1. #23221
    Legendary! Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    I also question, what does someone worse then Putin look like? Aside from trying to press the big red button.

    Russia is already using its gas supplies to Europe as a weapon, They are already invading neighbouring none-NATO countries. Invading NATO would be a death sentence.
    What exactly is 'worse'.
    Dunno, going full Stalin mode on Russians? Fat chance of being able to do that, though.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  2. #23222
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Dunno, going full Stalin mode on Russians? Fat chance of being able to do that, though.
    A callous answer but the West doesn't care how many Russians Russia kills.

    A Russian leader that butchers his own population but doesn't invade neighbours is preferable to one that plays nice with his people but does invade countries seeking better relations with Europe.
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  3. #23223
    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    Whatever happened to the Kremlin's constant threats earlier this year of "scorched earth" should Americans, or any Western foreigners really, be on-field participants in this war? That sounds much more direct than just supplying weapons. That's why I don't believe that general's claim.
    I think he's wrong too but not completely.

    Since the start of the war tens of thousands of Ukrainian soldiers and recruits where trained in NATO countries for months, not only the soldiers but also their officers. Very recently these guys started returning back to Ukraine. It's highly likely that these troops who employ NATO strategies and tactics are at the forefront of Ukraine's recent pushes into their occupied territories. These guys have been training for at least 6 months, are highly motivated and unlike their Russian counterparts are not exhausted and underfed while carrying modern equipment.

    If you followed the foreign legion in fighting in the eastern part of Ukraine since the start you'd know that many of the Ukrainians they are fighting with are not modernized and they use very similar tactics and strategies to the Russians both originating in Soviet military doctrine. As a result the casualty rates among the Ukrainian soldiers there was much higher then that of the foreign legion itself during offensive operations.

    When the Russians go for a large assault they push in a big line, if along that line the enemy has a weak spot and breaks and the Russians can push in they do or don't on predetermined orders, if it was dictated that the army should not break out in case of an enemy route they won't. If there is a part along that line that's particularly hardy, and proves very costly to take, the Russians commanders on that part of the line will still push forward even if another commander might have broken through somewhere close and it'd be much smarter to encircle the position instead. Not until they have reported the situation to their superiors and they decide upon a change of plan.

    The NATO's focus on decentralized command means that commanders on the field not in direct contact with their superiors are allowed much greater freedom when it comes to how the battle is fought. In practice this means that there are generally a lot less casualties during offensive operations. Before Ukraine couldn't really attack Russia because the human cost was unsustainable for Ukraine. Now that has changed. And based on the latest reports it is looking grim for Russia as they seem to have routed and are retreating near Kharkiv. And Ukraine seemed to have opened another front in the Luhansk region with multiple breakthrough across the line.
    Last edited by P for Pancetta; 2022-09-10 at 08:32 PM.

  4. #23224
    Legendary! Makabreska's Avatar
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    Not sure if that was mentioned, but Baltic states neighbouring Russia are disappointed with EU indecision and want to fully ban ruskies from crossing the border anyway.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  5. #23225
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    A callous answer but the West doesn't care how many Russians Russia kills.

    A Russian leader that butchers his own population but doesn't invade neighbours is preferable to one that plays nice with his people but does invade countries seeking better relations with Europe.
    i care man, humanity wont be free until the last dictator and last king are hanging by the neck from the entrails of the last priest.

  6. #23226
    Herald of the Titans D Luniz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    I mean, once the front lines are breached if there are no deeper, manned, lines of defence and no reserve forces to plug the gap, because they all got redirected somewhere else or simply never existed (remember Russia is short on manpower) then what is there to stop an advance once it has broken through the front? Empty uncontested ground is really easy to claim.
    the other issue is, they are leaving quite a bit of material as well
    abandoning conscripts is one thing, trained soldiers another,
    but tanks and heavy weapons that thanks to embargo and years of lets say "creative retirement funding" of post soviet officers, cant be replaced, taken by people trained to use said equipment.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    seems like Putin is facing another civil revolt not long after mutilating and killing the last batch. You can only kill or disappear so many dissenters before this only ends one way.

    It seems the reality Putin may be deposed is not some far-off fantasy. But like Syria, is this what you people want?
    Russia isn't a land of tribes cobbled together into a nation by distant powers, will some piece break off, sure, but it wont be the brutal civil war of syria, it would be places going "we free to go now? cool, cya cyka blayts"

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by XDurionX View Post
    Russians are gullible sheep who willingly believe all the shit they're fed. Putin still has support from the vast majority of the populace. The only way he'll be "removed" is him dying.
    so this
    https://youtu.be/-jm55XVe4QM
    "Law and Order", lots of places have had that, Russia, North Korea, Saddam's Iraq.
    Laws can be made to enforce order of cruelty and brutality.
    Equality and Justice, that is how you have peace and a society that benefits all.

  7. #23227
    Stood in the Fire Mazza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcellus1986 View Post
    Ukrainian troops have supposedly taken Donetsk Airport and are preparing to assault the city proper. Russia has melted away.
    Everybody that is reporting this is adding a big "This is very very VERY unconfirmed" asterix to it, but IF it is true this means Ukraine forces are actually crossing the februari 24th positions and are moving inside the "self declared" republics.

  8. #23228
    Quote Originally Posted by jonnysensible View Post
    i care man, humanity wont be free until the last dictator and last king are hanging by the neck from the entrails of the last priest.
    Be careful there, that aint some sensible things to say and a threat to people too.

