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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Paperfox View Post
    I wonder if there is a way that Blizz can build (or continue to build on) WoW so that it appeals to an even larger percentage of the population. That might be cool.
    Good Content (tm)?

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Femininity View Post
    I might have the same qualifications on paper as a man up for the same position, but if he's proven more effective or is a better fit for the position, why would I want the job with an asterisk?
    If he's proven more effective or is a better fit then how do you have the same qualifications?

  3. #43
    Dreadlord Femininity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    If he's proven more effective or is a better fit then how do you have the same qualifications?
    If a job has tangible or easily quantifiable baseline qualification requirements, and more than one individual in an applicant pool meets them, you move on to softer metrics to determine suitability. Hence why I said 'on paper'
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  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    Is this parody?
    Must be. What about those people who just like cats? Or those who think there's nothing funnier than riding into battle on a rather large housecat?

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Femininity View Post
    If a job has tangible or easily quantifiable baseline qualification requirements, and more than one individual in an applicant pool meets them, you move on to softer metrics to determine suitability. Hence why I said 'on paper'
    I am curious what "softer metrics" you are specifically referring to which would not be on said paper and mark you as clearly less qualified and effective.

  6. #46
    Stealthed Defender unbound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    nope, people think its sexist if gender plays ANY role in hiring proces, people should be hired based on skill not gender, hiring more women doesnt magicaly guarantee the product will be better, same as hiring more men, hiring people who know what the fuck they do actualy might...
    and that is the issue, if you HAVE TO hire woman you will pass on man who would be perfect for the job just bcs he is man, which is DEFINITELY sexist (and would be ofc other way around)

    thing is gaming companies are predominantly male bcs there is more men interested in videogames, simple as that, thats why more are working in the field, and are more likely to have better qualification or more experience...

    and funny how its only "problem" in fields that are predominantly male where the job is not physicaly difficult or disgusting, but is well paid... somehow nobody have problem with garbage disposal workers being mostly men...
    I have a close relative who went into game design. There were only a handful of women (including herself) during her years there. She graduated at the top of her class. She had *far* more breadth of game experience (the vast majority of the males only every played and focused on first person shooters). She won competitions while there.

    She didn't get nearly as many offers as the obviously less qualified males.

    Nobody is asking for less qualified women to get jobs that would go to more qualified males. The reality is that less qualified males are hired over more qualified women *all* *the* *time* in industries like game design, programming, and cybersecurity.

    Why does this happen? Because of people very much like you. You *think* you are being fair, but you (like most) have bias in your decisions, and thus pick less qualified males all the time.

    Furthermore, the primary reason many women don't want to go in these fields is because, again, of people very much like you. The rude and lewd comments. The condescension. The assumption that men are inherently more qualified.

    By making a commitment to hiring more women, they aren't looking to make their company less effective. You are an utter moron if you think that is what is going on. Instead, they are making a real effort to attract even more people to the industry so that they can hire even more qualified people.

    And it's funny how people like you point out low-paying male dominated fields while completely ignoring the tons of low-paying female dominated fields like teachers and child care.

    Spend more time learning and less time spouting nonsense.

  7. #47
    Brewmaster Pakheth's Avatar
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    As long as there exist people out there who think the opposite gender can't do a specific job, this will be a problem that will need artificial fixing. Blizzard has proven they had a culture that was toxic towards the female gender and minorities. This is an answer to that, although not perfect.

    My female friend working in a tech shop can confirm this bias still exists and how toxic it is. She was hired specifically because of her knowledge in building computers but she constantly have to deal with male customers wanting to talk to a male employee instead because "a woman can't possibly know that stuff" although she quickly proves them wrong. She finds it very demotivating even though her coworkers are very supporting of her and will always just point to her regarding any PC issue.
    Her being a techie does make her a role model for other girls who maybe don't feel like they can work with this stuff because of artificial social roles. The game industry is the same. If it is not welcoming towards a specific gender then of course less people of that gender will apply. And female interest in gaming has risen substantially the last few decades.

