WoW Classic - Season of Mastery Updates, Finkle Einhorn Renamed to Pip Quickwit

[Naoto]

As I said earlier, it's because Finkle wasn't actually trans. They pretended to be another sex in order to get away with crimes rather than it being an identity thing. This further fuels transphobic rhetoric that all trans people are lying and are just doing it for ulterior, sinister motives.

So you're saying the movie is transphobic because a guy became a women thus making people assume all trans people are lying? so you telling me no movie can ever have a man dress up as a female or else it will be considered transphobic as they will fuel the idea that trans people are lying?

Honest to god, the amount of shit I read on these forums nowadays is literally giving me brain damage, people bringing up a scene from 20 year old movies and analyzing the complete shit out of it just to come to the most retarded conclusions to prove a point is incredible.

[zorkuus]

How is "I accidentally kissed a trans person so now I'm going to vomit and cry in a corner" not transphobic?

It's a comedic movie. You could try living your life without taking things so seriously all the time...

[TheRevenantHero]

So?

Some of those people are only doing it because they think it's trendy. Some people only do it for nefarious reasons. Shouldn't those people be called out for it just because they happened to become trans in the process?

If trans people want to be considered normal, they should also take on what it means to be normal: to get mocked and laughed at once in a while. It happens to everyone. It's part of being a normal human being. If some can't handle that maybe they should figure out why that is.

No. Nobody does it to be "trendy". That's transphobic mentality and nothing more. Trans individuals are murdered more often than other people in the LGBT+ community and nothing is done because of trans panic defense being a legal defense. The only people who take the mentality of "you need to accept getting mocked and laughed at once in a while" are people who have never actually been mocked or laughed at. And based on your signature, it's clear what kind of bigot you are.

[Pakheth]

So?

Some of those people are only doing it because they think it's trendy. Some people only do it for nefarious reasons. Shouldn't those people be called out for it just because they happened to become trans in the process?

If trans people want to be considered normal, they should also take on what it means to be normal: to get mocked and laughed at once in a while. It happens to everyone. It's part of being a normal human being. If some can't handle that maybe something else is wrong with them.

When you are constantly being mocked and have very little positive being said about you it gets very tiring, and trans people are still being prosecuted and hated for just being trans. It's past "just a few jokes". They have been hated for decades and telling them they should just suck it up because "everyone should take a joke" is just disrespectful at this point. Put yourself in their shoes for once.

[Naoto]

How is "I accidentally kissed a trans person so now I'm going to vomit and cry in a corner" not transphobic?

You can kiss someone you're not attracted to and NOT feel the need to vomit uncontrollably.

Imagine the scene playing out exactly the same way, except instead of "she has a winky", the joke was "her skin is darker than you thought it was". Would you still be defending that?

He's going to vomit because he kissed a guy. A FUCKING GUY. Nobody ever viewed the person as a "trans person" because it was a guy, YES A GUY, dressing up as a women. If you asked 100 straight men to kiss another man how many do you think would do so? stop twisting shit to prove your brain dead point. This was a guy, not a trans person.

[TheRevenantHero]

Holy hell. It's a silly movie. One has to be a total dumbass to interpret it in such a way that all trans people behave this way. We shouldn't make the world revolve around what dumb people might think.

Right right. So we should just excuse ALL movies no matter how offensive the jokes are? Who cares if the movie contains blackface right? It's just a movie.

See how fucking stupid that sounds?

[Mixxy]

Are you actually serious? so now saying men who dress up as women to escape the law is transphobic because we're saying they are not trans? holy fucking shit. Why did this "person" suddenly become a trans person? was that the narrative from the start of the movie? or do people just automatically assume because someone tucks the cock away and slips on a wig they are considered trans? we're talking about a guy, who hid his identity by becoming a woman and now you're acting like it was a real trans person the entire time?

I'm saying the "bad guy pretending to be trans" idea is transphobic because it literally does not happen, and it's an idea used commonly and exhaustively to deny trans people equal rights.

People are using a made-up scenario to justify punishing a very real group of people.

It is literally creating and pushing the narrative that "not all trans people are REAL trans people - some of them are evil fakers!" How is that not transphobic?

[TheRevenantHero]

So you're saying the movie is transphobic because a guy became a women thus making people assume all trans people are lying? so you telling me no movie can ever have a man dress up as a female or else it will be considered transphobic as they will fuel the idea that trans people are lying?

Honest to god, the amount of shit I read on these forums nowadays is literally giving me brain damage, people bringing up a scene from 20 year old movies and analyzing the complete shit out of it just to come to the most retarded conclusions to prove a point is incredible.

You clearly are ignorant to what trans individuals go through all the time. "Jokes" like the one in the Ace Ventura movie help fuel shit like trans panic defense staying as a totally normal thing in society.

[zorkuus]

Right right. So we should just excuse ALL movies no matter how offensive the jokes are? Who cares if the movie contains blackface right? It's just a movie.

See how fucking stupid that sounds?

And what's your solution? Ban everything that you find offensive? How is that any better?

[Vintersol]

All you're doing is trying to trivialize how damaging to the trans community that "joke" in the first Ace Ventura movie is. That's all. Either that or you are ignorant to the exceptionally toxic attitude people have against trans individuals in the USA. There are still NUMEROUS states that allow the trans panic defense and shit like the Finkle "joke" just help reinforce it.

Stop overexaggerating things.

[Naoto]

I'm saying the "bad guy pretending to be trans" idea is transphobic because it literally does not happen, and it's an idea used commonly and exhaustively to deny trans people equal rights.

People are using a made-up scenario to justify punishing a very real group of people.

It is literally creating and pushing the narrative that "not all trans people are REAL trans people - some of them are evil fakers!" How is that not transphobic?

