Base resurrected needs update

[hambone2626]

I find myself back playing project D2 even tho the graphics are worse the gameplay is just much more fun. They need to let the guys in charge of that game use the updated graphics who else is with me

[PC2]

I find myself back playing project D2 even tho the graphics are worse the gameplay is just much more fun. They need to let the guys in charge of that game use the updated graphics who else is with me

Personally I wouldn't be interested in that. Project D2 is apparently about reworking/rebalancing D2. Even though a big complex game can always be improved in that manner it would make more sense to showcase those improvements in a new game, such as Diablo 4.

[Biomega]

Personally I wouldn't be interested in that. Project D2 is apparently about reworking/rebalancing D2. Even though a big complex game can always be improved in that manner it would make more sense to showcase those improvements in a new game, such as Diablo 4.

I think you may be misunderstanding OP - they want Blizz to allow PD2-style modding (i.e. with dedicated servers), not to make PD2-style changes to the game. Letting the PD2/POD/MXL people mod the game wouldn't take any resources away from Blizzard, and wouldn't impact things like D4 development.

And I concur entirely: I'd love to be able to play PoD with D2R graphics. The gameplay is just leagues better than the original. Maybe people like Alkaizer can derive satisfaction from doing 10,000 Mephisto runs of 25 seconds each, but to me that's an outdated gameplay concept I no longer enjoy.

[PC2]

I think you may be misunderstanding OP - they want Blizz to allow PD2-style modding (i.e. with dedicated servers), not to make PD2-style changes to the game. Letting the PD2/POD/MXL people mod the game wouldn't take any resources away from Blizzard, and wouldn't impact things like D4 development.

And I concur entirely: I'd love to be able to play PoD with D2R graphics. The gameplay is just leagues better than the original. Maybe people like Alkaizer can derive satisfaction from doing 10,000 Mephisto runs of 25 seconds each, but to me that's an outdated gameplay concept I no longer enjoy.

I understand and I respect your preferences but for me if D2 isn't based on outdated gameplay then it's not D2 anymore...

[Biomega]

I understand and I respect your preferences but for me if D2 isn't based on outdated gameplay then it's not D2 anymore...

And OP's proposal changes NOTHING about that.

You can still play D2R the way it is right now, even if other people are allowed to mod their game for themselves.

[crakerjack]

I’m not a fan of how some of the mechanics work. I’m working on my hammerdin alt and the trajectory/path of blessing hammer is appalling. The mechanics of it feel horrible and kills the spec for me.

Honestly just waiting for D4 at this rate because at least the mechanics in that game should be up to date and much better.

[PC2]

And OP's proposal changes NOTHING about that.

You can still play D2R the way it is right now, even if other people are allowed to mod their game for themselves.

Indeed, however the way D2 must work makes it convoluted at a programming level. Supporting modifications would be a nightmare at this point. Maybe they could think about it in a couple months when everything technical has been optimized and set in stone.

[Biomega]

Indeed, however the way D2 must work makes it convoluted at a programming level. Supporting modifications would be a nightmare at this point. Maybe they could think about it in a couple months when everything technical has been optimized and set in stone.

Those mods all exist already, and the underlying game hasn't really changed - that's the beauty of D2R.

What they took away was TCP/IP support, and the ability to emulate servers. That's a big deal, and THAT'S what mostly killed off the mods in question, since nobody is interested in playing those without a community. I get that TCP/IP has some security risks associated with it, and they had to take it out; that's fair. But I'm sure they could come up with a technical solution to allow server-based modding. After all, this isn't WoW where a subscription is at stake - if everyone has to buy the game from Blizzard anyway, allowing mods would only increase their sales, not decrease them. All they need is a way to combat piracy, and I'm sure that can be finagled somehow.

[PC2]

Those mods all exist already, and the underlying game hasn't really changed - that's the beauty of D2R.

The underlying game couldn't change in terms of gameplay because D2 is D2, but at a programming level almost everything has changed such that you could not merely translate a D2 mod into a D2R mod with a current method. That's absurd, it would require a lot of work.

What they took away was TCP/IP support, and the ability to emulate servers. That's a big deal, and THAT'S what mostly killed off the mods in question, since nobody is interested in playing those without a community. I get that TCP/IP has some security risks associated with it, and they had to take it out; that's fair. But I'm sure they could come up with a technical solution to allow server-based modding. After all, this isn't WoW where a subscription is at stake - if everyone has to buy the game from Blizzard anyway, allowing mods would only increase their sales, not decrease them. All they need is a way to combat piracy, and I'm sure that can be finagled somehow.

There's always a technical solution but the question is whether the demand even comes close to the cost.

[Biomega]

The underlying game couldn't change in terms of gameplay because D2 is D2, but at a programming level almost everything has changed such that you could not merely translate a D2 mod into a D2R mod with a current method. That's absurd, it would require a hell of a lot of work.

