1. #34821
    Over 9000! Santti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampiregenesis View Post
    What happens in Libya is genocide too, without the intervention of nato at 2011, there wouldn't be 20K+ dead now, there wouldn't be people sold as slaves and drown on mediterranean.

    Is this why Russia is fighting on Ukraine? to avoid such terrible fate? None knows, however a non-vatnik person should keep his distance from both sides and just say, "I don't know until it's proven". On a Russian forum, they would say the same but "nato nazis are trying to genocide us"

    West sources only show russian dead and russian defeats, if I had to take for granted the information they show me, I would assume that russians are just fodders and they should have been defeated long ago, while ukrainians are invincible, literally.
    Well, I hope you are about to pull the "I'm just joking, lol", because this is even more idiotic than the one where you said it was a joke.

    I like the continued usage of vatnik, btw.
    Last edited by Santti; 2023-09-16 at 09:35 PM.
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    And again, let’s presume equity in schools is achievable. Then why should a parent read to a child?

  2. #34822
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    So you can have an opinion one what he is going to do and it's not mind reading, but my opinion is? lol......
    Difference is you claim to seem to know what Kim thinks, but I'm just giving an assessment of the reality with adding the word probably as well.

    The reality is - just like your article points out, that he has many worries that can actually play out. Whether it's a coup, a rebellion or even said drone strike takedown - these things really can happen.

    US invading NK? The probability of that is infinitely smaller than of either of above, both because of the circumstances and the guarantees NK built to discourage that kind of action.

    Heck, I'd say these memes of Putin serving him his specialty tea and replacing him with a double to control NK has fucking more chance of happening than US invasion of NK.

  3. #34823
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    Difference is you claim to seem to know what Kim thinks, but I'm just giving an assessment of the reality with adding the word probably as well.

    The reality is - just like your article points out, that he has many worries that can actually play out. Whether it's a coup, a rebellion or even said drone strike takedown - these things really can happen.

    US invading NK? The probability of that is infinitely smaller than of either of above, both because of the circumstances and the guarantees NK built to discourage that kind of action.

    Heck, I'd say these memes of Putin serving him his specialty tea and replacing him with a double to control NK has fucking more chance of happening than US invasion of NK.
    I do?? where did I say that? Or did I give my opinion on what I think he will do. Yes, I THINK he fears the US. Yes, I THINK he won't give much of anything to Russia.


    This is no more mind reading than you THINKING he doesn't fear the US....... Or are you saying YOU KNOW what he thinks?

  4. #34824
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    I do?? where did I say that? Or did I give my opinion on what I think he will do. Yes, I THINK he fears the US. Yes, I THINK he won't give much of anything to Russia.


    This is no more mind reading than you THINKING he doesn't fear the US....... Or are you saying YOU KNOW what he thinks?
    You really like to come to threads and argue angrily with others about irrelevant stuff like they just insulted your mother, eh?
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  5. #34825
    Quote Originally Posted by Saradain View Post
    Yeah no lol. Whataboutism about NATO (that was mandated to intervene) and pretending Russia is "saving Ukraine from civilian casualties"...

    We have shit tons of proof of russians committing a genocide against Ukraine, mostly against civilians in Ukraine. You can stop pretending it doesn't exist. I don't think any amount of proof would work for you, because you want to see the West as the bad guys so you will simply not accept anything contradicting that.



    Why isn't this mentioned anywhere, do you have an international decision about current affairs (in 2023) that Libya is undergoing a genocide?
    Russia was mandated to intervene too from the republics of donetsk, you probably forget about the part where they asked for russians to come. So according to your logic, is it fine I guess? or maybe the rebels on libya were more legit?

    I haven't seen evidence anywhere that russia is commiting genocide intentionally besides bucha where I can't say if that was intended by the state, I can bring you up several massacres commited by nato countries on syria much worse than bucha. Would you accept them as genocide?

    So far the civilian casualties on ukraine are normal considering the size of this war and weapons involved, missiles can miss targets or can be stopped and then drop to civilians, such casualties exist on russia controlled areas too. The history of war didn't start on 2022, war is a terrible thing and no matter how hard the armies involved try, there will be civilian casualties, that's why it's better if there is no war. There have been far worse wars than this historically which is surprising considering the amount of fire power countries have now.

    There is no what aboutism, the russians if they lose or let nato get a solid settlement on ukraine, they may suffer the same consequences as libyans.
    Last edited by Vampiregenesis; 2023-09-16 at 09:53 PM.

  6. #34826
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampiregenesis View Post
    Russia was mandated to intervene too from the republics of donetsk, you probably forget about the part where they asked for russians to come. So is it fine I guess?

    I haven't seen evidence anywhere that russia is commiting genocide intentionally besides bucha where I can't say if that was intended by the state, I can bring you up several massacres commited by nato countries on syria much worse than bucha. Was this an intended genocide?

    So far the civilian casualties on ukraine are normal considering the size of this war and weapons involved, missiles can miss targets or can be stopped and then drop to civilians, such casualties exist on russia controlled areas too.

