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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    It's meant to be covered by property taxes, but those wealthy enough to own a single detached home are also the ones with the most influence in politics, and thus they've lobbied to keep their property taxes unfairly low, and those property taxes do not come anywhere close to covering the actual cost of servicing suburban developments.

    Same selfish reasons the same types argue that their property taxes shouldn't be used to prop up inner-city schools, for that matter. While property taxes vary pretty widely across any given country, this is a factor that's pretty much always true, because of how property valuation is done. Suburban homes aren't worth 2x or more what a duplex is worth, given comparable size/location/features.
    I remember when MI wanted to spread the wealth to even out public school funding my dad, who was a staunch Democrat, union guy, and overall proto-progressive, nearly shit himself in anger over potentially having a small portion of funding from one of the best and richest school districts in the state at the time to help others.

    The same guy was pissed when laws were passed to tax his pre tax pension upon withdrawal.

    Despite his leftist beliefs, he still had a got mine fuck you streak in him.
    Last edited by Beefhammer; 2021-09-21 at 02:22 PM.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghotihook View Post
    1/4 acre lot 2500sq ft. Pretty much a normal suburban house in Minnesota. I rechecked and I pay $921 in P&I, $160 in insurance and $284 in taxes per month. so the $3400 for taxes/yr is about right.
    Agreed, that's a normal rate for the vast majority of states and locations. $550 certainly is not normal unless it's an unimproved lot in a very remote area, or it's one of the states that does the shell game with taxes. Some more populated urban/suburban areas will have even higher rates.

    There are a handful of states that have very low taxes in certain areas, but all of those states make them up in other areas. For example, they'll have low state income taxes but much higher than usual vehicle taxes. Or low property taxes but high sales tax. The states get their money either way. If you pay a $2000 annual vehicle registration fee each on 2 cars and $0 property tax, or $4000 property tax and $0 annual vehicle registration fee, it's a wash. A state could have no state income tax, no property tax, but make every road a toll road. So be careful to not fall for 'our state has lower taxes', since it's usually just this tax shell game. It's not like they have a magic formula to run the state without taxing it's residents.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by ghotihook View Post
    1/4 acre lot 2500sq ft. Pretty much a normal suburban house in Minnesota. I rechecked and I pay $921 in P&I, $160 in insurance and $284 in taxes per month. so the $3400 for taxes/yr is about right.
    My mother lives in Minnesota, not in the suburbs though, and where she lives, my sister rented a 3 story house out there on 12 acres of land for about $350 a month about 10 years back and I know inflation didn't go up that much.

    Can't say anything about my mothers costs though because where she lives is paid off but from what I was told, overall, the houses out there are pretty cheap unless you want to live right up again St. Pauls, Minneapolis at which point, its like living up against any other dense city, the closer in the area you want to be, the more it is valued.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biglog View Post
    Agreed, that's a normal rate for the vast majority of states and locations. $550 certainly is not normal unless it's an unimproved lot in a very remote area, or it's one of the states that does the shell game with taxes. Some more populated urban/suburban areas will have even higher rates.

    There are a handful of states that have very low taxes in certain areas, but all of those states make them up in other areas. For example, they'll have low state income taxes but much higher than usual vehicle taxes. Or low property taxes but high sales tax. The states get their money either way. If you pay a $2000 annual vehicle registration fee each on 2 cars and $0 property tax, or $4000 property tax and $0 annual vehicle registration fee, it's a wash. A state could have no state income tax, no property tax, but make every road a toll road. So be careful to not fall for 'our state has lower taxes', since it's usually just this tax shell game. It's not like they have a magic formula to run the state without taxing it's residents.
    Well, the $550 in taxes is for an acre of land on the outskirts of Hope Mills, North Carolina which is near Fort Bragg and its for a place that is about 1,500 Square Feet.

    I have never lived in town though, always on the outskirts where I can go 10 minutes 1 way and be in the country and 10 minutes the other and be in town.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Fugus View Post
    My mother lives in Minnesota, not in the suburbs though, and where she lives, my sister rented a 3 story house out there on 12 acres of land for about $350 a month about 10 years back and I know inflation didn't go up that much.

    Can't say anything about my mothers costs though because where she lives is paid off but from what I was told, overall, the houses out there are pretty cheap unless you want to live right up again St. Pauls, Minneapolis at which point, its like living up against any other dense city, the closer in the area you want to be, the more it is valued.

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    Well, the $550 in taxes is for an acre of land on the outskirts of Hope Mills, North Carolina which is near Fort Bragg and its for a place that is about 1,500 Square Feet.

    I have never lived in town though, always on the outskirts where I can go 10 minutes 1 way and be in the country and 10 minutes the other and be in town.
    NC is well under the national average. And it’s not exactly in a high value area.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    NC is well under the national average. And it’s not exactly in a high value area.
    Yeah, true enough, if it weren't for family keeping me here, I would LOVE to get out of this place. Didn't think the difference in prices would be THAT much though.

    But I know living out the Minnesota isn't near that expensive unless you want to go into the major cities, but that the same time, the amount of just empty space out there is insane. Giving directions is like "Turn at the 5th farm on the left with the red dog in the yard".

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    Also, off topic. Expect food prices to go up in the near future.

    My mom told me when she came down for my sisters funeral last month that the droughts up there has been really bad and that the farmers there are going to have to do insurance claims on virtually all of their crops because of it.
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  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fugus View Post
    Yeah, true enough, if it weren't for family keeping me here, I would LOVE to get out of this place. Didn't think the difference in prices would be THAT much though.

