Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Deus Mortis]

Lots of videos of drones flying around in daylight in Russian territory some doing dive bombs and exploding. Hate to see children terrified but seeing the adults scared in a weird way makes me smile. Russian civilians are finally starting to see 1/1000th of the terror that their country has inflicted upon their neighbor. I hope the drones keep ramping up. Make Russia pull back all their aircraft as well as pull back their air defense.

[Corvus]

Anybody seen the new updated Chinese territorial map? China claimed the entirety of Bolshoi Ussuriysky island which was previously split in two.

It wasn't just russian land they claimed - amongst other places it has claimed were parts of India. So much for BRICS unity.

Of course, it does put a whole new meaning to friendship without borders...

[Makabreska]

It wasn't just russian land they claimed - amongst other places it has claimed were parts of India. So much for BRICS unity.

Of course, it does put a whole new meaning to friendship without borders...

I do wonder if this was fully intentional, or was it doing of some overeager bootlicker bureaucrat (and there are many of these in China). Because it is really dumb to do it right here and right now.

[Elder Millennial]

It wasn't just russian land they claimed - amongst other places it has claimed were parts of India. So much for BRICS unity.

Of course, it does put a whole new meaning to friendship without borders...

They claimed a whole ass state in India.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arunachal_Pradesh

- - - Updated - - -

I do wonder if this was fully intentional, or was it doing of some overeager bootlicker bureaucrat (and there are many of these in China). Because it is really dumb to do it right here and right now.

This was intentional. China has been ramping up these territorial claims for years and years.

The border disputes with Russia were one of the reasons for the Sino-Soviet split back in the day.

But this time around I think the Chinese claimed territory from every country they share borders with except Mongolia I think.

Plus the whole South China Sea thing.

We in the West, especially on the left of the political spectrum, have seem to convinced ourselves that only we do imperialism.

There's a reason everyone in East Asia hates the Japanese and there's a reason why everyone in South East Asia hates the Chinese. And there's a reason why everyone around Russia, hates Russia.

What I wonder about tho, is how do Russian nationalist "intellectuals" of the Dugin variety who have been advocating for a Russo-Chinese realignment interpret this.

[Cynical Asshole]

It wasn't just russian land they claimed - amongst other places it has claimed were parts of India. So much for BRICS unity.

Of course, it does put a whole new meaning to friendship without borders...

Only Russian idiots believe that China is a friend to Russia. China will devour Russia at the first sign of serious weakness.

[zealo]

I do wonder if this was fully intentional, or was it doing of some overeager bootlicker bureaucrat (and there are many of these in China). Because it is really dumb to do it right here and right now.

If it wasn't intentional, it was more in the "we shouldn't feature this in propaganda right now" kind of mistake, rather than their national attitudes not being exactly that.

China and India have had icy relations particularly in regards to where their borders goes for decades, and do not at all trust each others.

[Makabreska]

This was intentional. China has been ramping up these territorial claims for years and years.

Why would they release it exactly at the time of BRICS meeting, where China was trying so hard to show that they are unified against "filthy West"? I could understand taking over territories of other neighbours (and maybe India), but Russia? This all is just dumb and immediately antagonizes their "allies".

[Elder Millennial]

Why would they release it exactly at the time of BRICS meeting, where China was trying so hard to show that they are unified against "filthy West"? I could understand taking over territories of other neighbours (and maybe India), but Russia? This all is just dumb and immediately antagonizes their "allies".

The whole BRICS v West thing is a Russian fetish. Neither India nor China, let alone Brazil or South Africa see the whole thing as such.

For the Chinese BRICS is an economic thing. There was apparently a meeting between Modi and Xi at the BRICS conference that didn't go exceptionally well.

There's a G20 meeting coming up on September 9 in New Delhi. Xi, Modi, Putin will all be expected to be in attendance...also the Japanese, Koreans, Malaysians, Indonesian etc.

The map seem to be carefully targeted to basically piss off almost everyone expected to attend.

[Corvus]

Xi and pootie aren't going to the g20.

[The Stormbringer]

Lots of videos of drones flying around in daylight in Russian territory some doing dive bombs and exploding. Hate to see children terrified but seeing the adults scared in a weird way makes me smile. Russian civilians are finally starting to see 1/1000th of the terror that their country has inflicted upon their neighbor. I hope the drones keep ramping up. Make Russia pull back all their aircraft as well as pull back their air defense.

