Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Gabriel]

Pope says Ukraine should have 'courage of the white flag' of negotiations
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...of%20thousands.



I think that he stepped a bit out of line. It's another thing to talk about peace through negotiations and another to talk about peace because of defeat.

The Pope can suck it.

[prwraith]

Pope says Ukraine should have 'courage of the white flag' of negotiations
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...of%20thousands.



I think that he stepped a bit out of line. It's another thing to talk about peace through negotiations and another to talk about peace because of defeat.

Literally, the pope can go fuck himself. He should stay in the ivory tower of his dying religion and keep his nose out of world affairs that do not concern him. If he practiced any of what he preached he wouldn't be telling Ukraine to roll over and die

[Huehuecoyotl]

87 year old head of religious group speaks...Safe to say, his insights are not exactly sensible. Peace good, peace via caving for aggressor's terms, especially for areas they do not even fully occupy not good. Thankfully, Russia can just leave and withdraw, now I wouldn't bet money for the pope to suggest such a wild and unheard option.

If he's 87, he was alive during WW2. He has first hand experience of what happens when you try appeasement, and this is his assessment?

Safe to say we can ignore his musings on this subject.

[Specialka]

If he's 87, he was alive during WW2. He has first hand experience of what happens when you try appeasement, and this is his assessment?

Safe to say we can ignore his musings on this subject.

He also probably saw the real horror of a war. Which many here did not.

[Kaleredar]

He also probably saw the real horror of a war. Which many here did not.

His implorements should be directed at Russia to cease, seeing as it's Russia's war.

Any sort of "peace settlement" with Russia that is anything other than "Russia fucks off back to Russia and Ukraine enters a military alliance with NATO/the EU/whomever" is no "peace" at all. And if Russia succeeds in Ukraine they wont stop with Ukraine.


And I'm not personally a fan of the notion of "peace now is what we want, even if it means more people die later." That's simply foolish.

[Saradain]

He also probably saw the real horror of a war. Which many here did not.

To which an obvious answer is to appease a Nazi state so they can recover to continue the conquest anew. Not.

[Iphie]

If he's 87, he was alive during WW2. He has first hand experience of what happens when you try appeasement, and this is his assessment?

Safe to say we can ignore his musings on this subject.

Eh, he's Argentinian, I kinda doubt the had first-hand experience of the war, and he was 3 when the war broke out.

He also probably saw the real horror of a war. Which many here did not.

See above.

[Corvus]

He lived through the Junta ruling Argentina and disappearing tens of thousands of those on the left and stayed silent the whole despite some clergy protesting and being disappeared as well.

He is just continuing his fascist appeasement.

[Iphie]

He lived through the Junta ruling Argentina and disappearing tens of thousands of those on the left and stayed silent the whole despite some clergy protesting and being disappeared as well.

He is just continuing his fascist appeasement.

My point is: no 3 year old has a clue about the politics on the other side of the world, and he definitely didn't "see the real horror of a war" at that age. (I'm most certainly NOT saying that no 3 year old has seen the horror of the war, just that this particular one hasn't.) This shouldn't be a controversial take to be honest, since it's factually correct.

[Joszef Kiprich]

Well Argentina had a huge increase of German and Italian surnames after the war...

[diller]

We can't even be bothered to send weapons and ressources to a country that is invaded by the "enemy" and reason the NATO exists (lets not fool ourselves here, NATO exist against the threat of what is called "Russia" right now.)

This is utter nonsense, NATO is a defensive pact that the Ukraine is not part of we already do more than we should considering we are not an actual part of the war - and by that I don't mean we shouldn't help Ukraine but that we have no obligation to.

But your take is ridiculous Russia IS afraid of the west glassing them if they tried anything. The THREAT is both ways despite not being outright said so.

[Poopymonster]

If he's 87, he was alive during WW2. He has first hand experience of what happens when you try appeasement, and this is his assessment?

Safe to say we can ignore his musings on this subject.

He also is from Argentina. Who after WW2 saw first hand a number of fairer skinned people who immigrated to that and the surrounding area.
For Reasons.

It did wonders for his country, no?

[Mayhem]

If he's 87, he was alive during WW2. He has first hand experience of what happens when you try appeasement, and this is his assessment?

Safe to say we can ignore his musings on this subject.

He is from Argentina, the only thing he can probably remember from WW2 is nice Germans suddenly landing in Argentina trying to make themselves a new home.

[alach]

Some very bad news for the war today...

A Russian Drone Spotted A Ukrainian Patriot Air-Defense Crew Convoying Near The Front Line. Soon, A Russian Hypersonic Missile Streaked Down.
Ukraine just lost its first Patriot launchers, and probably their crews.

A Russian drone operator’s persistence and good fortune paid off on or right before Saturday, when they located—outside of Pokrovsk in eastern Ukraine—a Ukrainian convoy including, it seems, at least two truck-mounted quad-launchers for a Patriot surface-to-air missile battery.
...
It was the first time in Russia’s two-year wider war on Ukraine that the Russians have managed to find and target part of a Ukrainian Patriot battery. And for the Russians, the hit couldn’t have come at a more pivotal time.