The DESIGN work is all done, though. And the underlying architecture can't have changed completely, given how the original game behaviors are all still running as before. Porting a fully designed product isn't no work, but it's far less work than designing new content from scratch.

There's always a technical solution but the question is whether the demand even comes close to the cost.

The three big D2 mods have pretty substantial playerbases. That's a proven, established clientele. But sure - Blizzard is notoriously guarded when it comes to using their IP, and they only looked the other way before because it was a 20-year old game. I'm not privy to all the information - legal, financial, and otherwise - so obviously I can't decide for them; but it would seem like something that at least COULD make a lot of financial sense. Heck, it could even absolve them from investment into actually expanding D2R, which would already be full of controversy because of the many purists around. Modding seems like the natural solution to all of that.

[PC2]

The DESIGN work is all done, though. And the underlying architecture can't have changed completely, given how the original game behaviors are all still running as before. Porting a fully designed product isn't no work, but it's far less work than designing new content from scratch.

The three big D2 mods have pretty substantial playerbases. That's a proven, established clientele. But sure - Blizzard is notoriously guarded when it comes to using their IP, and they only looked the other way before because it was a 20-year old game. I'm not privy to all the information - legal, financial, and otherwise - so obviously I can't decide for them; but it would seem like something that at least COULD make a lot of financial sense. Heck, it could even absolve them from investment into actually expanding D2R, which would already be full of controversy because of the many purists around. Modding seems like the natural solution to all of that.

Okay I think those are fair points. I definitely support the idea that Blizz should keep improving the game and support mods. I just don't like how people seem to have zero patience and act emotionally injured if they don't get everything RIGHT NOW.

The DESIGN work is all done, though.

For sure on that part. Also, the hardest part of any piece of art is the initial creativity. That's 10x harder than everything else combined. The hardest part is done.

[Onikaroshi]

Thing is, what PoD and MedianXL and the like are doing aren't just modding, they're server emulation and that technically isn't legal, guess blizzard just allows them to exist. Wouldn't be surprised if they started sending C&D letters now that D2 is popular again.

[Nymfomania]

Maybe people like Alkaizer can derive satisfaction from doing 10,000 Mephisto runs of 25 seconds each, but to me that's an outdated gameplay concept I no longer enjoy.

This is d2. Get a bot to do the work for you. Thats what i did in .09 and .10

[Hellobolis]

yeah they really shot themselves in the foot by not supporting mods properly/at all.

cynical part of me thinks it's so they can have an easy excuse to disband the team in a few months.

[Biomega]

This is d2. Get a bot to do the work for you. Thats what i did in .09 and .10

It worked in the year 2000, but in 2020, I've seen too many alternatives to still enjoy it.

Heck, you only have to look at mods like PoD or PD2 and their map systems (lifted from PoE, of course) to have a very simple solution that makes D2's endgame magnitudes more fun.

[PC2]

This is d2. Get a bot to do the work for you. Thats what i did in .09 and .10

Why though? Unless you're selling in-game stuff for real money then it doesn't make any sense. If you don't actually enjoy playing the game but want to be powerful you could just use a mod to max all your stats and 1-shot Baal in hell mode. That makes way more sense than using a bot.

[Onikaroshi]

Why though? Unless you're selling in-game stuff for real money then it doesn't make any sense. If you don't actually enjoy playing the game but want to be powerful you could just use a mod to max all your stats and 1-shot Baal in hell mode. That makes way more sense than using a bot.

I mean, you can do that, just not online.

[PC2]

I mean, you can do that, just not online.

But even if you could use bots online why would people do that if they're not only interested in making IRL money?

Games are just software. Getting a billion gold, 99 levels, or every legendary drop doesn't really mean anything or have value if you didn't have fun overcoming a challenge and increasing your gaming knowledge in the process of doing so.

[Onikaroshi]

But even if you could use bots online why would people do that if they're not only interested in making IRL money?

Games are just software. Getting a billion gold, 99 levels, or every legendary drop doesn't really mean anything or have value if you didn't have fun and increase your gaming knowledge in the process of doing so.

To some people giving themselves everything and smashing things is what they find fun.

[Tsarez]

Those mods all exist already, and the underlying game hasn't really changed - that's the beauty of D2R.

What they took away was TCP/IP support, and the ability to emulate servers. That's a big deal, and THAT'S what mostly killed off the mods in question, since nobody is interested in playing those without a community. I get that TCP/IP has some security risks associated with it, and they had to take it out; that's fair. But I'm sure they could come up with a technical solution to allow server-based modding. After all, this isn't WoW where a subscription is at stake - if everyone has to buy the game from Blizzard anyway, allowing mods would only increase their sales, not decrease them. All they need is a way to combat piracy, and I'm sure that can be finagled somehow.

They're not going to ever do that again after the DOTA 2 fiasco. You can see what they did with the modded maps TOS in WC2R
Mark my words, no game that blizzard ever releases will be modifiable to such a scale and degree ever again. At least not in the foreseeable future until someone cracks the game. But no official support.