  9. #23229
    Pandaren Monk Iphie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuiking View Post
    Be careful there, that aint some sensible things to say and a threat to people too.
    It's a paraphrasing of this quote:

    https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/d...0last%20priest.

  10. #23230
    Stood in the Fire Mazza's Avatar
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    Now there's reports on Pushilin (the Russian appointed leader of the DPR) both fleeing Donetsk and resigning as leader.

    If that all is true... maybe wishful thinking but we might see the DPR actually surrendering?
    Last edited by Mazza; 2022-09-10 at 10:07 PM.

  11. #23231
    Pandaren Monk Iphie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazza View Post
    Now there's reports on Pushilin (the Russian appointed leader of the DPR) both fleeing Donetsk and resigning as leader.

    If that all is true... maybe wishful thinking but we might see the DPR actually surrendering?
    If the DPR would surrender then the landconnection to Crimea would be broken and the russian failure would be complete.


    Video of Pushlin allegedly fleeing Donetsk:

    https://twitter.com/fbeyeee/status/1568741351805648897

    (I speak none of the languages used here, hence allegedly.)
    Last edited by Iphie; 2022-09-10 at 11:33 PM.

  12. #23232
    Scarab Lord Zaydin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mazza View Post
    Now there's reports on Pushilin (the Russian appointed leader of the DPR) both fleeing Donetsk and resigning as leader.

    If that all is true... maybe wishful thinking but we might see the DPR actually surrendering?
    Honestly if these reports are accurate and Ukraine can keep this momentum up, I'd love nothing more than to see Russia and its terrorists puppets driven back into Russia.
    "If you are ever asking yourself 'Is Trump lying or is he stupid?', the answer is most likely C: All of the Above" - Seth Meyers

  13. #23233
    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydin View Post
    Honestly if these reports are accurate and Ukraine can keep this momentum up, I'd love nothing more than to see Russia and its terrorists puppets driven back into Russia.
    I'd wish for them to be littered along the trail back to Russia. Them making it back? Not required at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jtbrig7390 View Post
    True, I was just bored and tired but you are correct.

    Last edited by Thwart; Today at 05:21 PM. Reason: Infracted for flaming
    Quote Originally Posted by epigramx View Post
    millennials were the kids of the 9/11 survivors.

  14. #23234
    the sheer amount of equipment they have abandoned lmao. Whole tank divisions. They put on civilian clothes, got into stolen cars and ran as fast as they could.

  15. #23235
    Pandaren Monk Iphie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnysensible View Post
    the sheer amount of equipment they have abandoned lmao. Whole tank divisions. They put on civilian clothes, got into stolen cars and ran as fast as they could.
    Here you go:

    https://twitter.com/GirkinGirkin/sta...77872533721093

    It's amazing really.

  16. #23236
    Over 9000! zealo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Dunno, going full Stalin mode on Russians? Fat chance of being able to do that, though.
    Russia isn't the soviet union in more ways than just their reduced capacity for acting like a great power with their foreign policy, especially not the one of the first half of the 20th century.

    Any replacement trying to become that totalitarian against ethnic Russians is likely going to be sticking their own neck out.

  17. #23237
    Quote Originally Posted by jonnysensible View Post
    the sheer amount of equipment they have abandoned lmao. Whole tank divisions. They put on civilian clothes, got into stolen cars and ran as fast as they could.

  18. #23238
    Moscow Officials Urge Putin to GTFO: ‘Everything Went Wrong’

    More and more Russian officials are urging Vladimir Putin to get the hell out of the Kremlin as Moscow suffered another series of humiliating defeats in Ukraine this weekend.

    Just one day after several municipal deputies in Putin’s hometown of St. Petersburg called on the State Duma to try the Russian leader for treason, their colleagues in Moscow joined in and demanded he step down because his views are “hopelessly outdated.”

    The open letter to Putin from municipal deputies in the Russian capital’s Lomonosovsky district started out by seemingly trying to let him down gently, telling him he had “good reforms” in his first term and part of his second.

    But then, “everything went wrong,” the deputies said.

    “The rhetoric that you and your subordinates use has been riddled with intolerance and aggression for a long time, which in the end effectively threw our country back into the Cold War era. Russia has again begun to be feared and hated, we are once again threatening the whole world with nuclear weapons,” the letter read.

    "We ask you to relieve yourself of your post due to the fact that your views and your governance model are hopelessly outdated and hinder the development of Russia and its human potential,” the deputies said in closing.

    Though they made no mention of the war against Ukraine, their plea came as Putin’s deranged “special military operation” next door took a spectacular nosedive, with thousands of Russian forces fleeing as Ukraine’s military launched a series of surprise counter-offensives and reclaimed nearly 400 square miles of territory in a matter of days.

    Even the pro-Kremlin Telegram channels run by Russian military bloggers had a dramatic change of tune as Ukraine claimed new wins Saturday: They began to openly blast military leadership—and Putin personally—for the embarrassing failures.

  19. #23239
    Legendary! Makabreska's Avatar
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    It seems more of a panic reaction. Also, shows you how loyal Putlers followers really are, suddenly NOW he is a detriment to the nation.
    Last edited by Makabreska; 2022-09-11 at 11:41 AM.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  20. #23240
    I'd say it's over when his followers feel safe enough to demand Putin be arrested and tried for treason.

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