Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Muzjhath]

They absolutely despite putting any resources towards Europe. We have no capital or raw resources that would benefit them.

History lesson for you: the Martial Plan

[Iphie]

History lesson for you: the Martial Plan

Useless example for Finns, they never received Marshall help because the government was afraid the USSR would see it as provocation.

[Muzjhath]

Useless example for Finns, they never received Marshall help because the government was afraid the USSR would see it as provocation.

Neither did Sweden directly.

But it is an example of the US spending staggering money on Europe.

[Saradain]

Useless example for Finns, they never received Marshall help because the government was afraid the USSR would see it as provocation.

But an excellent example to display how the orks have always wanted to isolate their imagined vassals from the rest of the civilized world. Everything is a provocation. Should not have accepted any help from anyone else but them!

[Mayhem]

Why?

It's not really outside the realm of possibility.

I think some people living in some weird state of euphoria, who knows what will happen tomorrow in Europe. The other side spares no effort to drive a wedge in European unity one way or another, just a few "rogue" states is enough to paralyze a lot of EU decision making. And I am not sure Europe wants to pin your hopes and wishes on whoever happens to sit in the chair over the pond, either.

Europe needs to prepare to stand for itself, because next decade there will be a few more conflicts that will spread US very thin. This nonsense about how European backdoor can start crumbling if US does not send $$ in time should be a wakeup call for the Europe.

Considering far-right parties in Germany and Austria are blowing up right now because of their ties to Russia I doubt that Russia can just keep going.

[Iphie]

But an excellent example to display how the orks have always wanted to isolate their imagined vassals from the rest of the civilized world. Everything is a provocation. Should not have accepted any help from anyone else but them!

Hmm..true, still Suomettuminen wasn't funny. Glad we stopped doing that.

[diller]

Because in the end, politicians are pulling the strings. The baltic attack will come closer to 2030, which gives Russia enough time to rebuilt their military after Ukraine and to try install right wing populist pro-russia governments into NATO countries.

As it is now there are already NATO troops stationed in the Baltics, are you saying NATO countries will just ignore it if they are attacked?

[zealo]

As it is now there are already NATO troops stationed in the Baltics, are you saying NATO countries will just ignore it if they are attacked?

This is one of the reasons as to why there’s NATO troops of all sorts of nationalities in the baltics.

It’s called a tripwire force usually, whose purpose is to also make not acting if they’re attacked a lot more politically difficult domestically.

[Vonazak]

Republican's hatred for Ukraine truly confused me for quite a while.

The whole "Don't tread on me/patriotism/I'm a Western Chauvinist" crowd turned on a dime when running into an actual citizen army, fighting off an evil dictatorship in the name of God and Country and Western Values and free trade.

I'm like these people right here are the living breathing incarnation of everything you people claimed to have stood for for the last 80 years.

That's how Americans have rolled since, well, always.

Ukraine is losing the war, does not matter how much weapons you give them, they are not advancing and Russia is just gaining territory by the day. Its a lost cause, there is no need to hate Ukraine to see it. Russia, even as incompetent as they are, will win this unless the Euros step up and actually send troops there, something that will not happen because they are too scared to do anything worthwhile to help the Ukrainians.

And Ukraine don't upheld Western values. It's an Eastern corrupt cleptocracy as much as Russia is.

[Jessicka]

That's how Americans have rolled since, well, always.

Ukraine is losing the war, does not matter how much weapons you give them, they are not advancing and Russia is just gaining territory by the day. Its a lost cause, there is no need to hate Ukraine to see it. Russia, even as incompetent as they are, will win this unless the Euros step up and actually send troops there, something that will not happen because they are too scared to do anything worthwhile to help the Ukrainians.

And Ukraine don't upheld Western values. It's an Eastern corrupt cleptocracy as much as Russia is.

Year three of special three day military operation, comrade.

While we may have said we won't send troops, we also said no air power, no long range missiles, and no to a lot more things we've ultimately given them. I really wouldn't rule out ground troops at all, but more realistically massed air power would probably turn the tide.

[Flarelaine]

"I rather send bullets to Ukraine than our boys."

Mike Johnson.

I agree with him on that.

Dude is smarter than I gave him credit for.

[Specialka]

Year three of special three day military operation, comrade.

