View Poll Results: How Healthy is WoW's Future?

Voters
597. This poll is closed
  • WoW's Future Has Never Looked Better.

    14 2.35%
  • WoW Will Be Fine. Past it's peak, but good things are coming.

    110 18.43%
  • WoW's in trouble. Things need to change.

    315 52.76%
  • Maintenance Mode Isn't Far Off.

    158 26.47%
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  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Kami Dende View Post
    It's not just removing Emotes, its changing item/quest/NPC/region names, removing any semblance of "adult" humour, removing any semblance of female sexuality.

    It's puritan bullshit and literally anyone that doesn't see that is braindead anyway.
    This 100% I wouldn't go as far as calling people braindead, but some people think the outrage is about emotes very few use, it's not, it's about removing things in the past showing where the future is headed. With things like innuendo, female sexuality, adult and childish humor and historical terms like consorts being taken out, it narrows the path the story can take.
    It's such a strange thing to watch as well, most people would agree with the following

    No violence possible makes for a boring story, too much violence makes for a boring story

    No blood makes for boring visuals, buckets of blood spraying everywhere makes for excessive visuals.

    No humor makes a story very bleak, and tension is never relieved, a joke every 5 seconds makes the story hard to take seriously

    Why is it so hard to accept that no sexy outfits, occasional adult jokes/paintings and a plot where it's possible for a female to be interested in a male (and possibly use attractiveness to try to get his attention) makes for a more bland story? Noone is asking for NPCs doing the horizontal tango all over the place, and noone wants that, but we also don't want to be sent to kindergarten when we go to the virtual world of Azeroth.

    As with everything, the golden ratio is somewhere closer to the middle, not at either extreme.

  2. #282
    Big trouble. This is the first time we have ever had two awful expansions back to back. Not to mention the MMO market starting to make a bit of a comeback with FFXIV getting popular and the release of New World, competition we haven't seen since the late 00s/early 10s with all the WoW clones flooding the market.

  3. #283
    Quote Originally Posted by Ringthane View Post
    Man, once Rift, Age of Conan, the Warhammer MMO, Star Trek Online, the Star Wars MMO, and Wildstar hit, nobody's going to play WoW. Who's going to want to play that tired old thing when there's all this new stuff on the horizon?
    Yeah, let's just disregard the fact that some of those games had serious flaws themselves or launched during what can be considered the prime of WoW, at least subscriber wise.

    Time's have changed, i'm not saying New World will surpass WoW or anything, but if you think WoW will now just brush aside any competition like it did during its prime, it's just damn ignorant.

  4. #284
    The game has been in trouble for a while now, but I don't think that removing jokes and NPCs really matters one way or the other here. The legal problems have done much more damage to their reputation. I think it is customer disillusionment that is the new and quite significant factor that Blizzard will have to deal with now.

    They've been cooking the numbers for years already, upheaving every aspect of their years-long design philosophy in the name of a quick buck, and gearing the game squarely towards the most lucrative target groups while dropping everyone else without second thought. They have never had to deal with disillusioned customers before though, at least not on this scale. We shall see if they can still manage to make the numbers looking decent.

  5. #285
    Quote Originally Posted by Garretdejiko View Post
    WoW will most likely survive, but it won't get new players untill it goes F2P. And if they wanted to bring back people they needed to act fast, so people didn't had time to level something else in a different MMO.
    9.1.5 was a desperate move, but the sheer panic showed with their Heartstone cross event in order to increase MAU.
    WoW will never go F2P, since Blizzard would need to start a ton of new servers to accomodate the initial surge of F2Ps. And then those F2Ps would quit, and probably sooner than later, without dropping enough money for the investment to pay off. Tokens are as far as they will ever go. I sincerely doubt Blizzard even cares about getting new players, they are fine milking the existing playerbase while cutting costs. And at the moment the game stops being profitable, they will shut it down rather than go F2P.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
    When you play the game of MMOs, you win or you go f2p.