Ukrainian Patriot batteries in the last month have shot down as many as a dozen Russian air force fighter-bombers, blunting Russia’s aerial advantage as the wider war grinds into its third year.
...
However overextended Ukraine’s air-defenders were before the Russians blew up two of their Patriot launchers and likely killed their experienced crews, the air-defenders are even more overextended now. And they may struggle to replace those lost launchers.
...
No, Ukraine tends to get its Patriot batteries and missiles as donations. And while Germany, The Netherlands or some other European operator could gift more hardware, it’s most expedient for it to come from the source. The United States.

But Russia-friendly Republicans in the U.S. Congress have, since October, been blocking further U.S. aid to Ukraine. So every Patriot launcher the Ukrainians lose is a Patriot launcher they can’t easily replace.

More news,

Russian defense production is starting to get really worrying

For two years, Russia has been revamping its industrial production capability and the country now can produce a lot more weapons and ammunition than Western experts thought Moscow would be able to make at the onset of war.
A worrying example of just how dedicated Russia is to its arms industry can be found in the amount of money Moscow is spending on defense, which has risen to an estimated 7.5% of its Gross Domestic Product (GDP) The Guardian reported.
Russian defense spending may not sound like a lot when weighed against the GDP of the country, but the Kremlin’s 2024 budget puts Moscow’s total spending on defense at $109 billion, which is 29.4% or about one-third of all government spending for the year Reuters noted in October 2023.

... and so on.

[KrayZ33]

This is utter nonsense, NATO is a defensive pact that the Ukraine is not part of we already do more than we should considering we are not an actual part of the war - and by that I don't mean we shouldn't help Ukraine but that we have no obligation to.

But your take is ridiculous Russia IS afraid of the west glassing them if they tried anything. The THREAT is both ways despite not being outright said so.

Not sure if you actually read what I wrote.
So I'd say your take is a bit confused.

NATO as a defensive pact exist because of Russia, without a threat, there is no need for a defensive pact.
And I'm not saying we have an obligation to send help either, not sure where that is coming from, I'm saying it's for our benefit if we bother to send more ressources and weapons there because it's a way to weaken the threat that is clearly manifesting at the NATO border.
If it's not a threat, why do you think NATO got larger after what just happened in the last two years?

And no, we are not doing more than we should, we are doing less than we should.
I have yet to understand why anyone would say anything different. Considering the history of Ukraine and why it's NOT a NATO member, it's even more obvious as to why we should do more. Not to mention that Ukraine is a PfP member and honestly, if "partnership for peace" means anything, I would have thought we should do everything to maintain peace and stop aggressors, even if we aren't obligated to send troops.



As for the second part, sadly, you didn't understand what I was trying to say.
I'm talking about the common people and how they'd value politicians throwing nukes threats around.

In Russia it's "strength" and the idiots rally behind it.
In the west, the leader would be voted out of office if he did the same.

Either way, Russia wins (in that buzzword contest) because it just unites it's people due to how they make use of propaganda and brainwashing, while in the west it would split the population and probably hurt the "war support".

[Saradain]

Some very bad news for the war today...

Oh no. Not for the war effort, but the flood of vatnik-posting spamming the pictures and videos from 10+ angles and laughing that Ukraine is not winning fast enough.

[Gaidax]

No idea why he even gave that statement.

Could have just done the generic best wishes and other expected canned responses.

[Jessicka]

This is utter nonsense, NATO is a defensive pact that the Ukraine is not part of we already do more than we should considering we are not an actual part of the war - and by that I don't mean we shouldn't help Ukraine but that we have no obligation to.

But your take is ridiculous Russia IS afraid of the west glassing them if they tried anything. The THREAT is both ways despite not being outright said so.

Ukraine is like half a step from being NATO, so any notion that we’re doing “more than we should” is absurd, because doing any less means Ukraine falls and we’re less than a decade down the line from war in Europe, but no doubt there’ll still be plenty of Americans crying about doing more than they should, just like last time.

At this point I’m not even opposed to NATO states putting troops in unilaterally.

And no, I don’t think Russia is afraid of being glassed because there’s no world in which NATO actually uses those weapons first and they know it. It’s an excuse that plays well at home for your typical fascist “everything sucks here because of those guys over there” bullshit.

[diller]

Ukraine is like half a step from being NATO, so any notion that we’re doing “more than we should” is absurd

It's not absurd it's facts, Ukraine is not a part of NATO we are not obliged to help, and as I'm pretty sure you can tell I'm all for helping Ukraine.

- - - Updated - - -

And no, I don’t think Russia is afraid of being glassed because there’s no world in which NATO actually uses those weapons first and they know it. It’s an excuse that plays well at home for your typical fascist “everything sucks here because of those guys over there” bullshit.

Who's talking about NATO using weapons first, my point was if Russia drops a nuke against some NATO country they will be glassed that is a deterrence in itself.

[Iphie]

St. Peterburgians shouldn't smoke.