Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Corvus]

In Sweden, many people on the left wing are against helping Ukraine. "American imperialism" is, according to those type of leftists, something one should always oppose regardless of what or why America supports something. That said, most leftists (and right wingers) here are pro Ukraine. Strongly. In fact, during our election it wasn't even an issue. No relevant party opposes it.

If I wanted to destabilize the West I'd fund both fringes, not just one. putin doesn't care about ideologies. putin only cares about destabilizing the West regardless of what we actually end up with. The fact is that many people on all kinds of ideologies for many different reasons are pro russia. It's not a right or left wing thing really. Making it a partisan thing to help Ukraine doesn't help Ukraine.

It's well known pootie has been funding the far right theocrats who see him as a role model and the far left tankies who still associate russia with communism, despite being a far right government, and automatically see anything the west does, and the USA in particular, as evil.

[Gabriel]

In Sweden, many people on the left wing are against helping Ukraine. "American imperialism" is, according to those type of leftists, something one should always oppose regardless of what or why America supports something. That said, most leftists (and right wingers) here are pro Ukraine. Strongly. In fact, during our election it wasn't even an issue. No relevant party opposes it.

If I wanted to destabilize the West I'd fund both fringes, not just one. putin doesn't care about ideologies. putin only cares about destabilizing the West regardless of what we actually end up with. The fact is that many people on all kinds of ideologies for many different reasons are pro russia. It's not a right or left wing thing really. Making it a partisan thing to help Ukraine doesn't help Ukraine.

The left wing parties in Nordic countries have always been Soviet sympathizers in all but name.

[zealo]

The left wing parties in Nordic countries have always been Soviet sympathizers in all but name.

In Sweden, they've been that by name too.

What is now the "Left Party" used to openly and explicitly label themselves as communists.

[Elder Millennial]

Hindsight is 20/20

Back in February almost every respectable analyst and expert realistically expected Ukraine would fall. The only thing up for debate was really how quickly and what would the consequences be for Russia.

The Ukrainians really have given everyone whiplash from the Pentagon to Moscow and Beijing. Also nobody quite expected the level of incompetence the Russians managed to display.

In the past 300 days everyone had to rewrite every single major geopolitical analysis and half the military manuals.

Right now, the Russian plan seems to be -Keep throwing lives into the meat grinder until the West forces Ukraine to negotiate or until enough fascists win elections in the West to block further aid to Ukraine, but right now, that looks like a pipe dream.

I personally hoped that at some point after enough casualties and fiascos like that referendum followed by a retreat, the Russian people would say enough is enough. Alas I was wrong. It's clear to me that Russia has become the proverbial boiling frog. As the Kremlin slowly ratchets up the madness the Russians just keep going with the program unwilling to question, doubt or oppose what's being done to them.

[Nymrohd]

In Sweden, they've been that by name too.

What is now the "Left Party" used to openly and explicitly label themselves as communists.

Our communists have always been Soviet sympathizers too and in our case it's so damn weird given that the USSR completely sold the Greek Communist Party out during the civil war. But hatred for the US, NATO and whatever else they lump in "Capitalist West" is unending, for them everything is a reason to do a protest in front of the US Embassy. At least ours don't rant about globalism that much.

[jonnysensible]

Back in February almost every respectable analyst and expert realistically expected Ukraine would fall. The only thing up for debate was really how quickly and what would the consequences be for Russia.

no they didn't. They thought Russia wouldn't invade. (because it would be stupid).

every respectable analyst was saying 'The ukrainian army of 2014 isnt the same army as 2022 they have completely professionalized, Russia isn't going to invade'

[Gabriel]

In Sweden, they've been that by name too.

What is now the "Left Party" used to openly and explicitly label themselves as communists.

Our Left Party at least on paper is separate from the Communist party.

They all share the same retarded ideological origins tho.

[Lahis]

In Sweden, they've been that by name too.

What is now the "Left Party" used to openly and explicitly label themselves as communists.

Same here, really. In 1990 some of the communist parties realized that openly associating with communism was bad PR so they rebranded and merged as the Left Alliance.

[DarkAmbient]

A relative of mine has gone deep down the conspiracy rabbit hole about covid and now the Ukraine invasion. He just posted a Youtube video with some American guy called Clayton Morris talking about how we're all tricked into believing the invasion is Russia's fault and not Ukraine's, saying Zelensky is a war criminal responsible for genocide, and criticising Zelensky for his attitude towards peace talks. Not one single critical word of Putin. And this channel has 1.54M subscribers.

Is this kind of bullshit really more about Republicans framing the situation in a way that allows them to be critical of Biden, or do they genuinely believe what they are saying? Are they on Putin's payroll? I don't see how it's possible for anyone to look at the facts and come to the conclusions that this Morris guy and his co-host were making. It's maddening to me that anyone buys into it. And I'm going to have to deal with this shit tomorrow when they visit for dinner...