  6. #286
    I don't believe that the game is close to maintenance mode, but is the option that best fits my thoughts. Basically when it happens it will not be all of a sudden, i would say that they are more likely to explore new ways to deliver and monetize content before going into maintenance mode and a change of the whole monetizing model might happen at some point, but the day in which they no longer release any content and just keep a few servers open? that's far far away, even older MMORPG's are still going and realase content now and then.

    I chose that option because i do not believe that the game, or any change to it, has the capacity to resucitate an almost 20 year old game with his almost 20 year old core systems. They do a great job when it comes to keep it visually pleasing, but what lies underneath is an old fashioned MMORPG that barely has any capacity to attract fresh new players and their potential playerbase keeps shrinking. Even if they manage to make a great expansion after shadowlands, the aging factor will still be there and their potential playerbase will still be an shrinking number of returning players.

    With that said, the whole lawsuit and the puritan overreaction that followed are just speeding things up, the game has been on this path for a long time before all of this happened. It's just natural, no one expects the game to last forever and despite the flashy 'wow killer' term often used, wow's death has always been something that will happen of old age and after a bunch of years of being irrelevant for the majority of the gaming industry.
    "Mastery Haste will fix it."

  7. #287
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    WoW will never go F2P, since Blizzard would need to start a ton of new servers to accomodate the initial surge of F2Ps. And then those F2Ps would quit, and probably sooner than later, without dropping enough money for the investment to pay off. Tokens are as far as they will ever go. I sincerely doubt Blizzard even cares about getting new players, they are fine milking the existing playerbase while cutting costs. And at the moment the game stops being profitable, they will shut it down rather than go F2P.
    That is absolutely right, there is a large number of people who are so invested in the game (in time and money) that walking away is a really difficult option. I think though that this is the first time that i have seen so many gone for a long time. New World is pretty damn good and i think that will be around for quite a while as Amazon games will want it to be successful.

    Other new games in the pipeline but until the core "never going to leave till i die" group eventually leave the game WoW will make enough money to keep going. Expect more content droughts though.

  8. #288
    classic and tbc servers are alright

  9. #289
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    It's empty because you continue to give money to a hundred other, worse companies, corporations, organizations and game developers while going about your daily life, but can't be bothered to not support them because it's convenient to use those products and services. You don't actually give a shit about the issues at hand, you already weren't interested in continuing to play the game and now have the opportunity to pat yourself on the back and insist that it's somehow because you're a good person and won't support a "bad company" rather than just not liking the game.

    It's empty because to begin with, you're sending zero signals about Blizzard's current "malevolence", or how they "support abusers" since you stopped playing


    And it's empty because you childishly conceive of """Blizzard""" as some monolithic entity with a single moral compass that you're going to punish and correct by not being subbed (though again, as above, you don't actually give a shit about the malevolence or how despicable they are, you just want to fellate yourself by conflating current issues with the fact that you already quit playing a video game)--when the reality is that your best case scenario here is that a non-existent mass boycotting gets the game shut down and Blizzard somehow goes bankrupt, and a couple/few thousand low-level employees who had nothing to do supporting abuse, since most of those people are already gone and the ones left are largely even more outraged and disappointed than the armchair activists doing fuck all, get let go and now have to find a new job; shareholders (the majority of whom are investment firms or banking groups) see an insignificant, minor drop in profit that they don't equate to anything because they don't really give a shit about why the company's profits went down and like you they're supporting way worse things; and world keeps on turning with literally nothing having been actually accomplished with regards to abuse or criminality, while a bunch of idiots shake hands and congratulate themselves on """stopping an evil company""", and then go buy games from a bunch of similar companies doing the exact same shit.
    tldr - keep on supporting abusers

    The fact my comments bothered you so much you have to look 4 months in the past to make a point is kinda telling - we both know you feel guilty

    The only argument you people seem to vomit up is whataboutism - firstly - you don't know what companies I do or do not support, and most importantly - we're talking about Blizzard, not Amazon or Apple
    Last edited by The Vindicator; 2021-10-06 at 10:06 AM.