That would be ideal, yes. If they pull everything back to protect the home front, then Ukraine will have a much easier time recapturing territory and fortifying positions.

[Rasulis]

The map seem to be carefully targeted to basically piss off almost everyone expected to attend.

It should be noted that all the affected countries lodged complaints. Even tiny highly vulnerable Nepal. Not a peep out of Russia. The Ukraine war has severely weakened Russia both economically and politically.

Right after I posted that, they made their statement.

[YUPPIE]

today ukraine's defense minister stated russia is not the country to repent. Instead, they will always seek bloodthirsty revenge, whether now or 10 years later.

[Vampiregenesis]

Can Ukrainians avoid conscription without consequences?

[Saradain]

Can Ukrainians avoid conscription without consequences?

Of course not. Conscription during wartime is a crucial matter. Long ago death penalty was the reward for those who defected or refused to fight for their home.

Or are you asking because you suggest few tens of millions of ukrainians should just flee and leave the country to be pillaged and consumed?

[Sunseeker]

Can Ukrainians avoid conscription without consequences?

Do they need to? Conscription problems are usually an issue with aggressor nations or nations distant from where they're conducting a war. They're usually not a problem for invaded nations, especially ones where the invader is explicitly out to kill as many people as possible.

[Santti]

Can Ukrainians avoid conscription without consequences?

And what kind consequences would those be? I highly doubt there's going to be much in the way of protesting, if that's what you mean. Because getting bombed and murdered in such a vicious manner tends to unite the people, not drive it apart. A lesson that WW2 taught all too well.

[Elder Millennial]

Xi and pootie aren't going to the g20.

Yeah.

The more and more it seems the whole thing was meant to derail the Indian agenda for the G20 meeting.

[Kralljin]

Do they need to? Conscription problems are usually an issue with aggressor nations or nations distant from where they're conducting a war. They're usually not a problem for invaded nations, especially ones where the invader is explicitly out to kill as many people as possible.

I think the question you're answering feels more like a setup for a whataboutism, but whatever.

Ukraine had borderguards checking whether any male of age wanted to leave the country when the Invasion started, as they're not allowed to leave the country when martial law is declared (barring you have a permit).
Which is a clause a lot of countries have in their constitution, by the way.

Some Ukrainians also cannot be arsed to either pick up a weapon themselves or sit in a country that has to fear russian missiles until they get conscripted.
Thus they would rather flee to a country, sit out the situation there if outright build a new life somewhere in the EU.

Not everyone wants to die for their country and rather fucks off if the situation gets bad - even if the terrible situation is not of their own making.

And what kind consequences would those be?

From what i was able to find:
Fine, Prison or front line.

[Sunseeker]

I think the question you're answering feels more like a setup for a whataboutism, but whatever.

Yeah, I got that feeling as well.

Ukraine had borderguards checking whether any male of age wanted to leave the country when the Invasion started, as they're not allowed to leave the country when martial law is declared (barring you have a permit).
Which is a clause a lot of countries have in their constitution, by the way.

Some Ukrainians also cannot be arsed to either pick up a weapon themselves or sit in a country that has to fear russian missiles until they get conscripted.
Thus they would rather flee to a country, sit out the situation there if outright build a new life somewhere in the EU.

Not everyone wants to die for their country and rather fucks off if the situation gets bad - even if the terrible situation is not of their own making.

To the first part: ah.

To the rest: yeah, and that's always the tradeoff with conscription, you'll get some people who are willing but slow to get there, and you'll get some people who are totally unwilling. Unfortunately it's hard to tell how many of which you get until you actually get them. And frankly, there's not really a lot of gain from sending unwilling, poorly trained soldiers to the front anyway; as Russia has well demonstrated.

[Vampiregenesis]

Of course not. Conscription during wartime is a crucial matter. Long ago death penalty was the reward for those who defected or refused to fight for their home.

Or are you asking because you suggest few tens of millions of ukrainians should just flee and leave the country to be pillaged and consumed?

It seems they will be at war for a long time and the chance to get killed is considerable. I know some gamers from Ukraine and they are all young, I wonder why they haven't called them yet. No matter how you look at it, it's a bad time to be a conscript, imagine playing wow on your pc and the next day being hidden in a trench or on a patrol, waiting to die anytime.