Russian invasion of Ukraine

**Kaleredar** · 2024-07-14, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by Specialka

Did not the Usa, top 1 superpower, had some massive fuckups over the decade ?

The US’ invasions were all very, very successful. You really can’t point to many individual operations they took or offensives undergone that actually “failed.”

The US’ failure in the Middle East was in failing to establish a lasting order conducive to their goals.

But destabilizing or taking down governments in the Middle East? They did that in spades. Nor was the US ever “driven” from a middle eastern country; they occupied them to some degree for decades. Until it became clear that it was all a bloody waste of manpower and resources… and then not for some time after that.

Russia never even got to the part where they would have to contend with Ukrainian insurgencies. Because they never took down the government in the first place, let alone installed puppet ones or flat-out took over. They didn’t even climb step one on the ladder that the US eventually couldn’t handle.

**Specialka** · 2024-07-14, 05:36 PM

Originally Posted by Kaleredar

The US’ invasions were all very, very successful. You really can’t point to many individual operations they took or offensives undergone that actually “failed.”

The US’ failure in the Middle East was in failing to establish a lasting order conducive to their goals.

But destabilizing or taking down governments in the Middle East? They did that in spades. Nor was the US ever “driven” from a middle eastern country; they occupied them to some degree for decades. Until it became clear that it was all a bloody waste of manpower and resources… and then not for some time after that.

Russia never even got to the part where they would have to contend with Ukrainian insurgencies. Because they never took down the government in the first place, let alone installed puppet ones or flat-out took over. They didn’t even climb step one on the ladder that the US eventually couldn’t handle.

Because they "learn". Corea's war ? Vietnam ? Cuba missile crisis ? Then they learnt to do it another way (sometimes successfully, sometimes not).

But the point is: a superpower can have some massive fuckups (which the invasion of Ukraine was because they went in totally unprepared and believing they would steamroll everything in 3 day).

**gondrin** · 2024-07-14, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by Mayhem

So what would you say is a comparable fuckup the US had?

Closest thing would be Vietnam in comparison. Still half a world away but that would have been the closest thing. No clear military object other than "Communism BAD!".

No, Afghanistan nor Iraq doesn't count because of the fact that the country did get taken over. Their governments were disposed of that were in power.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by Specialka

Because they "learn". Corea's war ? Vietnam ? Cuba missile crisis ? Then they learnt to do it another way (sometimes successfully, sometimes not).

But the point is: a superpower can have some massive fuckups (which the invasion of Ukraine was because they went in totally unprepared and believing they would steamroll everything in 3 day).

Out of all of those, only Vietnam was a US thing and they took that over from the French. The Korean War was a civil war between the different factions there and Cuba Missile Crisis wasn't a war. In fact, other than some assassination attempts and black ops on Fidel Castro, the US didn't do anything full on military with Cuba.

**Kaleredar** · 2024-07-14, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by Specialka

Because they "learn". Corea's war ? Vietnam ? Cuba missile crisis ? Then they learnt to do it another way (sometimes successfully, sometimes not).

But the point is: a superpower can have some massive fuckups (which the invasion of Ukraine was because they went in totally unprepared and believing they would steamroll everything in 3 day).

The Korean war and Vietnam weren't started by the US. The Cuban Missile crisis, by which I assume you mean the bay of pigs (seeing as the cuban missile crisis itself was basically a wash for both sides) wasn't a full-scale declaration of war invasion either.

But Russia's "fuckup" is not the kind of fuckup that a "superpower" makes. The Korean war settled the countries' respective borders at their current location. Vietnam was a decades-long engagement wherein North Vietnam, backed by the soviets and China, fought south Vietnam, backed by the US. And the bay of pigs was a sponsored insurrection consisting of ~2,000 people, mostly Cuban exiles, attempting to destabilize Castro's government.

So if it's like anything, it's most like the bay of pigs. Except Russia started with way more people, weren't relying on proxy fighters, didn't have to overcome an oceanic barrier, has actually entered a state of total war, and unlike the Bay of Pigs in which Cuba took heavier casualties than the invading forces during the actual fighting, Russia has suffered far, far more losses than Ukraine has.

**Dontrike** · 2024-07-15, 01:25 AM

Originally Posted by Endus

Including losing a full third of their navy, including their flagship, to a country that doesn't have a navy.

And the threat of lack of Trump means Russia won't be able to keep this up another 3 or 4 years. They don't have the constant resources, or economy, to keep this up. Of course, neither does Ukraine, but if you said Russia, the supposed #2 super power of the world, would lose to a country nowhere near its size and strength 10 years ago people would think you'd gone batty.

**Surfd** · 2024-07-15, 02:48 AM

Originally Posted by Specialka

Did not the Usa, top 1 superpower, had some massive fuckups over the decade ?

Russia tried to steal candy from a baby, and the tot straight handed them their asses. Not even vaguely comparable to any recent US boondoggle.

**zealo** · 2024-07-15, 08:21 AM

Originally Posted by Specialka

Did not the Usa, top 1 superpower, had some massive fuckups over the decade ?

The US toppled Saddam’s Iraq in around just a month, with that country physically being on the other side of the Atlantic to the US in terms of necessary logistics.