  10. #290
    Quote Originally Posted by Sialina View Post
    This 100% I wouldn't go as far as calling people braindead, but some people think the outrage is about emotes very few use, it's not, it's about removing things in the past showing where the future is headed. With things like innuendo, female sexuality, adult and childish humor and historical terms like consorts being taken out, it narrows the path the story can take.
    It's such a strange thing to watch as well, most people would agree with the following

    No violence possible makes for a boring story, too much violence makes for a boring story

    No blood makes for boring visuals, buckets of blood spraying everywhere makes for excessive visuals.

    No humor makes a story very bleak, and tension is never relieved, a joke every 5 seconds makes the story hard to take seriously

    Why is it so hard to accept that no sexy outfits, occasional adult jokes/paintings and a plot where it's possible for a female to be interested in a male (and possibly use attractiveness to try to get his attention) makes for a more bland story? Noone is asking for NPCs doing the horizontal tango all over the place, and noone wants that, but we also don't want to be sent to kindergarten when we go to the virtual world of Azeroth.

    As with everything, the golden ratio is somewhere closer to the middle, not at either extreme.
    You certainly don't need a bit of everything to have a good story. There are plenty of great stories out there with absolutely no violence. Plenty of great games with no innuendo or emphasis on sexuality. These things aren't necessary, but they're useful when they serve a purpose.

    The real issue here is just that people don't like having things taken away from them. If these emotes, paintings, jokes, etc had never existed in the game to begin with there would have been no real impact to the past 17 years of WoW. The gameplay would have been the same, the story would have been the same. Nothing of relevance would have changed.

  11. #291
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    Hope you don't use any Amazon products/services, Apple products/services, Samsung products/services, Volkwagen products/services, or General Motors products/services - the list is scarily long.

    I mean, we're sadly at a time where the majority of the largest corporations holds skeletons in their closet, and we cannot step through without rattling some bones. The only way you might have a chance is by supporting small groups and companies, but even there it can fester.
    Of course the idea of only supporting companies that never do wrong is laughably naive - and I wouldn't pretend I do. Ultimately we have to consume - everyone knows oil companies are bad but at the end of the day we need to heat our house. Blizzard is different - you don't *need* to play wow

    I wouldn't expect someone to give up essentials in the name of principles - but wow is not essential

    - - - Updated - - -

    I have yet to see anyone give a single good argument for still supporting Blizzard other than "I enjoy X game" - that is not an argument.

  12. #292
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Yeah, let's just disregard the fact that some of those games had serious flaws themselves or launched during what can be considered the prime of WoW, at least subscriber wise.

    Time's have changed, i'm not saying New World will surpass WoW or anything, but if you think WoW will now just brush aside any competition like it did during its prime, it's just damn ignorant.
    NW got serious flaws and if anything, its a very different game than wow. Meaning, you can easily play both and get two different experiences. Nevertheless, the judgement of how NW will be should be somewhat put on hold.

    I vividly remember the days of GW2, SWTOR, Rift & Wildstar. Back then people were even more confident that wow now was dead and buried. The hype was real, especially for SWTOR & GW2. Lots of people played it alot the first months. Then it died off and wow returned to the front. Theres a decent chance this will happen again, cause even though theres good things with NW - its not enough, atleast not yet. Future content for NW will be critical. If Amazon does future content right, they have something. if not, its over.

  13. #293
    Quote Originally Posted by Adamas102 View Post
    You certainly don't need a bit of everything to have a good story. There are plenty of great stories out there with absolutely no violence. Plenty of great games with no innuendo or emphasis on sexuality. These things aren't necessary, but they're useful when they serve a purpose.

