1. #31001
    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    given most of his wealth is illicit/stolen and the world no doubt scouring for offshore accounts and restricting bank access, where do you think he would be putting all this money then?

    Don't forget it's even officially stated that while the world knows how rich Putin is, the true scope of his wealth is unknown even now.
    You think Putin has all those offshore accounts and pin codes and whatever memorized so that they exist only in his head? For fuck's sake even you can't be this naive.

  2. #31002
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    You think Putin has all those offshore accounts and pin codes and whatever memorized so that they exist only in his head? For fuck's sake even you can't be this naive.
    Did you really just ask this question?
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  3. #31003
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    You think Putin has all those offshore accounts and pin codes and whatever memorized so that they exist only in his head? For fuck's sake even you can't be this naive.
    yeah. I mean, it's all his, I've no clue why he wouldn't keep track of all his property.

    I mean, Pablo Escobar's fortunes are still out there to this day and not entirely found. Great parallel as well.
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  4. #31004
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Did you really just ask this question?
    I wish I didn't have to.

    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    yeah. I mean, it's all his, I've no clue why he wouldn't keep track of all his property.

    I mean, Pablo Escobar's fortunes are still out there to this day and not entirely found. Great parallel as well.

  5. #31005
    Anyway, if the point seems muddled, the whole convo has just been accounting for the probable fate of Russia and Putin after the war is lost.

    It's not even shilling, it's being real. Morals don't affect geopolitics. Both will just be fine business as usual because of wealth and resources. It's unrealistic to expect Russia to become some North Korea from sanctions and penalties with their place in the world in mind.
    Last edited by YUPPIE; 2023-05-21 at 06:50 PM.
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  6. #31006
    Quote Originally Posted by Dontrike View Post
    Here's the compromise. Russia gets all soldiers out, Russia returns all territories back to Ukraine, Putin is executed, and pays for the rebuilding of Ukraine, and Ukraine gets to watch it happen. Anything less than that is fucking stupid and all you're doing is saying "It's okay for Russia to have done this."
    I just find it highly unlikely that anything past "Russia pulls its troops out of Ukraine" is going to happen.

    Putin getting thrown to the West as an apology, *maybe* but that would require an exceptional level of coordination from any would be usurpers because taking a target alive is far more difficult than killing it.
    But beyond that, any politician who would even agree to pay reparations is unlikely to end up in power and even if somehow, from that on be target practice for any nationalist.

    The most likely outcome is that Russia
    1. becomes (or more, specifically, stays) an international pariah
    2. further fragments

  7. #31007
    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    yeah. I mean, it's all his, I've no clue why he wouldn't keep track of all his property.

    I mean, Pablo Escobar's fortunes are still out there to this day and not entirely found. Great parallel as well.
    Pablo Escobar burried a few million dollars in the jungle somewhere. Most of it has probably rotted away ages ago, it's a moot point.

    We know exactly where Putin's wealth is, the numbers per say might be slightly muddled but they are muddled because of the nature of his "wealth".

    Putin isn't hording some fat stacks of 20 dollar bills somewhere.

    He uses a network of proxies of billionaires and oligarchs as his personal piggy banks. And they aren't holding cash for him, they are controlling industries, properties, assets, investments etc. He uses the control of the state apparatus (the throw people out of windows people) and groups like Wagner to keep everyone in check and to make sure nobody accumulates too much of anything.

    If he wants a palace built. Someone will build it for him. If he wants a boat, someone will buy it for him etc.

    If Putin died tomorrow, a whole lot of lackeys would breath a breath of relief as they could just pocket the wealth. The wealth doesn't go anywhere. It just decentralizes.

    Which is in turn will be quite problematic for the Russian state if they end up fragmenting.

  8. #31008
    When a reporter asked Biden about russia saying providing f16s to Ukraine is a collosal risk, he replied 'It is. To them.'

  9. #31009
    The Lightbringer
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    I love after thousands of posts you people are still trying to explain common sense to yuppie who is either incapable of learning or is a Russian simp just trolling us.
    On the subject of Putin being handed over, no way in hell that would happen, if this 3 day operation has shown us anything is that the Russian military/government doesn’t have any backbone, they would all rather play pass the blame biscuit then overthrow Putin. At this point I would actually believe that Putin will die of natural causes instead of a munity.

  10. #31010
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    When a reporter asked Biden about Russia saying providing f16s to Ukraine is a colossal risk, he replied 'It is. To them.'
    I can't find this excerpt but that's sassy and arrogant as hell if he did say that.