Yes because not fucking once in the history of mankind has a man ever pretended to be female, nah this movie has done something that has and never will be achieved ever again because it literally never happens.

It didn't create and push shit, it was a simple comedic movie where a guy commits a crime and dresses up to not get caught yet for some reason some 20 years later people like you are analyzing something that isn't there and claiming that movie hurts trans people? people like you are trying to force square pegs into round holes.

[TheRevenantHero]

Stop overexaggerating things.

Nothing I said is an exaggeration. Everything I said is fact.

- - - Updated - - -

And what's your solution? Ban everything that you find offensive? How is that any better?

No. My solution is not using groups of people who are already treated like trash in society as the butt of a fucked up joke. Plenty of movies are funny without needing to make incredibly offensive comments.

[Naoto]

You clearly are ignorant to what trans individuals go through all the time. "Jokes" like the one in the Ace Ventura movie help fuel shit like trans panic defense staying as a totally normal thing in society.

Do fat people not go through shit? maybe we should stop movies making jokes about weight right? when the actual fuck have you ever heard of a case of transphobic hate being brought about because someone watched Ace Ventura?

[Grimbold21]

All you're doing is trying to trivialize how damaging to the trans community that "joke" in the first Ace Ventura movie is. That's all. Either that or you are ignorant to the exceptionally toxic attitude people have against trans individuals in the USA. There are still NUMEROUS states that allow the trans panic defense and shit like the Finkle "joke" just help reinforce it.

The same accusation can be made towards you. All you're doing is overanalyze a situation to problematize something that could as easily not be there.

Also, I would also ask you to not play the same card that the person making the tweet did. What trans community? Who are you speaking for? This is one of the greatest issues with anyone that claims a defense in the name of someone else.

You don't have the slightest clue for whom you're speaking of. Apologies, you do. You may have found a set of individuals that corroborates your perspective, which, again, is the largest problem here. So you know some people - who I will risk saying aren't even trans - that think this is problematic. Alright, here, I found some trans people that think a) this isn't a problem b) they actually find it funny c) actually resent the people problematizing this and d) think this is so trivial and actually detrimental to the bigger pursuit for equal rights.

Now what?

Just bear in mind that you don't get to get away with "A reinforces B so we should stop it". That's just a different flavor of "we can't have violence in media"

[TheRevenantHero]

Yes because not fucking once in the history of mankind has a man ever pretended to be female, nah this movie has done something that has and never will be achieved ever again because it literally never happens.

It didn't create and push shit, it was a simple comedic movie where a guy commits a crime and dresses up to not get caught yet for some reason some 20 years later people like you are analyzing something that isn't there and claiming that movie hurts trans people? people like you are trying to force square pegs into round holes.

People have been saying it's damaging to trans individuals since it released. It was just far more acceptable back then. But go off I guess.

- - - Updated - - -

Do fat people not go through shit? maybe we should stop movies making jokes about weight right? when the actual fuck have you ever heard of a case of transphobic hate being brought about because someone watched Ace Ventura?

Are you capable of anything more than strawman arguments?

[Naoto]

Nothing I said is an exaggeration. Everything I said is fact.

- - - Updated - - -



No. My solution is not using groups of people who are already treated like trash in society as the butt of a fucked up joke. Plenty of movies are funny without needing to make incredibly offensive comments.

So who does that leave for movies to make "jokes" about? because you can use that argument for pretty much everyone.

[DarkAmbient]

Men disguising themselves as women to commit crimes has been a thing since forever. Just last week here a guy disguised himself as a woman to throw acid in his former lover's face. It's not transphobic to depict these things in movies.

[zorkuus]

No. My solution is not using groups of people who are already treated like trash in society as the butt of a fucked up joke. Plenty of movies are funny without needing to make incredibly offensive comments.

Would this include young men who are marginalized as "nerdy weirdos", "incels" and so on?

[TheRevenantHero]

The same accusation can be made towards you. All you're doing is overanalyze a situation to problematize something that could as easily not be there.

Also, I would also ask you to not play the same card that the person making the tweet did. What trans community? Who are you speaking for? This is one of the greatest issues with anyone that claims a defense in the name of someone else.

You don't have the slightest clue for whom you're speaking of. Apologies, you do. You may have found a set of individuals that corroborates your perspective, which, again, is the largest problem here. So you know some people - who I will risk saying aren't even trans - that think this is problematic. Alright, here, I found some trans people that think a) this isn't a problem b) they actually find it funny c) actually resent the people problematizing this and d) think this is so trivial and actually detrimental to the bigger pursuit for equal rights.

Now what?

Just bear in mind that you don't get to get away with "A reinforces B so we should stop it". That's just a different flavor of "we can't have violence in media"

As I responded to someone else, this was a problem back when it was released too. Society has been evolving ever since. Much like black face becoming a truly offensive thing, "jokes" like the one in the Ace Ventura movie aren't accepted anymore.

- - - Updated - - -

Would this include young men who are marginalized as "nerdy weirdos", "incels" and so on?

Nice strawman.

- - - Updated - - -

So who does that leave for movies to make "jokes" about? because you can use that argument for pretty much everyone.

If the only way you can make a joke is by making another group of people a mockery, you're not funny.

[Naoto]

People have been saying it's damaging to trans individuals since it released. It was just far more acceptable back then. But go off I guess.

- - - Updated - - -



Are you capable of anything more than strawman arguments?

Are you capable of talking sense or just complete and utter nonsense because it better suits your agenda? people assuming the joke was kissing trans people is disgusting when the joke was it's actually disgusting for a man to kiss another man. If anything the movie should be considered homophobic yet here you are, acting like it's the reason people are transphobic 20 years later.