    The real issue here is just that people don't like having things taken away from them. If these emotes, paintings, jokes, etc had never existed in the game to begin with there would have been no real impact to the past 17 years of WoW. The gameplay would have been the same, the story would have been the same. Nothing of relevance would have changed.
    I disagree, with every option you take away, writing an interesting story or making a great game gets progressively harder, for blizzard the challenge is even greater because of the tone they've kept in the game previously, with loads of "rule of cool" some crude humor, a little dash of sexy, a big heap of violence and most mature topics being open to exploration with a lighter tone.

    It is certainly possible to write a great story that is also very clean, look at lord of the rings for example, but that was the life work of Tolkien, a great author. Now compare that to the fart breathers blizzard employs for their story.

  14. #294
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    I have yet to see anyone give a single good argument for still supporting Blizzard other than "I enjoy X game" - that is not an argument.
    Sure, I'll give it a shot.

    If you can selectively scorn and ignore certain arguments that don't necessarily have to try and climb or shake your pedestal in order to be personally justified, like "I support X because I enjoy X", then can I selectively scorn and ignore certain abusers and scummy people within Blizzard, and say that my support is not going toward those certain scummy people, but to everyone/everything else at Blizzard that goes into making the game I enjoy instead?

  15. #295
    Hire clowns and soon you'll find yourself managing a circus.

  16. #296
    Quote Originally Posted by crusadernero View Post
    NW got serious flaws and if anything, its a very different game than wow. Meaning, you can easily play both and get two different experiences.
    Not sure if that is the deciding factor, time is after all also a massive factor and playing two MMO's at the same time is difficult, especially when new content in both sometimes *happens* release within a small timeframe.
    Quote Originally Posted by crusadernero View Post
    I vividly remember the days of GW2, SWTOR, Rift & Wildstar. Back then people were even more confident that wow now was dead and buried. The hype was real, especially for SWTOR & GW2.
    And i also recall that during this time, WoW had over 10M subs, Blizzard was considered a titan of the industry with next to no controversy surrounding them.

    I'm going to take a wild guess and say that current subs, especially when we only talk about the "Retail audience", is far, far away from that.
    That is the crucial difference, back then WoW was in its prime and those new games had to win over the masses from WoW, WoW is certainly no longer its prime and the hype surrounding FF14 has certainly shown that people are willing to try out new games.

    Which by the way, will also launch another expansion this year and Blizzard only has jack and shit to answer - they could throw out T6 in TBCC in december but that's really pushing it.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2021-10-06 at 11:21 AM.

  17. #297
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Not sure if that is the deciding factor, time is after all also a massive factor and playing two MMO's at the same time is difficult, especially when new content in both sometimes *happens* release within a small timeframe.

    And i also recall that during this time, WoW had over 10M subs, Blizzard was considered a titan of the industry with next to no controversy surrounding them.

    I'm going to take a wild guess and say that current subs, especially when we only talk about the "Retail audience", is far, far away from that.
    That is the crucial difference, back then WoW was in its prime and those new games had to win over the masses from WoW, WoW is certainly no longer its prime and the hype surrounding FF14 has certainly shown that people are willing to try out new games.

    Which by the way, will also launch another expansion this year and Blizzard only has jack and shit to answer - they could throw out T6 in TBCC in december but that's really pushing it.
    True, wow & Blizzard is not what it was back then. Thats probably a factor to consider. I see no issues playing several MMORPGs over time. wow retail is a 1-3 month commitment at most, unless you really want to push high content. The sub fee also makes you think twice if you are going to play or not. Im not playing wow now, so no sub. Wont sub until 10.0. Meanwhile I have other MMORPGs to play, but I wont abandon wow totally.

    That said - MMORPGs used to heavily rely on high sub numbers for revenue. The more subs = more money. These days thats not really required. wow is triple dipping with box price, sub + store. Most mmos dont have subs, but atleast a store.

