Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Orange Joe]

on civilians, yes. Especially when they're on the loose with guns.

Remember the guys that went AWOL reportedly started by brutally murdering their commanding officers, meaning they killed people with military training before fucking off.

Do you think that was just random? Killing them just to kill? or could there be a reason they killed them????

[Kaleredar]

So I see a certain poster has remained not-vacationed for inordinately longer than usual. Let me sum up their previous, and future, nonspecific musings that never come to a point:

1. “But won’t that make Russia more angry?”
2. “But what about Russia’s friendship with China/India/Iran?”
3. “But what about Russia’s/putin’s strength?”
4. “But wont that make Russia more likely to nukes?”
5. “but what about the statements of this Russian mouthpiece?”

And then when 7 posters beat down one of these asinine points they pivot to another in an endless cycle with the memory retention of a goldfish.

[Iphie]

So I see a certain poster has remained not-vacationed for inordinately longer than usual. Let me sum up their previous, and future, nonspecific musings that never come to a point:

1. “But won’t that make Russia more angry?”
2. “But what about Russia’s friendship with China/India/Iran?”
3. “But what about Russia’s/putin’s strength?”
4. “But wont that make Russia more likely to nukes?”
5. “but what about the statements of this Russian mouthpiece?”

And then when 7 posters beat down one of these asinine points they pivot to another in an endless cycle with the memory retention of a goldfish.

#2. That is so laughable now, with India declining the annual meeting, China banning selling processors and Iran allegedly limiting the range on the missiles they're supplying to russia, only NK and Syria are, sort of, supporting.

[YUPPIE]

People, don't undersell Iran specifically as a militaristic ally to Russia, with their drone manufacturing. Their Shahed drones have taken innumerable lives and caused so much destruction in Ukraine. And with what is going on in Iran right now, I would never trust a word out of their government. The limits to what they can give Russia now is because Saudi Arabia and Israel are coming down on them hard over other reasons; they need to prepare for that.

A firm and believable stance (again) is Russia's geopolitical alliances consist of China and India, while their primary militaristic alliances and benefactors are of South Africa, Iran, North Korea, Syria.

India and China have only recently started wavering in their conviction - as the news I have provided seems to imply - but they will still buy Russian oil and veto against Russian sanctions and limitations in the unified belief the West is exploiting Ukraine to expand their imperialistic interests.

[Calfredd]

People, don't undersell Iran specifically as a militaristic ally to Russia, with their drone manufacturing. Their Shahed drones have taken innumerable lives and caused so much destruction in Ukraine. And with what is going on in Iran right now, I would never trust a word out of their government. The limits to what they can give Russia now is because Saudi Arabia and Israel are coming down on them hard over other reasons; they need to prepare for that.

A firm and believable stance (again) is Russia's geopolitical alliances consist of China and India, while their primary militaristic alliances and benefactors are of South Africa, Iran, North Korea, Syria.

India and China have only recently started wavering in their conviction - as the news I have provided seems to imply - but they will still buy Russian oil and veto against Russian sanctions and limitations in the unified belief the West is exploiting Ukraine to expand their imperialistic interests.

You are to Social Studies what PC2 is to Science; wholly ignorant of the subject matter and yet you repeatedly push your opinions as though they were worth considering.

[TACOshake]

Russia continues to suck at this whole supplier things.

Beijing has banned the export of Loongson military-grade processors to the Russian Federation even though Russia’s military/defense industry has been testing the Chinese processors for some time and planned to use them instead of Intel and AMD products.

Meanwhile the US is sending more air defense gear to the Ukraine.

[YUPPIE]

So Olaf Scholz today made a grand speech disparaging Putin; the context of which reminded me of a detail I've failed to mention:



Hungary and Orban are definitive allies to Russia in how the latter has done so much to block or veto sanctions. I think I fell into the memetic pitfalls of Hungary being irrelevant, but their voice in the EU definitely counts to make it difficult for Ukraine
-----------
Translated:

German Chancellor Olaf Scholz said Wednesday that Vladimir Putin had made a fundamental miscalculation by sending troops into Ukraine, adding that the Russian president had not achieved "a single goal" set before the attack.

Addressing lawmakers in Germany's Bundestag, Scholz said that Putin's conviction that Russia would win and Ukraine would fall within days, was a massive underestimation.