Its a very different thing having troubles ending an insurgency during an occupation compared to a conventional war against the armed forces of another country.

There’s only one superpower, and Russia isn’t it.

**Corvus** · 2024-07-16, 12:00 PM

The cost of buying meat for the waves continues to grow - and rapidly.

People have been tracking the rise and it has exploded of late. An indication that perhaps it is getting much harder to find willing victims.

And since that chart, it has been seen to hit 1.7 million rubles in places.

**Iphie** · 2024-07-16, 12:14 PM

I see Tatarstan, Moscow and...I can't really make out the black one, kara-something, i don't know that letter, those are the most expensive Leningrad oblast is on the rise as well.

**Flarelaine** · 2024-07-16, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by Iphie

I see Tatarstan, Moscow and...I can't really make out the black one, kara-something, i don't know that letter, those are the most expensive Leningrad oblast is on the rise as well.

The black one is Karachay-Cherkessia, very much a periphery in the Caucasus mountains.

Unlike the other three at the top, it is not prosperous, so the high price probably simply reflects scarcity.

I kinda wonder about Krasnodar (light green) as well, looks like it was breaking out then data stopped in April.

**Iphie** · 2024-07-17, 04:36 AM

Originally Posted by Flarelaine

The black one is Karachay-Cherkessia, very much a periphery in the Caucasus mountains.

Unlike the other three at the top, it is not prosperous, so the high price probably simply reflects scarcity.

I kinda wonder about Krasnodar (light green) as well, looks like it was breaking out then data stopped in April.

Thanks! I can read some cyrillic letters but others still elude me (and no not just the simple ones but also some that don't look like anything latin.)

**Dontrike** · 2024-07-17, 05:52 AM

I wonder how long, and how much, it takes to make the "world's best tank," cause Putin has lost 100 of them.

A top Russian tank touted by Russian President Vladimir Putin as the "world's best" has suffered at least 100 losses in the war in Ukraine, according to open-source information.

The losses were recorded by Oryx, an open-source intelligence site that relies on visual evidence to confirm and track war losses on both sides. More T-90Ms may have also been lost in combat but not recorded. Business Insider was unable to independently verify the information.

Losses, per the site's analysis, include destroyed, damaged, and captured vehicles.

The significant losses of the T-90M in combat highlight how the war has threatened heavy armor on both sides, even higher-end systems.

Earlier this year, the Defense Ministry of Ukraine posted footage of a US-made Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicle overwhelming a Russian T-90M tank with fire from its 25mm chain gun.

The withering fire eventually incapacitated the vehicle. The incident was just one of the vehicle's many losses.

Drones and loitering munitions, as well as mines and anti-tank missiles, are perhaps the greater threat, as these have also destroyed top Western armor provided to Ukraine, such as the Challenger, Leopard, and Abrams tanks.

Just as Ukraine has been doing with some of its tanks in this threat environment, Russia has equipped some T-90Ms with protective cope cages to shield them against anti-tank weapons and drones. The latter has become a defining threat in this war and has limited how tanks and other vehicles operate on the battlefield.

The cages don't always work, though, as video footage of some T-90M losses have shown. Sometimes the explosive first-person-view drones make it through.

Across the board, Russia's tank losses have been staggering in this conflict. Per Oryx's analysis, Russia has lost over 3,000 tanks so far.

Putin has touted the T-90M as "the world's best tank," praising its weapons, targeting capability, and armor.

"As soon as it approaches positions, no chance is left for anyone or anything," he said in 2023.

The tank boasts a powerful engine, panoramic sight with rangefinder, thermal imagining, multi-layered armor, and ammunition placed outside the unit to prevent a catastrophic explosion.

One of the first reported losses of the advanced T-90M occurred just months into the war, when a Ukrainian journalist shared a photo of the charred vehicle in Kharkiv. At the time, the T-90M was considered among the most technologically advanced battle vehicles in Russia's arsenal.

**Flarelaine** · 2024-07-17, 07:32 AM

Originally Posted by Iphie

Thanks! I can read some cyrillic letters but others still elude me (and no not just the simple ones but also some that don't look like anything latin.)

You're welcome.

For me, it's a perk of having grown up in a Russian-occupied country where I could literally see Russia(n barracks) from my house.

**Iphie** · 2024-07-17, 08:05 AM

Originally Posted by Flarelaine

You're welcome.

For me, it's a perk of having grown up in a Russian-occupied country where I could literally see Russia(n barracks) from my house.

It was 2021, I wanted to learn a language outside my comfort zone, so, naturally I started russian since that's something one might need at some point as a geologist, right?? (technically, yes, if you wanted to work for, say, Gazprom which was a decent option at the time.)

For some reason I quit that course, not entirely sure what happened...

(I'm in no way making llight of recent history, I'm just sharing one of those things in life where you go, well...damn)

What's the scuz with Xi? I read he may have had a stroke?

**Ulmita** · 2024-07-20, 11:16 PM

Some voices of logic are emerging:

NATO’s false promises are encouraging misplaced Ukrainian hopes
https://www.politico.eu/article/war-...5-anniversary/

As I've said 1000 times already, West has the worst politicians that I can remember off. The only victim here are the Ukrainian people. WAR NEEDS TO END ASAP

**Calfredd** · 2024-07-20, 11:22 PM