1. #31541
    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    I was wrong because i didn't factor in western support.
    Majority of the support came after Ukraine had... ahem... proven to be worth while investment, by not letting Russia just walk into Kyiv.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    So are we sure that RU blew it? I mean wouldn't be much easier to open the flood gates (just like turning off the valves in north stream instead of blowing it up?)
    Well what do you think? Why would Ukraine blow up a dam that will make it impossible for them to cross the river in the down stream direction, right before their counter attack is supposed to start?

  2. #31542
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    Majority of the support came after Ukraine had... ahem... proven to be worth while investment, by not letting Russia just walk into Kyiv.




    Well what do you think? Why would Ukraine blow up a dam that will make it impossible for them to cross the river in the down stream direction, right before their counter attack is supposed to start?
    It just destroyed 6 months worth of fortifications and minefields. Let's not discuss about the loss of ammunition from the RU side.
    I am not saying anything with certainty, it just has the same vibes as the north stream incident.

  3. #31543
    Herald of the Titans Iphie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    So are we sure that RU blew it? I mean wouldn't be much easier to open the flood gates (just like turning off the valves in north stream instead of blowing it up?)
    First, I too was wrong and I'll own it, but like most I couldn't be more happy to have been proven wrong.

    Second : the floodgates weren't opened, the dam was blown up, from the inside, where Ukraine physically couldn't get to. So 1+1= 2 or, in easier language: russia is the guilty party.

  4. #31544
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    So there has to be an actual response to this by the West. The more deranged vatniks are currently salivating over the fact that the Kyiv Hydroelectric Power Plant exists, and is located right upstream of the Kyiv city.

    If the West does not make it clear to Putin that a deliberately caused humanitarian and ecological disaster like this is out of bounds, the Russians might actually think this viable target.
    As has been talked about before, blowing up a dam from range is actually very difficult. Russia could blow up this dam because they control the area. They could walk up to it and plant bombs. Trying to take out a dam with missiles and drones would require a massive amount of precision ordnance and Russia is lacking ordnance, and has never been precise.
    And that is before we factor in air defence coverage, including Patriots which have been proven time and again to be very effective.

    Russia would love to take out that dam, they are in absolutely no position to do so.
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  5. #31545
    Quote Originally Posted by Iphie View Post
    Second : the floodgates weren't opened, the dam was blown up, from the inside, where Ukraine physically couldn't get to. So 1+1= 2 or, in easier language: russia is the guilty party.
    That's what I am saying: Wouldn't it be much more easier for the Russians to just open the floodgates instead of blowing it up?

  6. #31546
    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    That's what I am saying: Wouldn't it be much more easier for the Russians to just open the floodgates instead of blowing it up?
    Floodgates can be closed, dams can't be unexploded.

  7. #31547
    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    That's what I am saying: Wouldn't it be much more easier for the Russians to just open the floodgates instead of blowing it up?
    No, if your intention is to cause maximum flood wave.

    They intentionally filled the reservoir to the brim before destroying the dam to cause maximum damage to whatever is downstream.

  8. #31548
    The Unstoppable Force Belize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    That's what I am saying: Wouldn't it be much more easier for the Russians to just open the floodgates instead of blowing it up?
    N-not if you want to cause irreversible damage, no.

  9. #31549
    I mean, there's also the very real possibility that the barely sentient chimps manning and commanding the Russian military are so incompetent that they broke the dam on accident by allowing the water level to get too high.

  10. #31550
    Merely a Setback Sunseeker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulmita View Post
    That's what I am saying: Wouldn't it be much more easier for the Russians to just open the floodgates instead of blowing it up?
    Dams aren't typically designed to be able to just "dump all the water out". Water release is usually limited to amounts that areas downstream can handle. Sure, it can be on the high-end of what the waterways downstream can handle(even in emergencies the maximum is still limited), but you don't usually install a "doomsday gate" that can dump so much water it will cause massive flooding and damage downstream. Excess water is handled near the top of the dam, if you don't have enough water to reach it, they can't be used.

    Not to say that this particular dam isn't capable of opening up so wide as to flood the city, but that would be really weird design.
    Human progress isn't measured by industry. It's measured by the value you place on a life.

    Just, be kind.

