Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Joszef Kiprich]

I'm happy with the result, my party won, PVV got smaller (though not small enough), which means Putin lover Wilders is out of the picture for now.

Still the entire country is shifting to the right. Even if D66 were truly left, they are a left leaning centrist party, a left majority is impossible. They didn't even get a third of the seats. This old man remembers when VVD was about the furthest to the right, with the CD being insignificant. Now there are several extreme parties even further right then the CD ever was.
The most left leaning possible coalition to be made still needs the VVD.

[alach]

Pentagon cleared giving Ukraine long-range Tomahawk missiles, leaving final decision to Trump

The Pentagon has given the White House the green light to provide Ukraine with long-range Tomahawk missiles after assessing that it would not negatively impact US stockpiles, leaving the final political decision in President Donald Trump’s hands, according to three US and European officials familiar with the matter.

Trump said earlier this month during a working lunch with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky at the White House that he would rather not provide the missiles to Ukraine because “we don’t want to be giving away things that we need to protect our country.”

The future of Ukraine and long raise cruise missiles now relies on Captain Cankles' next fortune cookie.

[Iphie]

Still the entire country is shifting to the right. Even if D66 were truly left, they are a left leaning centrist party, a left majority is impossible. They didn't even get a third of the seats. This old man remembers when VVD was about the furthest to the right, with the CD being insignificant. Now there are several extreme parties even further right then the CD ever was.
The most left leaning possible coalition to be made still needs the VVD.

Yeah, I remember Hans Janmaat, I was as wee lad of barely 8 summers when the CP and CD split. I agree with your assessment, Forum and JA21 are pretty bad, even if Eerdmans tries to be "respectable"...Which won't happen as long as Annabel Nanninga is present.

I think the formation will be long and painful, unless the VVD gets over Yesilgöz and just accepts that there is no workable coalition otherwise. ("en het land moet toch bestuurd worden, he?")

But Dutch politics are adjacent at best, so we should refrain from discussing them too much unless relevant to the main topic, feel free to drop a line though if you want to discuss more.

[Elenos]

The future of Ukraine and long raise cruise missiles now relies on Captain Cankles' next fortune cookie.

The future of Ukraine will not be decided by a few dozen cruise missiles.

[Fugus]

The future of Ukraine will not be decided by a few dozen cruise missiles.

Kinda depends on where those missiles land.

I mean if Putin can target Zelinski, that means them targeting him is also free game.

And even no targeting him, just crippling a few key places and showing you can do more is a pretty good motivator to withdrawal and lick your wounds.

I mean while Russias version is targeting children and telling you to kneel or they will kill more. Going the route of taking out the military and infrastructure adjacent to the top leadership themselves and showing they can cut the head off the snake without hurting all the innocent people can work even better.

[Dontrike]

Here are some images and a video from imgur about an oil terminal going BOOM! in Russia.

[alach]

^^ Nice.

Ukraine war briefing: Ukraine says its troops still holding out in embattled Pokrovsk

Ukraine military says it has improved positions in several districts, while Moscow says its troops are enclosing in on Ukrainian forces. What we know on day 1,348
Ukraine’s top military commander said his troops were still holding out in the embattled eastern city of Pokrovsk, which Moscow said its forces were at last enclosing in a pincer movement after more than a year of fighting. “We are holding Pokrovsk,” Ukraine’s army chief Oleksandr Syrskyi said on Facebook on Saturday. “A comprehensive operation to destroy and dislodge enemy forces from Pokrovsk is ongoing.” Ukraine’s military said that it had improved its positions in some districts. Kyiv is raising the number of its assault troops in the area, the 7th Rapid Response Corps said on Facebook, adding that the situation remained “difficult and dynamic”. Capturing Pokrovsk, dubbed “the gateway to Donetsk”, would be the most important Russian territorial gain inside Ukraine since Moscow took the ruined city of Avdiivka in early 2024.

I saw reports saying putin has 150,000 troops around the city. Thats a lot.

hats off for the Jays.

[Bakis]

The future of Ukraine will not be decided by a few dozen cruise missiles.

Russias economy is struggling to say the least. If the refineries and belonging infrastructure takes more hits it will hurt even more.
Remember Russia got a infrastructure 100 years behind the west.
Add (not as of yet) but real threat of US moves against import of Russian oil, they are in the shitter. Indias is already quaking.

Russia is already living on borrowed time and so is Ukraine unless they can be bought some time with long range, sofisitcated missiles.
If that happens, Russias defeat is set in stone.

