Russian invasion of Ukraine

[alach]

I think it would make a difference if the media was more clear about the aid bring delivered. People hear these huge numbers and are like "that money could've fix my potholes and saved the country' when in reality its like 5% of the American military budget. The aid packages sound large when they have no metric to compare it to. If they reported aid in gdp %s I doubt many people would object.
Og and not to mention most of what's been given to ukraine has been old and out of date.

[Iphie]

I think it would make a difference if the media was more clear about the aid bring delivered. People hear these huge numbers and are like "that money could've fix my potholes and saved the country' when in reality its like 5% of the American military budget. The aid packages sound large when they have no metric to compare it to. If they reported aid in gdp %s I doubt many people would object.
Og and not to mention most of what's been given to ukraine has been old and out of date.

to add to this: very little actually goes as money most goes as material. Meaning there's no "pallets of cash" going. (another talking point)

[Wilian]

I don't think NATO can intervene as an entity, the whole point of a defensive alliance is that it can only act if a member is attacked. I don't think individual nato members declaring war on Russia would drag everyone else into the war either. its pretty interesting to me that aiding one side doesn't automatically mean you've also declared war, seeing as you've openly picked a side you want to win.

there is some merit to Nato expanding though its just doing it through diplomacy without firing a shot, countries feel safer joining NATO it grows stronger. I don't buy the idea that its gearing up to invade Russia though that is obviously being used as an excuse for this invasion. But it is proving its existence is warranted.

obviously, the biggest risk is that this does just end up as a 3rd world war. Because if nato did join in it's pretty likely china would think about making a move on Taiwan and also probably putting more effort into aiding Russia. it's pretty close to the point where one side of the world is ready to start fighting the other side.

North Korea has a pretty big standing army for its size, It's been like that for ages, i'm sure they are itching to whelp themselves into something. Japan is eyeing up the islands Russia stole from them. There is ample tension in the air no one wants to do anything rash but once it starts then so does the opportunism.

Of course NATO can act and has acted before under UN mandate. The problem now is that UN has been essentially taken over by rogue actor like Russia due to veto rights so NATO should evolve beyond expecting UN mandate and act indepentently.

[Ulmita]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

[DarkTZeratul]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Of course he does, if they join NATO he can't conquer them anymore.

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever read. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this thread is now dumber for having seen it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

[Surfd]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

Mass extinction event. Lol, please. No matter what kind of idiotic Russian propaganda you are huffing, nobody is going to nuke anybody. There are far too many people who value living, even in Russia, to ever allow that to happen. Putie will end up falling out a window onto a dozen bullets if he ever tries to actually issue that order.

[Dontrike]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

Russia won't nuke. If they do even their allies will come down on them, along with the world, and Russia will be broken into pieces. All a nuke does is cause a pyrrhic victory for Russia, it does not win them anything.

[Wilian]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

There already was mass extinction event. Mass brain extinction event. In Russia.

[Specialka]

Of course NATO can act and has acted before under UN mandate. The problem now is that UN has been essentially taken over by rogue actor like Russia due to veto rights so NATO should evolve beyond expecting UN mandate and act indepentently.

And USA as well in regards to the Gaza situation or China when it suits them, etc...

[Dontrike]

And USA as well in regards to the Gaza situation or China when it suits them, etc...

You can tell they have nothing to add when they deflect to anything that's not about Russia. I hope you at least get paid well to do this.

[Gabriel]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

You are such a fucking moron.

[Gorsameth]

to add to this: very little actually goes as money most goes as material. Meaning there's no "pallets of cash" going. (another talking point)

In addition to this addition, a lot of it is even surplus material. They didn't spend money telling a contractor to build a weapon to ship to Ukraine, the weapon was build a decade ago as part of routine military procurement and to keep the factories running and maintain production knowledge and its been sitting in storage all this time and now its being send to Ukraine.

Most of the financial support is coming from the EU, which has send 3x as much as the US.

[diller]

NATO is afraid of escalation, they have always been afraid of it. Meanwhile Russia gives no shits because they know that so long as they don't directly invade NATO we don't do anything.

I mean being afraid is the whole reason for the defensive pact in the first place, who would have thought it wasn't communism that was the enemy back then.

[Twdft]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

Big wife beater logic going on here. "She asked her friend to protect her from me, so naturally I had to shoot up the whole neighborhood, it was inevitable".