    But I know living out the Minnesota isn't near that expensive unless you want to go into the major cities, but that the same time, the amount of just empty space out there is insane. Giving directions is like "Turn at the 5th farm on the left with the red dog in the yard".

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    Also, off topic. Expect food prices to go up in the near future.

    My mom told me when she came down for my sisters funeral last month that the droughts up there has been really bad and that the farmers there are going to have to do insurance claims on virtually all of their crops because of it.
    Depending on where she lives that COULD be true. But I guarantee she could not find a place like that within 50 miles of Minneapolis for less than $1000/mo now. I bought by house in 2010 for $166K, Brand new built for me. If I wanted to live in the country I could easily find a perfectly livable house for well under $100K. My current house would sell for easily $280K+. And location is crazy here, my exact house 10 miles in the "nicer" cities would cost $100K more.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by ghotihook View Post
    Depending on where she lives that COULD be true. But I guarantee she could not find a place like that within 50 miles of Minneapolis for less than $1000/mo now. I bought by house in 2010 for $166K, Brand new built for me. If I wanted to live in the country I could easily find a perfectly livable house for well under $100K. My current house would sell for easily $280K+. And location is crazy here, my exact house 10 miles in the "nicer" cities would cost $100K more.
    Yeah, she lives out in Murdock, you can drive through that entire town, that spans for miles, without even realizing you were in a town. It's about 3 hours from there judging how long it takes to get from the airport to her house.

    Where she lives, its CHEAP. Like I said, my sister got a 3 story house on over 10 acres of land (I think it was 12 but not entirely sure now that I think about it) and she only paid $350 a month for the place.

    But the closer you get to any town, the worse the prices get unfortunately. If I were to go any closer to Hope Mills from here, my prices would double or more. I remember when I had friends who worked in Chapel Hill, it turned out that the majority of the people working in the city had to live outside of it due to the prices and the jobs didn't pay you enough to live in the area you worked in.

    But, now that I think about it more locally, I don't think I would see that high of a tax bill, but the rent prices out here break $1,000 a month easy even for shit hole places. Trailers, the are wanting $700 a month for single wides and $1,200+ for double many places. Buying them starts at about $120,000 for the cheap places.

    I guess I am just in a bad position to judge, the place I am in has been paid off for over 20 years now and my mother lives in the middle of nowhere.
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  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    I have enjoyed his urban planning and transportation design videos. Now that we actually live in a place where you don't need a car to do your daily chores and entertainment, I have to say that I agree with the premises of his videos 1000%. It is very liberating when you can walk, bike and use public transportation for just about anything. Not to mention the health benefits.

  9. #29
    a duplex would help strengthen traditional family values, as a family can buy a duplex and have the grandparents live in the other side. Seems like it would be good for republicans.
    TO FIX WOW:1. smaller server sizes & server-only LFG awarding satchels, so elite players help others. 2. "helper builds" with loom powers - talent trees so elite players cast buffs on low level players XP gain, HP/mana, regen, damage, etc. 3. "helper ilvl" scoring how much you help others. 4. observer games like in SC to watch/chat (like twitch but with MORE DETAILS & inside the wow UI) 5. guild leagues to compete with rival guilds for progression (with observer mode).6. jackpot world mobs.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    a duplex would help strengthen traditional family values, as a family can buy a duplex and have the grandparents live in the other side. Seems like it would be good for republicans.
    This is some tortured ass logic right here.
    You're not "playing devil's advocate", you're making someone who is likely speaking from personal experience defend themselves against the shitty and oppressive opinion you're too embarrassed to admit you actually believe in. It's you. You're the devil.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    a duplex would help strengthen traditional family values, as a family can buy a duplex and have the grandparents live in the other side. Seems like it would be good for republicans.
    You spin me right 'round, baby
    Right 'round like a record, baby
    Right 'round, 'round, 'round

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    This is some tortured ass logic right here.
    I've gotta say, mental gymnastics should really be an Olympic sport.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    a duplex would help strengthen traditional family values, as a family can buy a duplex and have the grandparents live in the other side. Seems like it would be good for republicans.
    Plus they can rent out the other side when they kill their grandparents with Covid.
    Blessed are the fornicates, may we bend down to be their whores. Blessed are the rich, may our labor deliver them more.
    Blessed are the envious; bless the slothful, the wrathful, the vain. Blessed are the gluttonous, may they feast us to famine and war.
    What of the pious, the pure of heart, the peaceful, the meek, the mourning, and the merciful? All doomed, all doomed

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    I've gotta say, mental gymnastics should really be an Olympic sport.
    USA would sweep the medals every time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    This is some tortured ass logic right here.
    Better logic, somehow, than actual Republicans, who seem to have no conception of family pre-1950's white suburbia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by unfilteredJW View Post
    Plus they can rent out the other side when they kill their grandparents with Covid.

    HAHAAHAAHAaawwwwwwww
    "We must make our choice. We may have democracy, or we may have wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both."
    -Louis Brandeis

  15. #35
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    Now they just need to allow some limited mixed use development.
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  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gestopft View Post
    USA would sweep the medals every time.

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    Better logic, somehow, than actual Republicans, who seem to have no conception of family pre-1950's white suburbia.

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    HAHAAHAAHAaawwwwwwww
    It’s less bad than the reality of the grandparents being close to raise the kids after the parents die of covid.
    Blessed are the fornicates, may we bend down to be their whores. Blessed are the rich, may our labor deliver them more.
    Blessed are the envious; bless the slothful, the wrathful, the vain. Blessed are the gluttonous, may they feast us to famine and war.
    What of the pious, the pure of heart, the peaceful, the meek, the mourning, and the merciful? All doomed, all doomed

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