Putin "believed he could dry up Europe's solidarity by turning off our gas tap," Scholz said but he was wrong "about the courage of Ukrainians, about Europe, about us, about the character of our democracies, about our will to resist big power mania and imperialism."

Scholz emphasized the EU's support for Ukraine and said that attempts to undermine that backing are doomed to fail, in a thinly veiled message to Hungary who earlier this week dropped objections over the aid for Kyiv.

"Anyone who thinks he can undermine the values of the EU, to which every member state has committed itself, by blocking its foreign and security policies, will fail," he said.

In his address, Scholz also said that it's in Germany's and Europe's best "interest" for the Balkan countries that are currently not in the EU to join the bloc.

Many observers have previously warned that Russia might try to use its influence in the region to destabilize the EU.

On Wednesday, Scholz welcomed the revival of EU accession talks with the six Western Balkan countries in recent months, and the decision this week to grant Bosnia candidate status, joining Albania, Moldova, the Republic of North Macedonia, Montenegro and Serbia who all aspire to join the bloc.

The comments from the German chancellor come a week after Austria blocked Romania and Bulgaria, who became EU members in 2007, from joining the bloc's Schengen area.

[Huehuecoyotl]

You are to Social Studies what PC2 is to Science; wholly ignorant of the subject matter and yet you repeatedly push your opinions as though they were worth considering.

I honestly think if PC2 and Yuppie ever got into a discussion, this forum would disappear like an Oozlum bird.

[YUPPIE]

Russia was the strongest army because video games said so?

The perception of Russia as a military terror came from Stalin, one of the most feared men in history. Afterward, we propagated this urban legend Putin is like that since the 2000s: smart, fearsome, and powerful. That's what bled into literature, comics, movies, etc that Russia is terrifying as you see with mobster tropes.

Even up to the Ukraine invasion's start, they probably saw it that way, given how Zelensky was offered evacuation (implying he would not survive).

[Lynarii]

The perception of Russia as a military terror came from Stalin, one of the most feared men in history. Afterward, we propagated this urban legend Putin is like that since the 2000s: smart, fearsome, and powerful. That's what bled into literature, comics, movies, etc that Russia is terrifying as you see with mobster tropes.

Even up to the Ukraine invasion's start, they probably saw it that way, given how Zelensky was offered evacuation (implying he would not survive).

Not in any way true. What bled into literature and comics and movies is the idea that it is okay to hate Russia. It hasn't been since the fall of the USSR that they were the most powerful of potential opponents, it is just that American audiences feel good about beating them. It wouldn't be very diplomatic to set up the modern British as the primary antagonist (you will see them as the bad guys in period pieces), and people wouldn't feel very good about a story about the entire might of the US forces shit-kicking the hell out of Iceland, which doesn't even HAVE a standing military.

[zealo]

that was literally the perception of the Russians then and why you see it all over media up to now; this unstoppable army that could invade the US (Call of Duty, Metal Gear).

All that is dispelled now though.

This is your main problem, you take pieces of fiction and regard them as reflections on the real world.

Nobody not trading in such delusions ever thought Russia were in a position to invade the US.

Russia has never been a truly competent naval power in the same sense as modern America, and the logistical hurdles it would face are enormous, insurmountably so.

[YUPPIE]

This is your main problem, you take pieces of fiction and regard them as reflections on the real world.

Nobody not trading in such delusions ever thought Russia were in a position to invade the US.

Russia has never been a truly competent naval power in the same sense as modern America, and the logistical hurdles it would face are enormous, insurmountably so.

you're only really saying this because you're emboldened by 2022 and all the truths that came of it. Had the Ukraine all-out invasion not happened, I think the ambiguity and fear would still be there, and this is one of the things people claim Putin fucked up on (dispelling the urban legend).

NO ONE really knew what Russia was or wasn't actually capable of before this year, but it leaned on "capable" much more.

[Calfredd]

you're only really saying this because you're emboldened by 2022 and all the truths that came of it. Had the Ukraine all-out invasion not happened, I think the ambiguity and fear would still be there, and this is one of the things people claim Putin fucked up on (dispelling the urban legend).

NO ONE really knew what Russia was or wasn't actually capable of before this year, but it leaned on "capable" much more.

Your ignorance is not everyone else's ignorance.

