiotic prestige system in pvp and the AP system. Had Blizzard responded to Shadowlands blemishes quicker than 10 months the legacy of Shadowlands might be more in line with Legion rather than WOD or BFA. I do believe the worst is over, however. Seriously doubt Blizzard will be doubling or tripling down on dumb things in the near future. But, I can't be optimistic for the rest of Shadowlands w/e idiotic things Blizzard has planned will more than likely not be scrapped. Let's hope 9.2 and 9.3 (if there is one) are better than 8.3.

[Kalocy Jim]

Sadly there are more disgruntled exes on this forum than there are people like you or me. In fact, there are so many disgruntled exes on this site that the very idea of not hating WoW in its current state is so offensive people will accuse you of trolling for thinking that. There is some weapons grade cognitive dissonance going on here.

I've certainly have had issues with things in the game over the years, but even in light of some of those issues, i've still found ways to have fun, and its always been fun enough to not ever cancel my sub.

That being said, yeah, its strange that people become so disillusioned with the game that they resort to calling people trolls they don't agree with or who have a positive perception of the game. It's almost like the whole ex girlfriend syndrome. Since they broke up with their ex, they want the ex to be miserable and don't want anyone else being interested in or dating their ex. Almost like that to a T.

[Relapses]

That being said, yeah, its strange that people become so disillusioned with the game that they resort to calling people trolls they don't agree with or who have a positive perception of the game. It's almost like the whole ex girlfriend syndrome. Since they broke up with their ex, they want the ex to be miserable and don't want anyone else being interested in or dating their ex. Almost like that to a T.

Don't forget the part where they remind everybody about their hot new girlfriend (FFXIV).

[Eazy]

The 9.1.5 changes... I mean most of them should've been implemented the day they add the content, but it's better late than never?

[Drindorai]

I've seen so many messages in MMO talking about how bad is the borrowed power that the recent expansions have, but i don't really understand that concept. I mean, we've been having Tier sets since the beginning of WoW which we just throw away when we finish a raid and get the Tier set of the next one. I think people is following too much what some streamers say...

Ah yes I forgot I am not allowed to dislike something without it being me influenced by what a streamer said.

Thank you so much, I am glad that you knew why I thought what I did.

Thank you, 2 post account.

If you're legitimately trying to argue there's no difference between Tier set bonuses, which change every single raid patch, and entire expansions built around a single borrowed power system, then you're either so far out of the conversation that there's no point in continuing, or just so incredibly disingenuous that there's no point in continuing.

I swear, comments like this remind me of people responding to those of us saying BfA and Shadowlands has too much grinding or MAU-based content tipping their fedoras and going, "Well WoW has always had grinding, why are you complaining now??????"

As if the way in which a system is implemented doesn't matter and just that there are two ideas that, when you burn away all their differences and get to the core, they are similar, therefore they are the same.