    Man just unsubtly implied the US would fuck up Russia if they ever tried anything.
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  11. #31011
    Aw, he hurt poor widdle russia's feelings. Its the truth though.

    Here Dark Brandon saying it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    If Bakhmut has fallen, it is irrelevant really. It has a prewar population of only 72,000, so it wasn't that big. In the months trying to take it, russia has taken more casualties than that. And barely moved the line. Even the reason for taking it has long gone - it was part of a plan to drive north from Bakhmut and south from Izyium to surround the Ukrainian army. Except they lost Izyium months ago and that plan fell apart - and yet they kept pressing forward, taking tens of thousands of casualties for nothing really.

    And taking Bakhmut is one thing - Wagner intends to leave and head to Africa, leaving the russian regulars to try and hold it. Except now the flanks to both sides of Bakhmut are being driven back and it may end up the place is surrounded. Stalingrad all over again. And the counteroffensive hasn't even begun.

    Bakhmut is a bad place for russia to try and hold anyway and worse to attack from. The place is gone - there is no cover left. And leaving town you have to cross open fields that slope up to hills. Ukraine sits on top of those hills looking down over Bakhmut and those fields. They'll be able to pound the russians from those heights, just like they did at Vuhledar.

  12. #31012
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    When a reporter asked Biden about russia saying providing f16s to Ukraine is a collosal risk, he replied 'It is. To them.'
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-ne...ky-russia-war/

    This is legit. God damn I like Dank Robinette when he's feeling sassy.

  13. #31013
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    Wagner intends to leave and head to Africa
    you think putin is gonna let that happen?
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  14. #31014
    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    you think putin is gonna let that happen?
    Why do you keep pushing the narrative that Putin has more power than he actually does?

  15. #31015
    Quote Originally Posted by Calfredd View Post
    Why do you keep pushing the narrative that Putin has more power than he actually does?
    This is like saying Hitler did not have all the authority and power over the Nazis; that his word was not absolute.

    But in regards to Wagner, it would be hilarious just imagining that scenario you made out:

    Prig: Alright I'm done. Me and my troops are going back to Africa, have fun in Bahkmut.

    Putin: You are going to stay and fucking FIGHT, that's an order.

    Prig: Or what?
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  16. #31016
    The Prigs contract was to take bakhmut. He's done that. I doubt he will agree to more than that.

  17. #31017
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    The Prigs contract was to take bakhmut. He's done that. I doubt he will agree to more than that.
    What exactly are you saying or talking about? That all the news outlets describing this guy's aspirations to become the next Putin, or how he'll be killed or labeled a traitor for insubordination, are all false?

    You make it sound like this guy is literally just a simple thug-for-hire and nothing more, not even close to being an important figure in Russian mafioso politics.
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  18. #31018
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    The Prigs contract was to take bakhmut. He's done that. I doubt he will agree to more than that.
    Its like the old feudal Europa, then the dukes maneuver for position to inherit the crown, but the old king, who have no official heir is stil alive. Putin cant puch Prig to hard,and Prig cant defie Putin to mutch. Becuse Putin need Prig, and Prig need Putin.

    Putin need to "suport" Prig enough that Prig think he can win the crown after Putins death. Becuse Putin need several throne pretenders to ensure his power. Imagen if all miliary might was focused in one organisation under one leader, instred of spreed out to several competing organisations with leders who all are potential throne pretenders, who dislike/hate each other.

    What I think will hapen is that Wagner will get a rest, on the condition that they will re-enter the war at a later date.
    Last edited by Fantomen; 2023-05-22 at 04:24 AM.

  19. #31019
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iphie View Post
    Curious question, we all know NK is leashed by China, so all of their supportive bluster is worth what in the end?
    Russia is being massively supported by China, but China does set it up in a way which affords plausible deniability.

    China is not quite ready to sever the ties to the West just yet. When they eventually take a real shot at Taiwan - it will happen, but that is a decade away still. What China does now is building a coalition of countries in its pocket, and Russia is an important piece there.

  20. #31020
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    The Prigs contract was to take bakhmut. He's done that. I doubt he will agree to more than that.
    So if the rumour about Prig contacting the Ukrainian military is true, is it possible that Ukraine "conceded" Bakhmut so that Prig would have an excuse to take his troops out of the country?

    All feels a bit conspiracy theorist to me. Especially since it would involve Ukraine trusting Prig's word.
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