View Poll Results: How Healthy is WoW's Future?

Voters
597. This poll is closed
  • WoW's Future Has Never Looked Better.

    14 2.35%
  • WoW Will Be Fine. Past it's peak, but good things are coming.

    110 18.43%
  • WoW's in trouble. Things need to change.

    315 52.76%
  • Maintenance Mode Isn't Far Off.

    158 26.47%
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  1. #521
    Quote Originally Posted by Koward View Post
    Virtue signaling means publicly expressing opinion with the calculated intent of communicating good character (to look virtuous). He meant it cannot be done if you're anonymous, as the "publicly" part would not work.
    The "publicly" part doesn't necessarily imply your actual identity. He's posting this view on a public forum, that's the public part. Why can't someone intend to portray their online alias as virtue? Seems like virtue signaling would be possible still.

  2. #522
    Quote Originally Posted by dwarven View Post
    It's not dead, but it's heading that way. It's too old, too many bad decisions by the devs, silly lore decisions, the sexual harassment stuff, annoying elitist community, lots of compelling MMO alternatives that we didn't have 5 years ago. They need a new game really. I think people are just tired of the same old same old.
    That's an interesting point of view, considering that the most voiced complain is that the game is too different from what it was a few years ago.
    I really thing age has nothing to do with it, it's wrong decisions only.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ercarp View Post
    10.0 has to be as big as Legion, if not bigger. Otherwise, there's just no coming back from this disaster. I'm expecting a new class and a full revamp of the old world.
    I don't think that's enough to be honest.
    The revamp has to happen, yes, but one class is not enough. New speccs for everyone maybe? I don't know, but as of right now your are right - it needs to be bigger than legion.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by mbit View Post
    Its good cause addons act as a private difficulty setting. If you get bored you can turn them off for a more interesting fight. For your average player you want them enabled because he cant handle a fight without. It allows nuanced difficulty in same raid.
    I think the main issue is that there are fights that are simply not doable for 99.9% of the playerbase without addons. At that point it's not a difficulty setting anymore.

  3. #523
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    I think the main issue is that there are fights that are simply not doable for 99.9% of the playerbase without addons. At that point it's not a difficulty setting anymore.
    My bet is closer to ~1-5% can play without. But even 0.1% wouldn't be especially bad compared to other games. You can look at hardest achievements in steam games and you will see many games have only 0.1% accomplish the highest achievements. Its still cool that it exists. It might not cater to many people but the ones who do enjoy it are glad it exists.

  4. #524
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Blizzard is a billion-dollar company. It's fine.

    The game still easily pays for its upkeep and development. It's fine too although there are system design issues that need to be addressed.

    Anyone thinking that this tempest in a teapot about paintings, emotes, flirts and the rest is going to have much of any effect on revenues is going to be disappointed. Only the very few paying attention to this give a damn about any of it.
    i do think this is correct, but i also believe that the majority of people leaving wow are not leaving for emotes or even the blizzard scandal. the game design is not amazing at the moment. its been rough for two expansions, and i think people are finally voting with their wallet to not entertain ion's little playground of nonsense.

  5. #525
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    How is that relevant? lmao
    Well done for exposing yourself for using buzzwords when you clearly don't know what they mean

    How can I signal to everyone how forward thinking and superior I am if no one knows who I actually am? It would be just like me saying I have a supermodel wife and earn 7 figures - it's meaningless when I have no identity

  6. #526
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    I don't think that's enough to be honest.
    The revamp has to happen, yes, but one class is not enough. New speccs for everyone maybe? I don't know, but as of right now your are right - it needs to be bigger than legion.
    None of that would be enough for me. I would require them to explain what in their design philosophy led them astray, and how the philosophy has now changed. Superficial changes without explanation of the underlying rationale will not be worthy of trust.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
    Get your COVID booster. It works so much better than horse paste.

  7. #527
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    None of that would be enough for me. I would require them to explain what in their design philosophy led them astray, and how the philosophy has now changed. Superficial changes without explanation of the underlying rationale will not be worthy of trust.
    I have a hard time understanding this mentality. Is it really more important to have a series of blog posts saying why they thought covenants would be a good idea with constant apologies? We get a lot of those explanations already via their own blog posts & at Blizzcon. To continuously ask for more & more is to take away time from Blizz working on 10.0, which is where I'd far rather see them expend their efforts.