[Iphie]

Russias economy is struggling to say the least. If the refineries and belonging infrastructure takes more hits it will hurt even more.
Remember Russia got a infrastructure 100 years behind the west.
Add (not as of yet) but real threat of US moves against import of Russian oil, they are in the shitter. Indias is already quaking.

Russia is already living on borrowed time and so is Ukraine unless they can be bought some time with long range, sofisitcated missiles.
If that happens, Russias defeat is set in stone.

Well, someone poke Trump then since the Pentagon says it's ok to do so.

[alach]

Well, someone poke Trump then since the Pentagon says it's ok to do so.

He doesn't like to make important decisions during golf time. Maybe we will hear something on Tuesday.

But he loves to talk on the plane;

US President Donald Trump has said that he is not currently considering the possibility of supplying Tomahawk missiles to Ukraine.

Source: Trump speaking to journalists on Air Force One

Details: When asked whether his administration is considering providing Ukraine with long-range Tomahawk missiles, Trump replied: "No, not really."

He added that he "could change" his mind, but for now his answer is "no".

Trump was also once again asked about the "final straw" in Russian leader Vladimir Putin's unwillingness to end the war in Ukraine.

Quote: "There is no final straw. Sometimes you have to let it fight out, and they are fighting it out. And it's been a tough war for Putin. He's lost a lot of soldiers, maybe a million. That's a lot of soldiers. And it's been tough for Ukraine."

It is just so strange to hear that when he speaks about the casualties on either side he refers to them like commodities, like bags of grain or sacks of potatoes. Maybe he learned that from putin.

[Nilinor]

He doesn't like to make important decisions during golf time. Maybe we will hear something on Tuesday.

But he loves to talk on the plane;


It is just so strange to hear that when he speaks about the casualties on either side he refers to them like commodities, like bags of grain or sacks of potatoes. Maybe he learned that from putin.

While it is attributed to Stalin, not really sure who actually said it, but this just shows the truth behind a "million is a statistic" point. Neither Putin nor Trump view anyone dying in this war as the tragedy it should be, him speaking like that just proves the point. It is about them, it's always about them.

This war could be over if Trump (or Biden when he was president.. or any of the larger countries in EU) actually just gave Ukraine what they needed.

[Fugus]

Plot twist, later we find out that Argentina gave 10 billion to Russia and is part of the reason we gave so much to them.

Honestly would not be surprised at this point.

[Elder Millennial]

The future of Ukraine will not be decided by a few dozen cruise missiles.

The future of Ukraine is decided by a million different factors, big or small.

A few dozen Russian weapons factories or refineries being blown into low earth orbit would definitely help with tilting the scale in Ukraine's favor.

- - - Updated - - -

Plot twist, later we find out that Argentina gave 10 billion to Russia and is part of the reason we gave so much to them.

Honestly would not be surprised at this point.

Actually, shockingly enough...it would be really hard to convince Milei to do that. Milei is not a fan of the Russians. There's also a regional component to that, the Russians have all sorts of ...friendly ties, to regional actors Argentina has never seen eye to eye with. Not even under Peronist administrations.

It's basically a broader internal debate inside Mercosur on which direction to lean towards. So far the pro-western faction is leading, but the Russians have used their influence in the past to throw wrenches into the machinery.

There's exactly one major Latin American country that seriously needs to unfuck itself when it comes to its ties to Russia and that's Brazil.

The new EU-Mercosur deal, plus the increasing defense cooperation between the EU and Brazilian companies like Embraer will soon likely tilt the scales there too.

[Elenos]

Kinda depends on where those missiles land.

I mean if Putin can target Zelinski, that means them targeting him is also free game.

It takes more than a few dozen cruise missiles to do any real damage. Some will fail to hit, some will be intercepted.

If we look at the US when it fires cruise missiles it rarely does a few any single time, because if they want to really damage a target they fire dozens. When they struck Iran they fired 30, vast majority of those at one single site.

Anything else? It's a nice show for the media, not really a big impact. Even with FPV drones added in the mix for saturation purposes.

What's clear, and always been clear in any bombing campaign is you need both a significant degree of accuracy and a vast amount of munitions to really do any meaningful damage.

The future of Ukraine is decided by a million different factors, big or small.

A few dozen Russian weapons factories or refineries being blown into low earth orbit would definitely help with tilting the scale in Ukraine's favor.

I'm going to press X to doubt that and I'm coming here having heard about the imminent collapse of Russia's economy since 2014.