[zealo]

you're only really saying this because you're emboldened by 2022 and all the truths that came of it. Had the Ukraine all-out invasion not happened, I think the ambiguity and fear would still be there, and this is one of the things people claim Putin fucked up on (dispelling the urban legend).

NO ONE really knew what Russia was or wasn't actually capable of before this year, but it leaned on "capable" much more.

No, I'm saying this because I've actually studied a bunch of this crap unlike you.

Unlike western powers even during the height of the cold war, soviet naval doctrine focused much more heavily on submarines with much less prevalence of attaining naval aviation capacity, because they themselves realised they were not in a position to match blue water surface navy capacities of the western block.

[YUPPIE]

No, I'm saying this because I've actually studied a bunch of this crap unlike you.

Unlike western powers even during the height of the cold war, soviet naval doctrine focused much more heavily on submarines with much less prevalence of attaining naval aviation capacity, because they themselves realised they were not in a position to match blue water surface navy capacities of the western block.

are you going to also suggest it was already probable that Ukraine was going to fend off Russia the way it has, before we even saw it in action

Just veering a bit off the straight-up America vs Russia thing (that's now in smoke)

EDIT: actually, being more specific here; if the US military knew all along of how incompetent Russia is, as you say, they could have already predicted this outcome. But the fact they offered to evac Zelenksy cast some doubts

[Corvus]

It wasn't the lack of competence of the Russians they didn't know about - it was the will of the Ukrainians to fight that was the unknown. They didn't know if the would stand and fight or not.

[Nymrohd]

This is pretty much what everyone and their mother has been telling you for the past 7-8 months: putin thought he'd be the senior partner, and Xi knew better. I'm actually starting to wonder if Xi actively encouraged putin in order to weaken russia.

For greater clarity: China is only in it for China, if someone else profits as well then that's a happy coincidence, but I wouldn't put it beyond China to fight dirty with their direct local competition.

I think it goes beyond just not being allies. Russia is the most valid PREY for China's increasing need for a periphery. It is the only market that is large and valuable enough that it can access and subdue as a dependant. Its efforts in South East Asia and Oceania have long been stymied by longstanding relations with the US and Europe, India is a clear adversary and while it can and has made inroads in Central Asia and Africa, neither has markets substantial enough for what China needs (the ability to dampen and export crisis to a periphery, like the US and to a lesser degree the EU can do).

[YUPPIE]

A huge explosion has badly damaged a key oil refinery in far eastern Russia in just the latest mystery blast to hit the country's infrastructure.

The blast struck Angarsk Oil Refinery, near the Siberian city of Irkutsk, around 5.50am local time Thursday - lighting up the early morning sky with a fireball.

Two people were killed and five injured in the explosion, which officials say was caused by 'gas contamination' of the plant's equipment though it is unclear whether this was an accident or whether it was sabotaged.

It comes against the backdrop of multiple blasts and fires at locations with links to Russia's military or oligarchs that many suspect are being orchestrated by Ukraine.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...on/ar-AA15iLcV
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Does Ukraine care much anymore about the lines Russia draws to aggression? These mystery fires and explosions aren't new, but they've been happening at a frighteningly more frequent pace lately.

[Saradain]

A huge explosion has badly damaged a key oil refinery in far eastern Russia in just the latest mystery blast to hit the country's infrastructure.

The blast struck Angarsk Oil Refinery, near the Siberian city of Irkutsk, around 5.50am local time Thursday - lighting up the early morning sky with a fireball.

Two people were killed and five injured in the explosion, which officials say was caused by 'gas contamination' of the plant's equipment though it is unclear whether this was an accident or whether it was sabotaged.

It comes against the backdrop of multiple blasts and fires at locations with links to Russia's military or oligarchs that many suspect are being orchestrated by Ukraine.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...on/ar-AA15iLcV
--------------

Does Ukraine care much anymore about the lines Russia draws to aggression? These mystery fires and explosions aren't new, but they've been happening at a frighteningly more frequent pace lately.

Do you even read & research the shit you post?

5 239,7 km

That is the distance by road between Moscow and Irkutsk.

How the fuck would Ukraine hit that far? By air (straight line) it is 4202 km.

[Gabriel]

It might also actually be that the russian officials are telling the truth this time.

russia's poorly maintained gas infrastructure is coming apart at the seams since they produce more gas can they can sell.