  11. #31551
    Old God Milchshake's Avatar
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    The New York Times actually asked some experts in structural engineering and explosives about what could have caused the failure of the Nova Kakhovka dam.
    They said an explosion. A big explosion.
    Government Affiliated Snark

  12. #31552
    Over 9000! zealo's Avatar
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    It is possible it happened out of sheer incompetence too, but its very unlikely it weren't by intention with explosives with the context of everything surrounding it and just when they started filling the reservoir up more than normal.

    As the water recedes in the coming days back to something resembling the river's normal flow as the former reservoir empties of excess water, it will leave the ground in flooded regions full of staggering amounts of mud for weeks to months to come, right as Russia has a pressing need to be able to shift more of their forces further east.

    Another side effect of that is that the river is also in the process of flushing a whole bunch of Russian mines with it, to cause further damage to civilians and rescue efforts with it after the fact by the terrorists that they are.

  13. #31553
    I just want to say that for a while now, people have been derogatorily calling Russians "Vatniks" among other colorful things. And it seems the Kremlin has caught on, deeming "vatnik" specifically as a "racial slur" (therefore punishable). I don't know if that will hold up for the rest of the world, though, when leftists still say we shouldn't be bigoted toward Russia as a whole in spite of everything.
    "Truth...justice, honor, freedom! Vain indulgences, every one(...) I know what I want, and I take it. I take advantage of whatever I can, and discard that which I cannot. There is no room for sentiment or guilt."

  14. #31554
    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    I just want to say that for a while now, people have been derogatorily calling Russians "Vatniks" among other colorful things. And it seems the Kremlin has caught on, deeming "vatnik" specifically as a "racial slur" (therefore punishable). I don't know if that will hold up for the rest of the world, though, when leftists still say we shouldn't be bigoted toward Russia as a whole in spite of everything.
    Bit slow, isn't he? That term has been around for like a decade at this point, and was in somewhat common use before the 3-day special operation began last February.

  15. #31555
    The Unstoppable Force Belize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    I just want to say that for a while now, people have been derogatorily calling Russians "Vatniks" among other colorful things. And it seems the Kremlin has caught on, deeming "vatnik" specifically as a "racial slur" (therefore punishable). I don't know if that will hold up for the rest of the world, though, when leftists still say we shouldn't be bigoted toward Russia as a whole in spite of everything.
    My brother in christ, what leftist says we shouldn't be bigoted towards Russia when it comes to calling them names?

    The only ones with their panties in a twist about vatniks are pro-Russia right wing shills.

  16. #31556
    Man, "vatnik" has been around for like a decade. Can't wait till they hear about the word that was popularized when the vatniks began using "Z" to mark their vehicles when they started the large scale invasion.

    Hint: it starts with a "Z" and rhymes with a measuring instrument used by bartenders to measure out 1.5 US fluid ounces of liqour.

  17. #31557
    Old God Milchshake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YUPPIE View Post
    I just want to say that for a while now, people have been derogatorily calling Russians "Vatniks" among other colorful things. And it seems the Kremlin has caught on, deeming "vatnik" specifically as a "racial slur" (therefore punishable). I don't know if that will hold up for the rest of the world, though, when leftists still say we shouldn't be bigoted toward Russia as a whole in spite of everything.
    Using "leftists are saying". Example of bandwagon fallacy, also known as an appeal to popularity.

    Vatnik or vatnyk (Russian: ватник) is a political pejorative used in Russia and other post-Soviet states for steadfast jingoistic followers of propaganda from the Russian Government.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vatnik_(slang)

    You're always carrying water for Putin like a little broken dam. We could call you Kakhovkayush if that helps.
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  18. #31558
    I will admit people referring to Russians "orcs" does bring to mind the WW2 American propaganda depicting Japanese as rats and that's not great.

  19. #31559
    Quote Originally Posted by Canpinter View Post
    I will admit people referring to Russians "orcs" does bring to mind the WW2 American propaganda depicting Japanese as rats and that's not great.
    My heart bleeds for all the poor innocent orcs being associated with Russian invaders.

  20. #31560
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    My heart bleeds for all the poor innocent orcs being associated with Russian invaders.
    Just pointing out that if something like this makes you uncomfortable.

    https://digitalcollections.hoover.or...er/216202/full

    So should this.
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRkhk-XXIAEv9T5.jpg:large

    If nether do then you do you.

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