    There is no what aboutism, the russians if they lose or let nato get a solid settlement on ukraine, they may suffer the same consequences as libyans.
    Thank you finally for showing us who you truly are.
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  7. #34827
    Quote Originally Posted by Vampiregenesis View Post
    Russia was mandated to intervene too from the republics of donetsk, you probably forget about the part where they asked for russians to come. So is it fine I guess?

    I haven't seen evidence anywhere that russia is commiting genocide intentionally besides bucha where I can't say if that was intended by the state, I can bring you up several massacres commited by nato countries on syria much worse than bucha. Was this an intended genocide?

    So far the civilian casualties on ukraine are normal considering the size of this war and weapons involved, missiles can miss targets or can be stopped and then drop to civilians, such casualties exist on russia controlled areas too.

    There is no what aboutism, the russians if they lose or let nato get a solid settlement on ukraine, they may suffer the same consequences as libyans.
    Russia was mandated by the United Nations?? Or was Russia faking a referendum and asking itself to intervene, ie invade? Btw, Donetsk belongs to Ukraine by international law, ergo, it cannot randomly ask Russia to "liberate" it, nor can Russia hold a legal referendum in Ukraine

    Yep, you're trolling hard. Denying genocide, denying all the proof the world has about russians committing a genocide in Ukraine, denying purposeful civilian targeting, claiming that Russia has to win or Ukraine will have a genocide...While Ukraine is having one right NOW, by Russia. You should go to those forums that feed your delusions and leave this one.

    PS. Whataboutism = but but NATO DID THIS AND THAT, SO RUSSIA SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO ANYTHING!!!

  8. #34828
    Over 9000! Santti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vampiregenesis View Post
    Russia was mandated to intervene too from the republics of donetsk, you probably forget about the part where they asked for russians to come. So according to your logic, is it fine I guess? or maybe the rebels on libya were more legit?

    I haven't seen evidence anywhere that russia is commiting genocide intentionally besides bucha where I can't say if that was intended by the state, I can bring you up several massacres commited by nato countries on syria much worse than bucha. Was this an intended genocide?

    So far the civilian casualties on ukraine are normal considering the size of this war and weapons involved, missiles can miss targets or can be stopped and then drop to civilians, such casualties exist on russia controlled areas too.

    There is no what aboutism, the russians if they lose or let nato get a solid settlement on ukraine, they may suffer the same consequences as libyans.
    Again, leaning so hard towards the crazy, your earlier "it was just a joke" is rather hard to take seriously.

    But fine, lets see the clearly unbiased sources you get these hot takes from. I sure would like to see those.
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  9. #34829
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    I do?? where did I say that? Or did I give my opinion on what I think he will do. Yes, I THINK he fears the US. Yes, I THINK he won't give much of anything to Russia.


    This is no more mind reading than you THINKING he doesn't fear the US....... Or are you saying YOU KNOW what he thinks?
    I'm not exactly sure where you're going with all this, but may I suggest a glass of water?

    I don't think anyone here claimed he is going to rush and send Putin half of his stockpile.

    The initial argument was that Kim can provide a useful assistance to Russia, because all in all old ammo and all weapons are better than no ammo and weapons. And also, the word can does not mean will, because half a dozen aforementioned reasons.

    What Kim thinks or not thinks it's not really in scope of our coffee reading session. I operate based on reasonable realities on the ground, I can't guess feelings.

    Now, would you kindly get back to the thread's topic or you are going to keep trying to defend your honor, as if anyone really gives a damn about it?

  10. #34830
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    You really like to come to threads and argue angrily with others about irrelevant stuff like they just insulted your mother, eh?
    Don't project please. Otherwise yes I like to debate. If I didn't I wouldn't be here would I?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    I'm not exactly sure where you're going with all this, but may I suggest a glass of water?

    I don't think anyone here claimed he is going to rush and send Putin half of his stockpile.

    The initial argument was that Kim can provide a useful assistance to Russia, because all in all old ammo and all weapons are better than no ammo and weapons. And also, the word can does not mean will, because half a dozen aforementioned reasons.

    What Kim thinks or not thinks it's not really in scope of our coffee reading session. I operate based on reasonable realities on the ground, I can't guess feelings.

    Now, would you kindly get back to the thread's topic or you are going to keep trying to defend your honor, as if anyone really gives a damn about it?
    And I disagree. Ammo does nothing without the bodies and guns/launchers to shoot them, by all counts right now Russia is having more issues with people than anything else.


    You both need to stop projecting yourselves on to others, just because you are/would be angry doesn't mean everyone is.


    There is exactly 1 time I have been mad on these forums and there was no question about it. Just ask @cubby (if he even remember anymore lol)

  11. #34831
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    And I disagree. Ammo does nothing without the bodies and guns/launchers to shoot them, by all counts right now Russia is having more issues with people than anything else.
    What a strange mindset.

    You do realize that one does not make the other meaningless? Russia needs everything, manpower and weapons/ammo/spare parts.