    Because of this I support evening out the odds even though I would prefer all applications to be genderless/photoless and being based 100% on merit. Problem is you need only one asshole, female or male doesn't matter, to ruin the days of other coworkers and not dealing with that because you lean towards one gender more than the other is unacceptable.

  8. #48
    Dreadlord Femininity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    I am curious what "softer metrics" you are specifically referring to which would not be on said paper and mark you as clearly less qualified.
    I'm not specifically referring to anything. There is a broad array of soft metrics that can determine suitability for a particular role, outside of whatever the baseline requirements are. It largely depends on the field, the job position, the hiring manager, etc.

    Personality is a good example. If someone's standoffish or bristles in an interview, those behaviors can be indicative of a poor fit for a particular role. Someone's interview performance likely isn't indicative of their personality as a whole, but can give a glimpse into how they manage their behavior.
    Last edited by Femininity; 2021-11-01 at 01:05 AM.
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  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbound View Post
    I have a close relative who went into game design. There were only a handful of women (including herself) during her years there. She graduated at the top of her class. She had *far* more breadth of game experience (the vast majority of the males only every played and focused on first person shooters). She won competitions while there.

    She didn't get nearly as many offers as the obviously less qualified males.

    Nobody is asking for less qualified women to get jobs that would go to more qualified males. The reality is that less qualified males are hired over more qualified women *all* *the* *time* in industries like game design, programming, and cybersecurity.

    Why does this happen? Because of people very much like you. You *think* you are being fair, but you (like most) have bias in your decisions, and thus pick less qualified males all the time.

    Furthermore, the primary reason many women don't want to go in these fields is because, again, of people very much like you. The rude and lewd comments. The condescension. The assumption that men are inherently more qualified.

    By making a commitment to hiring more women, they aren't looking to make their company less effective. You are an utter moron if you think that is what is going on. Instead, they are making a real effort to attract even more people to the industry so that they can hire even more qualified people.

    And it's funny how people like you point out low-paying male dominated fields while completely ignoring the tons of low-paying female dominated fields like teachers and child care.

    Spend more time learning and less time spouting nonsense.
    Well said.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Femininity View Post
    I'm not specifically referring to anything. There is a broad array of soft metrics that can determine suitability for a particular role, outside of whatever the baseline requirements are. It largely depends on the field, the job position, the hiring manager, etc.

    Personality is a good example. If someone's standoffish or bristles in an interview, those behaviors can be indicative of a poor fit for a particular role.
    So... because you might be standoffish and still get the job you are 100% qualified for, over someone who isn't any more qualified at all but is warmer and more friendly you find the idea of holding that position disagreeable? Seems like a pretty stupid stance, particularly since in the typical, current situation you could be more qualified on paper and have better "soft metrics" and still get passed over simply because of your sex, and is predicated on the idea that somehow the women competing for those jobs must have some flaw that makes them still inferior to their male peers.

  11. #51
    I am Murloc!
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    Quote Originally Posted by FuxieDK View Post
    Oh boy... This is going to blow up in their faces, when men file cases for being turned down for a job, in favor of lesser qualified women..

    There is a reason why most countries are not allowed to explicit seek men or women for a job.
    that's the thing though; they won't be. They're not replacing men with women or non binary people. These will be extra hires of qualified people who just so happen to identify as women or non binary.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Lionhearte0 View Post
    This is your brain on stupid.
    equality seems like oppression to the oppressors,you will get over it eventualy big boi

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by unbound View Post
    I have a close relative who went into game design. There were only a handful of women (including herself) during her years there. She graduated at the top of her class. She had *far* more breadth of game experience (the vast majority of the males only every played and focused on first person shooters). She won competitions while there.

    She didn't get nearly as many offers as the obviously less qualified males.

    Nobody is asking for less qualified women to get jobs that would go to more qualified males. The reality is that less qualified males are hired over more qualified women *all* *the* *time* in industries like game design, programming, and cybersecurity.

    Why does this happen? Because of people very much like you. You *think* you are being fair, but you (like most) have bias in your decisions, and thus pick less qualified males all the time.

    Furthermore, the primary reason many women don't want to go in these fields is because, again, of people very much like you. The rude and lewd comments. The condescension. The assumption that men are inherently more qualified.