    The best apology I can think of for the rough times in Shadowlands is a fantastic 10.0 with great gameplay & solid content.

  8. #528
    Over 9000! Kyphael's Avatar
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    When Disney buys it? It'll make gobs of money from cross-promotion.

  9. #529
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyphael View Post
    When Disney buys it? It'll make gobs of money from cross-promotion.

    And would be in an infinitely worse that than it supposedly is right now. If people think the crusade of watering down/cleaning up the game of anything that could be sniffed as potentially controversial and/or "not aligned with company morals/beliefs" was too much now... just think if Disney got their hands on it.


    EDIT: Obligatory acknowledgement that it's not inherently bad that Blizzard has been/continues to do this cleaning up process; just a statement about those who are making a big deal about it.
    Last edited by KOUNTERPARTS; 2021-10-10 at 01:40 PM.

  10. #530
    Quote Originally Posted by AngerFork View Post
    I have a hard time understanding this mentality.
    It's not difficult to understand. Unless I know their motivation for a change, and have good visibility into their thought processes, I can't be convinced they aren't just doing something temporarily and dishonestly. They have backslid before. I simply don't trust them enough to take changes at face value.
    Last edited by Osmeric; 2021-10-10 at 02:13 PM.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences." -- Robert Louis Stevenson
    Get your COVID booster. It works so much better than horse paste.

  11. #531
    Over 9000! Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TidalConflux View Post
    A game that is going on 18 years, shot Blizzard into mainstream knowledge, led the MMO genre for X amount of years, and made billions is in fact a failed product just because people dont like the game anymore.
    What was once successful may fail later, what failed once can be successful later. Failures can be minor, major or critical, ditto for successes. I know it may be quite a challenge to understand such things for certain folks, but still it's well worth the effort.
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    It's not really retconning though. There's plenty we didn't know from WC3 - a story which is just about 20 years old. The Jailer is the backbone of that story.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    It's interesting how a character that didn't exist back then could be the backbone of the story. Guess that story must have been an invertebrate then.

  12. #532
    Quote Originally Posted by Bennett View Post
    Well done for exposing yourself for using buzzwords when you clearly don't know what they mean

    How can I signal to everyone how forward thinking and superior I am if no one knows who I actually am? It would be just like me saying I have a supermodel wife and earn 7 figures - it's meaningless when I have no identity
    I mean, maybe read my other post that already points out why you're wrong?

    it is entirely possible for someone to virtue signal without revealing your true identity. Your identity has nothing to do with it. You are stating an opinion publicly in order for you to brag about your virtues. Whether we know you as "Bennett" on MMO Champion, or your real identity, does not matter.

    Thanks for playing.

  13. #533
    Quote Originally Posted by Soon-TM View Post
    What was once successful may fail later, what failed once can be successful later. Failures can be minor, major or critical, ditto for successes. I know it may be quite a challenge to understand such things for certain folks, but still it's well worth the effort.
    Thus is the challenge of time. A nearly 20 year old game with active players is very rare to come by. No one isnt arguing that game isnt past its prime eras -- I would argue the MMO era as a whole is well past its time as well. But saying that WoW is failure now is kind of an oversell. It makes money for ABK enough to allow it to continue to update, create expansions, etc. That alone would mean that it is still success from from the perspective of a company.

    Is it not as widely popular as it used to be? Sure, there have been a variety of reasons for that might be (not just alone to game design). That doesnt mean the game is a failure either. Is the game a failure to the players? Depends on the player. Some people like Shadowlands. Some people dont. Some people outright quit the game to play others -- but you can say the same thing for other expansions since Wrath/Cata.
    Last edited by TidalConflux; 2021-10-10 at 05:07 PM.

  14. #534
    Quote Originally Posted by TidalConflux View Post
    Thus is the challenge of time. A nearly 20 year old game with active players is very rare to come by. No one isnt arguing that game isnt past its prime eras -- I would argue the MMO era as a whole is well past its time as well. But saying that WoW is failure now is kind of an oversell. It makes money for ABK enough to allow it to continue to update, create expansions, etc. That alone would mean that it is still success from from the perspective of a company.

