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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by nekobaka View Post
    Sigh. This false fact keeps getting spread. It justifies larger raids. AKA more resources than otherwise would have been spent.
    https://twitter.com/WatcherDev/statu...03230542442496
    Originally Posted by Watcher
    Q:I have read posts that claim you have said LFR saved raiding from bean counters and the chopping block. I cant find this. T/F?
    A:There are no "bean counters" -- just us prioritizing. Can justify larger raids, more art, when it's not just a few seeing it.
    ... How is that in any way different? They can justify resources put into raid content thanks to LFR's existence, period.

    From Ion himself:

    "The existence of LFR justifies the creation of more raid content for casual and hardcore players alike."

    https://www.engadget.com/2012-08-23-...cezDaP-Cf5BIKr

    Like, hello...? No "false fact" to be found in my original post.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    LFR is too popular to just abandon it. I like the idea of fixing it to run with NPC's rewarding gold, transmog or some of whatever currency is current. That will detoxify it and put an end to the developer's attempt to delude people that LFR is raiding (it isn't). Of all the difficulties that run in raiding content this is the easiest one to keep.
    LFR is raiding no matter how you try to discount it. The R stands for Raid. It has progression. Basicially all you are doing is finding a way to remove it without physically removing it by stripping it of all reasons to be run. The only delusion is from the players who are trying to dictate what a raid is.

    As for toxcicty, I have never seen it in all the times I have run LFR. It seems a minority of examples is being blown up into it happening all the time.

  3. #203
    I'd want 10man Mythic is all.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    LFR is raiding no matter how you try to discount it. The R stands for Raid. It has progression. Basicially all you are doing is finding a way to remove it without physically removing it by stripping it of all reasons to be run. The only delusion is from the players who are trying to dictate what a raid is.

    As for toxcicty, I have never seen it in all the times I have run LFR. It seems a minority of examples is being blown up into it happening all the time.
    Lot of the toxicity left when they freed progression players from running it. It was blizzard dragging people into lfr that caused strife.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    LFR IS story mode, everyone can complete it if they want to. At the current mindset, not everyone can complete Heroic even if they want to, for there are higher demands, even with Normal groups has more demands than LFR. And sadly, there ARE most likely more people using LFR than Mythic I would believe.
    Missing my point. LFR is a story mode - but not all story modes are LFR. Raids need a story mode - but LFR is a bad form of story mode.

  6. #206
    The Undying Gehco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EntertainmentNihilist View Post
    Missing my point. LFR is a story mode - but not all story modes are LFR. Raids need a story mode - but LFR is a bad form of story mode.
    A story mode would be what the minimally prepared member of the community would be able to complete, Mythic has some specials but isn't even close to being considered it. That is what I mean. And Blizzard is not going to make a completely new mode when LFR is the closest functioning option for it.
    Stuff can be fixed, just get enough glue or duct tape!
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  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by Utrrabbit View Post
    Lol. Everyone HATESZ LFR. Only reason it is done is to gear alts for heroic raid.
    No, everyone HERE hates LFR; and that's not even true, a lot of people like or tolerates LFR even here. But it's the most successful mode, by a lot. If something hurts the game it's that LFR takes so long to come out after a patch.