    By making a commitment to hiring more women, they aren't looking to make their company less effective. You are an utter moron if you think that is what is going on. Instead, they are making a real effort to attract even more people to the industry so that they can hire even more qualified people.

    And it's funny how people like you point out low-paying male dominated fields while completely ignoring the tons of low-paying female dominated fields like teachers and child care.

    Spend more time learning and less time spouting nonsense.
    Cool story, I have been passed on jobs in the teaching field as a male because I was white, as in the other people in the interview told me the head principle didn't hire me solely because of my race, even though I had worked in the district for years as a substitute teacher, I had lived in the district all my life and was a member of the community.

    Assuming they are going to somehow not be biased towards women now with this "mandate" is laughable. They are certainly going to be biased now (that isn't to say they were before, we can speculate they were but blizzard as far as tech has been fairly diverse) and they will pass on equally if not better qualified candidates to satisfy a diversity quota. The simple fact is tech at large gets SIGNIFICANTLY more male applications than female, so it is logical they would have more males than females (because it is logical that over the long run the candidates would equal out on skill across their demographics).
    Quote Originally Posted by Xarim View Post
    It's a strange and illogical world where not wanting your 10 year old daughter looking at female-identifying pre-op penises at the YMCA could feasibly be considered transphobic.

  14. #54
    The Lightbringer Violent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    its rly funny how people think its sexist and people get hired for their gender if its women,but when a company hires 99% men its perfectly fine

    they arent getting hired because they are women,they are just stoping the male favortism
    You have that backward.. Men don't get hired because they're men.. They never have.
    <~$~("The truth, is limitless in its range. If you drop a 'T' and look at it in reverse, it could hurt.")~$~> L.F.

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  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Palapop View Post
    were they hired just because they are male? or because of other qualities?

    Do you even realize what bothers people here?
    i have worked in education for many years,and in my experience women outperformed men vastly,but for some reason all these smart and qualified women seem to not get the jobs,odd isnt it?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Violent View Post
    You have that backward.. Men don't get hired because they're men.. They never have.
    your simply in denial of reality

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    i have worked in education for many years,and in my experience women outperformed men vastly,but for some reason all these smart and qualified women seem to not get the jobs,odd isnt it?

    - - - Updated - - -



    your simply in denial of reality
    What do you work in education as, a janitor? Early childcare?

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    i have worked in education for many years,and in my experience women outperformed men vastly,but for some reason all these smart and qualified women seem to not get the jobs,odd isnt it?
    you should start a company and only hire women, it would give you an edge over your competition

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by EyelessCrow View Post
    What do you work in education as, a janitor? Early childcare?
    highschool level

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by problematic asshole View Post
    you should start a company and only hire women, it would give you an edge over your competition
    that would be sexist,the thing we are trying to fix?:>

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    highschool level
    you know to be working as a highschool teacher, you just need to be smarter than a highschool student

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    that would be sexist,the thing we are trying to fix?:>
    If all other companies are only hiring men, you'd be trying to equalize things.

  20. #60
    Dreadlord Femininity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    So... because you might be standoffish and still get the job you are 100% qualified for, over someone who isn't any more qualified at all but is warmer and more friendly you find the idea of holding that position disagreeable?
    Depends entirely on the position. All else being equal, desirable personality traits tend to win in both hiring and employee retention.

    Seems like a pretty stupid stance, particularly since in the typical, current situation you could be more qualified on paper and have better "soft metrics" and still get passed over simply because of your sex, and is predicated on the idea that somehow the women competing for those jobs must have some flaw that makes them still inferior to their male peers.
    It's 100% illegal (in the US) to not hire someone because of their sex. There are a wealth of factors that might appear to be sex-based discrimination, but without either an audit of a company's hiring practices or a company willingly making those practices public, those factors are often indeterminable.

    An easy example is nepotism being legal and accepted in the private sector. Lost out on a job to some idiot or otherwise underqualified man? Probably has an uncle or cousin somewhere up the chain.
    Last edited by Femininity; 2021-11-01 at 01:32 AM. Reason: Nepotism example
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