[Elder Millennial]

no they didn't. They thought Russia wouldn't invade. (because it would be stupid).

every respectable analyst was saying 'The ukrainian army of 2014 isnt the same army as 2022 they have completely professionalized, Russia isn't going to invade'

It's true that most people thought they wouldn't actually invade, but once the invasion started, the consensus was that Ukraine would fold.

[Kallisto]

Is this kind of bullshit really more about Republicans framing the situation in a way that allows them to be critical of Biden, or do they genuinely believe what they are saying? Are they on Putin's payroll? I don't see how it's possible for anyone to look at the facts and come to the conclusions that this Morris guy and his co-host were making. It's maddening to me that anyone buys into it. And I'm going to have to deal with this shit tomorrow when they visit for dinner...

*Ticks all of the above for republicans*

[Slant]

Now what is it they say about repeating the same thing and expecting different results… :P

Well played, sir.

[Corvus]

Santa appears to have delivered presents to Engels airfield in russia. Again. That is where they launch their heavy bombers.

https://twitter.com/DefMon3/status/1...LzVYSy_Jk3hM-A

- - - Updated - - -

russian news is reporting 3 servicemen dead an Engels. As usual their spin is insane. They claim air defences shot down a uav but the wreckage landed on the soldiers and killed them.

This is an excuse they used a number of times before. Can't admit their air defences are useless but have to explain losses and damage on the ground somehow.

[Gaidax]

no they didn't. They thought Russia wouldn't invade. (because it would be stupid).

every respectable analyst was saying 'The ukrainian army of 2014 isnt the same army as 2022 they have completely professionalized, Russia isn't going to invade'

Ofc they did, many including me did.

I did not think Russia would invade, but I did think that IF it would invade it would wipe the floor with Ukraine.

I am not shamed at all to admit it, it's called integrity.

The reason why aid for Ukraine took such a long time to manifest was because decision makers in the West thought Russia would roll Ukraine.

So yes this outcome was unexpected and it's silly to try and deny history.

- - - Updated - - -

The rubble has lost like 17% value compared to the USD in the last couple of weeks, even with moscow pumping money in to artificially inflate it.

Now there are reports of problems with banks not allowing people to withdraw their own money.

https://twitter.com/officejjsmart/st...YYFKcFcaAqo8bw

Time for a bank run?

There are also reports that pootie is going to forcibly convert people's savings onto government bonds.

I'm not sure why people keep focusing on ruble rate as if it matters. Whether ruble falls to dust or soars to the high heaven, it does not change the fact that Russia is in a financial trouble with bleak prospects.

The process will take years, however.

[Iphie]

Ofc they did, many including me did.

I did not think Russia would invade, but I did think that IF it would invade it would wipe the floor with Ukraine.

I am not shamed at all to admit it, it's called integrity.

The reason why aid for Ukraine took such a long time to manifest was because decision makers in the West thought Russia would roll Ukraine.

So yes this outcome was unexpected and it's silly to try and deny history.

- - - Updated - - -



I'm not sure why people keep focusing on ruble rate as if it matters. Whether ruble falls to dust or soars to the high heaven, it does not change the fact that Russia is in a financial trouble with bleak prospects.

The process will take years, however.

For the first part, yep, same here I thought russia would not invade or at least stop at the Donbass as it was likely they would get away with that, then Ukraine fought back, and the rest, as they say, is history.

For the second, it's interesting to see how the ruble tumbles and eventually hyperinflation will wipe out the currency in any meaningful manner, people are seeing the path towards wheelbarrows of rubles just to buy a loaf of bread.

[jonnysensible]

tfw your air defense is garbage and Ukraine can strike your nuclear airfield
tfw your economy is on the brink, arms smuggling from the war next door comes to your local city and gun crime goes up 600%

[Cthulhu 2020]

In the past 300 days everyone had to rewrite every single major geopolitical analysis and half the military manuals.

The "Russia stronk" and "western country alliance NATO WEAK" lines have been thoroughly debunked.

[Iphie]

tfw your economy is on the brink, arms smuggling from the war next door comes to your local city and gun crime goes up 600%

Wait what?

[jonnysensible]

Wait what?

Western Russia’s Kursk and Belgorod regions, both of which border war-torn Ukraine, saw the highest rise in crime rates involving weapons at 675% and 213% each.

Moscow came in third with a 203% increase in crimes involving weapons

Russia notoriously corrupt, and now its open season on gun smuggling. Gonna be an absolute basket case when the formal economy barely exists + a bunch of pissed off men come home who feel a reduction in the value of life and have been desensitized.

Saw this in the Balkans. Wonder if the Russian + Chechens will get heavy like the 90's and try and muscle out the Albanians who control most of europe now lol.

[Gaidax]

tfw your air defense is garbage and Ukraine can strike your nuclear airfield
tfw your economy is on the brink, arms smuggling from the war next door comes to your local city and gun crime goes up 600%

Is that supposed to be some answer to me?

Because boy did you miss a mark, I'm a good 2k kilometers away from Russia and if it would evaporate tomorrow I would not shed even 1 tear.

As a matter of fact it would make my life better indirectly.