Do you even think 1 second before clicking post?

[Saradain]

Ukraine will join NATO at some point:
https://youtu.be/QxLRtlHJwv8?si=IhQlp3sYVtho4kPn

Putin has said that will lead to catastrophe
https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod/s...909581566?s=19

Retards in NATO, Brussels and Washington are pushing for a mass extinction event. I was never pro Trump but after this I am starting to hope that he will win the elections.

What in the world of shit is this.

All bait out, gentlemen, russian shills are DESPERATE.

Oh no, the blame suddenly belongs to those who would grant security and peace to victims of Nazi Russia! Poor Russia, if they cannot invade anyone, they just HAVE to resort to n00ks!

- - - Updated - - -

And USA as well in regards to the Gaza situation or China when it suits them, etc...

What was said about whataboutism in this thread several times over by mods?

[Iphie]

Interesting...

MOSCOW, Feb 26 (Reuters) - Russian opposition politician Alexei Navalny was close to being freed in a prisoner swap at the time of his death, Maria Pevchikh, a Navalny ally, said on Monday, repeating her allegation that President Vladimir Putin had him killed.

Ok, so, let's assume this is real for a moment, who ordered Navalny's death then? I can see various scenarios and some make putin look mighty weak. I mean yeah ,they say puitn had him killed but that may not be true, even if he's the most likely culprit. (various outlets are wondering about the timing and how it's not really to putin's benefit)

[Specialka]

What in the world of shit is this.

All bait out, gentlemen, russian shills are DESPERATE.

Oh no, the blame suddenly belongs to those who would grant security and peace to victims of Nazi Russia! Poor Russia, if they cannot invade anyone, they just HAVE to resort to n00ks!

- - - Updated - - -



What was said about whataboutism in this thread several times over by mods?

Great, because whataboutism would be me saying it is ok for Russia to do it because the others are doing it. Which it is not what I am saying. I am saying that those countries are doing it because they can. Does that make it "ok"? Nope because each time, hundreds die. But they will still do it because they want to protect their interests.

I some way, at the international level, might makes right.

[Saradain]

Great, because whataboutism would be me saying it is ok for Russia to do it because the others are doing it. Which it is not what I am saying. I am saying that those countries are doing it because they can. Does that make it "ok"? Nope because each time, hundreds die. But they will still do it because they want to protect their interests.

I some way, at the international level, might makes right.

Fair enough, I was distracted by sheer stupidity of Ulmita-posting. I suppose we have to repeat the same point - it's not ideal how the world works, but it is what it is.

And this thread isn't really about UN vetoing so it's not exactly relevant to what US alone or China does at the UN.

But if might makes right...

[Cthulhu 2020]

It's so interesting that people can realize and even acknowledge that NATO exists as a defense against Russian aggression, and simultaneously scarf down Putin's lines about it leading to a mass extinction and say that it would all be the fault of NATO and the US because "Russia would have no choice but to nuke".

Like, you motherfuckers realize that Russia is the one making the threats? They say they don't have a choice but they do. If you think Russia is required to launch nukes because OTHER countries ally, you're so brain broken that it's beyond reasoning. How about Russia stops giving other countries a reason to ally against them.

- - - Updated - - -

Great, because whataboutism would be me saying it is ok for Russia to do it because the others are doing it. Which it is not what I am saying. I am saying that those countries are doing it because they can. Does that make it "ok"? Nope because each time, hundreds die. But they will still do it because they want to protect their interests.

I some way, at the international level, might makes right.

Why do hundreds have to die just because they want to protect themselves? It's been made pretty clear that Russia is a rabid aggressor, and it's likely that thousands would have died instead. Russia keeps violating other country's sovereignty, but you don't give a fuck about that because you're an ocean away and not having your land stolen and your family murdered.

[Veggie50]

Great, because whataboutism would be me saying it is ok for Russia to do it because the others are doing it. Which it is not what I am saying. I am saying that those countries are doing it because they can. Does that make it "ok"? Nope because each time, hundreds die. But they will still do it because they want to protect their interests.

I some way, at the international level, might makes right.

This is a bit it a strawman argument, because “whataboutism” has never been about saying somethings ok, its about saying “something else is just as bad/worse” which is exactly what you’re saying.