    Obviously, Kim can't solve the manpower issue for Russia, but he can help with weapons/ammo/spare parts.

  12. #34832
    Elemental Lord unfilteredJW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    Don't project please. Otherwise yes I like to debate. If I didn't I wouldn't be here would I?

    - - - Updated - - -



    And I disagree. Ammo does nothing without the bodies and guns/launchers to shoot them, by all counts right now Russia is having more issues with people than anything else.


    You both need to stop projecting yourselves on to others, just because you are/would be angry doesn't mean everyone is.


    There is exactly 1 time I have been mad on these forums and there was no question about it. Just ask @cubby (if he even remember anymore lol)
    You don't debate, you pick fights.
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  13. #34833
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unfilteredJW View Post
    You don't debate, you pick fights.
    Says the guy randomly replying to me picking a fight? Come on guys if you don't like what I say please feel free to put me on ignore. Otherwise stop projecting.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    What a strange mindset.

    You do realize that one does not make the other meaningless? Russia needs everything, manpower and weapons/ammo/spare parts.

    Obviously, Kim can't solve the manpower issue for Russia, but he can help with weapons/ammo/spare parts.
    One doesn't make the other meaningless? guns on mortars shoot themselves now?

  14. #34834
    Over 9000! Santti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    Obviously, Kim can't solve the manpower issue for Russia, but he can help with weapons/ammo/spare parts.
    Ehhh, I'm not convinced NK is able to help with those, either. Not in any capacity that would matter, at least.

    Weapons? There's no way NK could give anything more than small arms, and I doubt Russia is hurting for those.

    Spare parts? I doubt there are many compatible vehicles between the countries that Russia could make a use for. And I don't think NK has all that much to give, even if they had.

    Ammo? Maybe for artillery. But then again, I doubt NK is swimming in that kind of ammo. It's also one of the few cards it has against SK; the ability to strike at Seoul. So how much of that is it willing to give away?

    In the end, I don't think this meeting is really for military aid. It's to give the west a middle finger, by working with NK. Though I have absolutely no clue how this meeting is supposed to look like, domestically...
    Quote Originally Posted by SpaghettiMonk View Post
    And again, let’s presume equity in schools is achievable. Then why should a parent read to a child?

  15. #34835
    Merely a Setback Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    In the end, I don't think this meeting is really for military aid. It's to give the west a middle finger, by working with NK. Though I have absolutely no clue how this meeting is supposed to look like, domestically...
    "we have never been at war with eastasia"
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    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  16. #34836
    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    Ehhh, I'm not convinced NK is able to help with those, either. Not in any capacity that would matter, at least.

    Weapons? There's no way NK could give anything more than small arms, and I doubt Russia is hurting for those.

    Spare parts? I doubt there are many compatible vehicles between the countries that Russia could make a use for. And I don't think NK has all that much to give, even if they had.

    Ammo? Maybe for artillery. But then again, I doubt NK is swimming in that kind of ammo. It's also one of the few cards it has against SK; the ability to strike at Seoul. So how much of that is it willing to give away?

    In the end, I don't think this meeting is really for military aid. It's to give the west a middle finger, by working with NK. Though I have absolutely no clue how this meeting is supposed to look like, domestically...
    North Korea is capable of making relatively high quality weaponry (rockets mainly). They have in the past shipped rockets to Iran which they've used to attack SA. But due to sanctions that's difficult, they send them in small batches IKEA style on multiple shipments, to be assembled by the user. They can't send large batches of weaponry to Russia by sea. And sending it all through China by train is going to be very expensive.
    Last edited by P for Pancetta; 2023-09-17 at 02:14 AM.

  17. #34837
    Herald of the Titans Iphie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P for Pancetta View Post
    North Korea is capable of making relatively high quality weaponry (rockets mainly). They have in the past shipped rockets to Iran which they've used to attack SA. But due to sanctions that's difficult, they send them in small batches IKEA style on multiple shipments, to be assembled by the user. They can't send large batches of weaponry to Russia by sea. And sending it all through China by train is going to be very expensive.
    Isn't there a train connection to russia from NK? I mean Kim took the train to Moscow.

  18. #34838
    Herald of the Titans enigma77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iphie View Post
    Isn't there a train connection to russia from NK? I mean Kim took the train to Moscow.
    They are meeting in Russia's far east.

  19. #34839
    Over 9000! zealo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iphie View Post
    Isn't there a train connection to russia from NK? I mean Kim took the train to Moscow.
    That meeting happened in Vladivostok, but yes, there are train connections from NK to Russia, by which point Russia would presumably handle the logistics themselves if they get munitions from Fatso.

  20. #34840
    Herald of the Titans Iphie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zealo View Post
    That meeting happened in Vladivostok, but yes, there are train connections from NK to Russia, by which point Russia would presumably handle the logistics themselves if they get munitions from Fatso.
    Right, right, I must've been misinformed about the location. My point was more or less that China doesn't need to be involved at all in the logistics.

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