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Cloudmaker View Post
    LFR is sometimes way more difficult than mythic. I seriously couldn't kill Sylvanas on LFR, I had to go heroic mode to finally do it. Then I was so surprised how easy that was.
    Why didn't you just do mythic if that's so much easier?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Velerios View Post
    No, everyone HERE hates LFR; and that's not even true, a lot of people like or tolerates LFR even here. But it's the most successful mode, by a lot. If something hurts the game it's that LFR takes so long to come out after a patch.
    I can't stand DOING lfr, but, I have no hatred for it. I don't like it so I just don't do it. I think it absolutely has a place in the game.
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Sites have their own audiences with their own specialized opinion makers.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    I can't stand DOING lfr, but, I have no hatred for it. I don't like it so I just don't do it. I think it absolutely has a place in the game.
    I think this is the most praggmatic way to see things: you hate it, don't do it. But just because someone doesn't like something, it should not be removed, as long as it is optional. Especially when it's something that does not take a lot of coding after all; adding a difficulty to a raid is probably the easiest thing after all in WoW.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by Velerios View Post
    I think this is the most praggmatic way to see things: you hate it, don't do it. But just because someone doesn't like something, it should not be removed, as long as it is optional. Especially when it's something that does not take a lot of coding after all; adding a difficulty to a raid is probably the easiest thing after all in WoW.
    I do think at times the rewards have been FAR too strong, encouraging players well above that skill to constantly spam it on alts and even mains to complete tier sets or to obtain weapons / trinkets. Personally, i think there are enough gearing options now to completely remove gear from LFR and instead replace it with just weapon skins, HOWEVER, I am also aware a small group claim that is their main progression content, and they dont do M+ or any of the other gearing options. I can accept M+ not being to their liking, but imo, LFR should not be ANYONES main gearing path, especially in the modern game were covenants drop gear at normal raid quality.
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Sites have their own audiences with their own specialized opinion makers.

  11. #211
    Low intensity content shouldn't be discarded because of elitist personal vendeta against casual players. I think it's perfect as it is. The stepping stones exist so to ease people going into higher dificulties if they ever decide to do so. Casual players aren't in anyone's roster, so let them be.

  12. #212
    1. Remove LFR and Normal.
    2. Heroic is slightly easier than now.
    3. Mythic is fine as it is.

  13. #213
    I don't think there needs and deletion of any mode...

    LFR is what it is. People do it and are fine with it.
    Normal is entry level raiding.
    Heroic is for the really interested
    Mythic for hardcore, and IMHO, the only difficulty with the intended mechanics. Everything else is dumbed down. But that is fine.

    But we have something for everyone. Why punish any of those groups for no reason at all?

  14. #214
    Bloodsail Admiral Cloudmaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    Why didn't you just do mythic if that's so much easier?
    Because I cannot be bothered to spend nine hours weekly on a computer game anymore with a spreadsheet elitist people who I dislike in most cases, who abused me as well on many occasions. Let's be honest here. I have university and better things to do in life. Now I can log into the game whenever I want and have some fun with people I chose to play with. Not to mention the story where no matter what you do and how much filth you manage to kill, you literally achieve nothing apart from feeding the Maw and making your enemy stronger. It's just hopeless.
    Last edited by Cloudmaker; 2021-09-22 at 04:01 PM.
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  15. #215
    Warchief shade3891's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampyrr View Post
    Normal mode can be removed imo keep LFR Heroic and Mythic
    I agree with this.

  16. #216
    LFR is a good system, many people appriciate it even though some streamers may disagree.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    A story mode would be what the minimally prepared member of the community would be able to complete, Mythic has some specials but isn't even close to being considered it. That is what I mean. And Blizzard is not going to make a completely new mode when LFR is the closest functioning option for it.
    Where are you getting the idea that I want Mythic to replace LFR??? That doesn't even make sense.

    As per my previous point - here are two actual ways to replace LFR that I would approve of:

    1. Make it a solo challenge like Torghast, Visions, or the Mage Tower. Simply tune the stats down and delete any mechanics that don't work for one player. IMO this is the best, simplest, and least resource-intensive solution.

    2. Break the raid into que-able heroic 5-man dungeons. Hell, they already break the raids into wings for LFR. Just tune the health & damage down for 5 players.

    Either of these options straight-up replacing LFR would be a vast improvement IMO. LFR is horrible. You can (correctly) say it "serves it's function" as a story-mode, but it does it in a terrible way.

  18. #218
    Personally I think normal/HC could be merged so that you have mythic for the serious raiders, the new normal/HC hybrid that exists for people either not serious enough to commit to mythic, or too serious to do LFR, or wanting to dip their toes, and you can keep LFR for the people with no interest in playing the game seriously.

    Never quite got why we needed both normal and heroic in this current structure. What separates a normal raider and a heroic raider?

  19. #219
    Herald of the Titans Vorkreist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gourbaak View Post
    lfr keeps no one away from the game and attracts a lot to it
    Reality says otherwise.

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