    Is it not as widely popular as it used to be? Sure, there have been a variety of reasons for that might be (not just alone to game design). That doesnt mean the game is a failure either. Is the game a failure to the players? Depends on the player. Some people like Shadowlands. Some people dont. Some people outright quit the game to play others -- but you can say the same thing for other expansions since Wrath/Cata.
    agreed, as for wow making "enough to allow it to continue to update" that made mu chuckle, i would say its still making more money than quite a lot of games did at their "peak"

  15. #535
    Quote Originally Posted by mbit View Post
    My bet is closer to ~1-5% can play without. But even 0.1% wouldn't be especially bad compared to other games. You can look at hardest achievements in steam games and you will see many games have only 0.1% accomplish the highest achievements. Its still cool that it exists. It might not cater to many people but the ones who do enjoy it are glad it exists.

    The difference is that on steams games you usually only go for the hardcore achievements in single player games. Beating some mythic encounters during progression IS basically going for "no hit darksouls run" except you do it with 20 people at the same time and you also lose when somebody else gets hit.

    I am not saying its impossible (it also gets much easier with gear and outscaling things usw.), but I highly doubt that there is even a single raid group that can clear a whole raid without addons during progression time without MASSIVE amounts of wipes on some bosses (I'm talking 1000 and more).
    Dear world first guilds, if you are reading this, I'd love to be proven wrong during the next progression race. Would be VERY entertaining as well.

  16. #536
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    I mean, maybe read my other post that already points out why you're wrong?

    it is entirely possible for someone to virtue signal without revealing your true identity. Your identity has nothing to do with it. You are stating an opinion publicly in order for you to brag about your virtues. Whether we know you as "Bennett" on MMO Champion, or your real identity, does not matter.

    Thanks for playing.
    That's just stupid - your online avatar is not you - I could make a new account, have the exactly same thoughts and feelings, comment exactly the same thing I would on this account but you'd never know it was me, so trying to get any level of rep on this account is meaningless (especially for me, who - from the bottom of my heart - could not give a fuck what people I'll never meet think about me)

    Now - on point, if you believe someone condemning a company that allows sexual abuse and worse to carry on, and furthermore does nothing about it still makes them somehow a virtue signaller - well that says more about your character and intelligence than any argument I can make ever could

  17. #537
    Blizzard has turned into consumer good capitalism. Make a great product that becomes very popular, sells out quickly and employs a large following. Slowly start taking away and changing minor ingredients: sugar for corn syrup, whole wheat flour for bleached flour; then reduce operational costs, headcount, maybe outsource manufacturing. Hope nobody notices. When sales start to dwindle, make packaging changes, increasing advertising. Sales continue to dwindle, say it's the consumers changing, times are changing, gaming isn't what it used to be, etc., etc. CANT BE OUR FAULT, EVERYONE ELSE IS AT FAULT. points fingers
    Last edited by Erous; 2021-10-10 at 06:53 PM.

  18. #538
    If they keep up with a predatory tactis throwing scraps at peopole and trying to milk that token money, surely they are in huge trouble. It's a fantasy game first, rotation simulator second. The elitist jerks seems got confused at some point or is the corporate goblins that made them do it, I don't know. They better start fixing it soon.

  19. #539
    Over 9000! Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neik View Post
    If they keep up with a predatory tactics throwing scraps at people and trying to milk that token money, surely they are in huge trouble. It's a fantasy game first, rotation simulator second. The elitist jerks seems got confused at some point or is the corporate goblins that made them do it, I don't know. They better start fixing it soon.
    I think this is the main reason that made the top goblins hire an elitist jerk, actually.
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    It's not really retconning though. There's plenty we didn't know from WC3 - a story which is just about 20 years old. The Jailer is the backbone of that story.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    It's interesting how a character that didn't exist back then could be the backbone of the story. Guess that story must have been an invertebrate then.

  20. #540
    Not very.

    9.1.5? Still no release date even though 9.1.0 come out extremely late and has for most players lost its appeal two months ago.

    9.2.0? Lol. Not even on PTR yet, no name, nothing. Only god knows when this thing is coming out, or if it's coming out.
    Last edited by enigma77; 2021-10-11 at 03:10 AM.

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