While we may have said we won't send troops, we also said no air power, no long range missiles, and no to a lot more things we've ultimately given them. I really wouldn't rule out ground troops at all, but more realistically massed air power would probably turn the tide.

Sending equipments is a thing, that does not make you directly involved, and thus at war. Sending troops is going to war, something the EU is not ready (and does not want anyway). Troops would, MAYBE, be involved if Kiyv was in danger of being taken or something.

[Gabriel]

That's how Americans have rolled since, well, always.

Ukraine is losing the war, does not matter how much weapons you give them, they are not advancing and Russia is just gaining territory by the day. Its a lost cause, there is no need to hate Ukraine to see it. Russia, even as incompetent as they are, will win this unless the Euros step up and actually send troops there, something that will not happen because they are too scared to do anything worthwhile to help the Ukrainians.

And Ukraine don't upheld Western values. It's an Eastern corrupt cleptocracy as much as Russia is.

Yaaaaay, another totally-neutral-you-guys poster!

[Benggaul]

Dude is smarter than I gave him credit for.

Too many people make the mistake in assuming that all of the GOP are stupid, and folks like Greene, Boebert and such certainly don't help, but don't attribute to ignorance what is easily explained by malice.

[alach]

I said years before and I'll say again, I don't see how russia could ever win this. With or without the west's help, the people of Ukraine will resist. Even occupied they would resist, there would be insurgencies, rebellions, years of freedom fighters against the occupiers. Even if Russia wins this "war" who really believes there wouldn't be a resistance, going on for years.

When in history do the people just let the invaders occupy happily?

Anyways, with the weapons and the jets finally coming, this will give Ukraine what they have been lacking lately, a huge morale boost.

[DarkTZeratul]

I really wouldn't rule out ground troops at all, but more realistically massed air power would probably turn the tide.

I think it would take a truly exceptional event for the US to send actual troops into Ukraine.

[Xyonai]

Too many people make the mistake in assuming that all of the GOP are stupid, and folks like Greene, Boebert and such certainly don't help, but don't attribute to ignorance what is easily explained by malice.

Also helps that - from what I hear - Johnson's 'coming to jesus' moment about Ukraine aid came shortly after security briefing he had. so either he got a really thorough reality check or some Three Letter Agency members gave him a very stern talking to.

[Poopymonster]

Also helps that - from what I hear - Johnson's 'coming to jesus' moment about Ukraine aid came shortly after security briefing he had. so either he got a really thorough reality check or some Three Letter Agency members gave him a very stern talking to.

Smart money is that as Speaker, he got access to some info and he had his jesus coming moment like he was an altar boy kneeling after mass.

[Specialka]

I said years before and I'll say again, I don't see how russia could ever win this. With or without the west's help, the people of Ukraine will resist. Even occupied they would resist, there would be insurgencies, rebellions, years of freedom fighters against the occupiers. Even if Russia wins this "war" who really believes there wouldn't be a resistance, going on for years.

When in history do the people just let the invaders occupy happily?

Anyways, with the weapons and the jets finally coming, this will give Ukraine what they have been lacking lately, a huge morale boost.

Who said that Russia will occupy Ukraine and that Ukrainians would be "happy" about it. You just go the occupiers textbook methods, you execute civilians left and right to keep the other in line. And one could say that Russia has already "lost" in the sense that it showed that they are not the super military power they claimed to be. They have the numbers, true but their equipments is far from being what they claimed to be.

And even if the jets are coming soon, the pilots for them are still in training and are only coming by the end of the year.

[Gorsameth]

I said years before and I'll say again, I don't see how russia could ever win this. With or without the west's help, the people of Ukraine will resist. Even occupied they would resist, there would be insurgencies, rebellions, years of freedom fighters against the occupiers. Even if Russia wins this "war" who really believes there wouldn't be a resistance, going on for years.

When in history do the people just let the invaders occupy happily?

Anyways, with the weapons and the jets finally coming, this will give Ukraine what they have been lacking lately, a huge morale boost.

Russia has a lot of experience in suppressing a population, they have done it for their entire history. Forced relocation and replacement combined with brutal suppression wear people down eventually. And if the country had fallen in the initial invasion no one would have helped them, without hope for an international army liberating them Russia would have free reign to whatever they want. We know sanctions don't stop them.

They would resist for years doesn't matter when Russia has all the time in the world.