    This will be the case for any new MMORPG. Theres no need for really high sub numbers or insane box sales, the store will bring in the constant revenue. As such, we the player suffers. Blizzard probably realised they dont have to deliver kickass content every year, but not dogshit either.

    I do wonder how vanilla wow would have been launched if they did so in 2021. Would it be as big? Would it have store features from launch? Would boosts/xp gain be a thing to sell not long after release?

  18. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    WoW will never go F2P, since Blizzard would need to start a ton of new servers to accomodate the initial surge of F2Ps. And then those F2Ps would quit, and probably sooner than later, without dropping enough money for the investment to pay off. Tokens are as far as they will ever go. I sincerely doubt Blizzard even cares about getting new players, they are fine milking the existing playerbase while cutting costs. And at the moment the game stops being profitable, they will shut it down rather than go F2P.
    I disagree there would be a surge of new players to wow if it was free. Maybe a couple of years during legion or bfa launch that would be the case but nowdays the people that loved the game now tottaly hate it (I AM INCLUDING MYSELF IN THIS GROUP) and pretty much give the game and the company bad PR in every avenue.

    I tottaly despise Activision Blizzard to the point I had all collectors of the blizzard games and just deleted all games/apps from my outlets. I strongly encourage all my friends not to play any recent blizzard games to fuck their MAU's (maybe that will change anything I dunno... talking with those idiots in the forums clearly didnt work for years) making the only sole exception being Starcraft 2 wich has a place in my heart and I think its the absolute last masterpiece that came out from that hellhole of a studio (and probably the last since that team resigned activision blizzard when the starcraft FPS was canceled and they were pushed into the Overwatch 2 garbage fire).

    Anyway I am a salty ex-costumer and I am tottaly honest about it.

    I think the recent changes, altough most people don't care, clearly show what the target audience will be in the future. The problem here is ... thats not the target audience of the game's playerbase. Most of us are way into their mid 20's late 30's (some even older) and they are painting the game to be PEGI-12. Have you guys played a recent RPG? I just finished Pathfinder: Wrath of the righteous and that game is a pearl in terms of fantasy and adult themes. It has no sex scenes but the characthers backgrounds are great and well built you love characters or despise them, they have their own agendas and motives and they are multi layered. In wow most characters are just purely one dimensional bricks with no charisma and no personality. With this purge it clearly indicates they will be even more awfull and simplistic, a character must have flaws so one can relate to them if they are the epitome of perfection no one can possibly relate (as in Captain Marvel). It pretty much ruins any imersion one might have and removes all empathy in understanding the underlying reasons of said character. I think this is the game's downfall tbh. The lore is god awfull (one might even say it was always awfull) and the direction in my honest opinion is to the bottom.

    Enough rant. Like I said in another post. I just lurk these forums for a laugh.

  19. #299
    The Undying Gehco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    Of course the idea of only supporting companies that never do wrong is laughably naive - and I wouldn't pretend I do. Ultimately we have to consume - everyone knows oil companies are bad but at the end of the day we need to heat our house. Blizzard is different - you don't *need* to play wow

    I wouldn't expect someone to give up essentials in the name of principles - but wow is not essential

    - - - Updated - - -

    I have yet to see anyone give a single good argument for still supporting Blizzard other than "I enjoy X game" - that is not an argument.
    Just like a ton of other things from horrible companies are, among them, oil. But now we are on a forum about games and making arguments about the future of a game. Alas, that is a luxury of humankind, and a lot of the luxury companies have skeletons in their closets, and a lot of essential ones too.
    Stuff can be fixed, just get enough glue or duct tape!
    Roses are red, mana is blue. Suramar Guards, Will always find you!

  20. #300
    Banned Teriz's Avatar
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    WoW will be fine. Once the new expansion is announced and the hype train starts rolling, the majority of this will be brushed aside and forgotten (until the next lull comes around).

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