Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Gabriel]

Oi! @Ulmita! Since you are here, care to finally give us your analysis on the effectiveness of the S400 systems?

[Cynical Asshole]

So Russia is now drawing air planes on the ground to fool satellites.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ir-bases-apron

[DarkTZeratul]

So Russia is now drawing air planes on the ground to fool satellites.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ir-bases-apron

That's honestly not the worst idea in the world.

[NoiseTank13]

So Russia is now drawing air planes on the ground to fool satellites.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ir-bases-apron

This is a legit tactic, been done for ages.

[Corvus]

Lack of shadows being cast is a bit of a give away.

Plus modern military satellites are way more powerful than the commercial ones we see and they won't be fooled by paint.

[Azadina]

Seems like a far better idea, than stacking tires on wings.

[Nymrohd]

I don't know what exactly is going on as far as popular support is concerned but it will be troubling when the EU has now two members who will likely oppose every disbursement towards Ukraine while the US had to drop it out of the budget and will now fight to include it in separate funding. The Ukraine absolutely depends on foreign funds. And it is not just material and training, the EU in particular has focused on humanitarian aid which is just as important. I know you all love to bash the Russophiles and on principle I agree but acting as if there is no chance the West fucks this up for Ukraine is irresponsible. We have a history of fucking up allies.

[enigma77]

Seems like a far better idea, than stacking tires on wings.

The orcish race is advancing

[Elder Millennial]

I don't know what exactly is going on as far as popular support is concerned but it will be troubling when the EU has now two members who will likely oppose every disbursement towards Ukraine while the US had to drop it out of the budget and will now fight to include it in separate funding. The Ukraine absolutely depends on foreign funds. And it is not just material and training, the EU in particular has focused on humanitarian aid which is just as important. I know you all love to bash the Russophiles and on principle I agree but acting as if there is no chance the West fucks this up for Ukraine is irresponsible. We have a history of fucking up allies.

We absolutely have a chance to fuck this up.

The thing is, the lack of support we're seeing in Europe and the US are actually fundamentally different, although can produce identical outcomes. This is also notable in how Russian propaganda directed to the US media and directed to Europeans is different.

Painting the Ukrainians as the guilty party largely failed to move public opinion in the US, so the Russians largely stopped trying with that tactic. Instead the propaganda they are pushing in the US is more about appealing to the "It's none of our business, whatabout using that money at home." bullshit.

In Europe the narrative that seems to have landed better was "America/EU/NATO bad, they provoked Russia."

[Nymrohd]

In Europe the narrative that seems to have landed better was "America/EU/NATO bad, they provoked Russia."

In Europe the left is so hard wired to hate US and particularly NATO that propaganda is just extremely easy for them.

[Iphie]

In Europe the left is so hard wired to hate US and particularly NATO that propaganda is just extremely easy for them.

Well, that's a gross generalization...At least for the Netherlands it's mostly the far right who are pro-russia, the left not so much. In fact as far as I've heard in the last couple of years it's overall the right who is in bed with russia across Europe.

[Santti]

In Europe the left is so hard wired to hate US and particularly NATO that propaganda is just extremely easy for them.

I've no idea where you got that from, but I don't think that's true. At least not in here. I don't think people really "hate" US. Really glad we don't have to endure it's bullshit by having to live in there, but that's pretty much where that ends. People dislike Russia far, far more than US. That's for sure.

And opinions about NATO are quite favorable.

[Kallisto]

In Europe the left is so hard wired to hate US and particularly NATO that propaganda is just extremely easy for them.

Most of the European Left hate Russia because it is basically behind the far right surge in Europe. The only "Left" that's OK with Russia are tankies and everyone hates tankies.

[diller]

In Europe the left is so hard wired to hate US and particularly NATO that propaganda is just extremely easy for them.

I think this says more about your ideology than 'the left' since it's utter bullshit.

[Nymrohd]

I think this says more about your ideology than 'the left' since it's utter bullshit.

I am thinking you are all confusing the center left with the left. Europe has actually communist parties in almost every country.

[diller]

I've no idea where you got that from, but I don't think that's true. At least not in here. I don't think people really "hate" US. Really glad we don't have to endure it's bullshit by having to live in there, but that's pretty much where that ends. People dislike Russia far, far more than US. That's for sure.

And opinions about NATO are quite favorable.

He doesn't know what he's talking about - it certainly isn't the general left wing take on this, that the Slovakian party that is against helping Ukraine is pretty niche and they really aren't left leaning in the modern sense, the only left thing about them is 'social safety' on all other points they are conservative/nationalistic.

- - - Updated - - -

I am thinking you are all confusing the center left with the left. Europe has actually communist parties in almost every country.

Oh such parties might exist but they aren't actually left or have any kind of popularity.

[Nymrohd]

Oh such parties might exist but they aren't actually left or have any kind of popularity.

I'd say it's on average about 5% of Europe? And can get about 8-9% in some countries. Sure they are not a majority, but they are part of the political discourse.
And what do you mean communism is not left?

[Wilian]

I don't know what exactly is going on as far as popular support is concerned but it will be troubling when the EU has now two members who will likely oppose every disbursement towards Ukraine while the US had to drop it out of the budget and will now fight to include it in separate funding. The Ukraine absolutely depends on foreign funds. And it is not just material and training, the EU in particular has focused on humanitarian aid which is just as important. I know you all love to bash the Russophiles and on principle I agree but acting as if there is no chance the West fucks this up for Ukraine is irresponsible. We have a history of fucking up allies.

West has been fucking this up from day 1 by allowing Russia dictate the rules of escalation and by providing bare minimum when everything should've been frontloaded from before 2022 invasion. It's just that there's now a risk of fucking it up even further.

[Barzotti]

Most of the European Left hate Russia because it is basically behind the far right surge in Europe. The only "Left" that's OK with Russia are tankies and everyone hates tankies.

The far left leader in France, Jean-Luc Mélenchon, is clearly anti NATO and anti USA/pro Russia. In 2022, he was against supplying weapons to Ukraine at the start of the war and declared that NATO was responsible of the tensions with Russia. He publicly changed his views due to the deserved backlash, and called for negotiations with Russia (omegalul).

It doesn't mean that every french voting for his party (LFI) shares the same views. But Mélenchon placed third at the presidential election in 2022 with almost 22% of the votes. He's not a small fish in the pond.

Our far left is close to Russia for ideological reasons. Our far right is close to Russia for both ideological and monetary reasons. Russia lent almost 10 million euros to Le Pen's party in 2014.

I'd say it's on average about 5% of Europe? And can get about 8-9% in some countries. Sure they are not a majority, but they are part of the political discourse.
And what do you mean communism is not left?

Far left is clearly the third political force in France, behind center right and far right. About 20-25% of the votes.

[Gorsameth]

When dealing with parties of any political leaning being pro-Russian my first question is not about ideology or policy, but about money.

How many parties, no matter their leaning, are pro-Russian because they are payed, by Russia, to be so?