Like people were thinking Ukraine would be celebrating Christmas in Crimea at the end of 2022.

Besides Western cruise missiles aren't built on the idea to use a few of them here and there. Nor are Russian ones, which highlights how Russia's own aerial campaign is a failure. Because both Ukraine and Russia are doing this: Fire swarms of drones with a few missiles here and there.

It's flashy it gets the news....and then the impact is minimal. There IS impact yes but not enough for either side to win on it's own.

Cruise missiles are built for a massive high intensity conflict were you'd see hundreds of them being fired in but a few short weeks. Using a couple here and there will get you exactly nothing in a war.

To win an attrition war with cruise missiles you need thousands if not tens of thousands.

[Vampiregenesis]

A second generation of Europeans liberated Europe from soviet communism.... - New Netherlands guy

I wonder how is nazism viewed in places like Netherlands or Belgium, I feel that this has never been a thing for north Europeans. They always blame stalin and communism but they never say anything about hitler or nazism. It's funny that even countries like Ukraine name their airforce Luftwaffe!! and have units called edelweiss and Kraken. I hope Poland has some pride in its history and won't use similar names for its military units if it ever faces Russia. Ukraine is humiliating itself, you want to be a proud independent nation away from Oppressive Kremlin control but you name your airforce Luftwaffe, it's amazing. You can't be called a serious country like this, especially since the Germans killed 18% of Ukraine's population during ww2, even higher than Greece (12%) and considered the slavs subhumans.

Apparently we live in a different world, my country never experienced communism so I guess we can't relate with these people, we don't know how they felt. On the other hand, they never experienced the dark side of nazism who teared my country apart, that's why soviets are viewed as heroes here who saved us from nazism and extermination.

You will be surprised, how many Ukrainians are not following evacuating orders and instead choose to wait for the Russians. This is the other side of the war, there are lots of Russophiles in eastern Ukraine who risk death because they don't want to be with the west.

[alach]

Oh look, you.
Now just so we are clear, do you mean the children that are being kidnapped and then indoctrinated into believing they are russian or do you mean the citizens that have been brainwashed by years and years of propoganda to the point where they actually honestly believe putin is saving them from the evil west. Because you know, they can fuck right off, russia is very big, they can find a nice little bungalow up there in Northwest Siberia where putin won't bless them by throwing them into the frontlines as a thank you for decades of blind, stupid loyalty.
Also, while you are at it, take the trump supporters like tucker carlson that proudly proclaim to love putin's russia but get a brain ache while trashing "communist" Mandami and healthcare for all.

[Edge-]

You will be surprised, how many Ukrainians are not following evacuating orders and instead choose to wait for the Russians. This is the other side of the war, there are lots of Russophiles in eastern Ukraine who risk death because they don't want to be with the west.

We would? Surely you can show us some credible reporting on this to surprise us!

[Elder Millennial]

I'm going to press X to doubt that and I'm coming here having heard about the imminent collapse of Russia's economy since 2014.

Like people were thinking Ukraine would be celebrating Christmas in Crimea at the end of 2022.

I've been posting in this thread since 2022. Point at me ever saying those things. Hell I have posts complaining about the endless hype cycle around wunderwaffes.

Point is, that unlike Ukraine Russia has centralized weapons industries. Big factories that are pretty fucking deep inside Russia and hard to hit with small drones. Refineries are easier to damage to with drones because refineries generally burn by themselves if you hit them with moderate payloads.

Blowing up a factory making optics for tanks or electronics for Shaheds is much harder to do. That's what the Tomahawks could do for Ukraine.

- - - Updated - - -

You will be surprised, how many Ukrainians are not following evacuating orders and instead choose to wait for the Russians. This is the other side of the war, there are lots of Russophiles in eastern Ukraine who risk death because they don't want to be with the west.

That's absolute fucking horseshit and you should be ashamed of yourself.

Yes there are some Rusophiles still...but they are few and far between. Those who are staying aren't staying because they are waiting for the Russians, they are mostly staying because they fear homelessness more than they fear death.

Don't fucking project your despicable shitty personal politics onto the horrible tragedies of the people caught up in this shitshow.

You are a disgusting vile despicable piece of scummy shit.

Another reason why some people might not be evacuating.

https://x.com/Lavrovskyi/status/1985661359292350965

[Veggie50]

A second generation of Europeans liberated Europe from soviet communism.... - New Netherlands guy

I wonder how is nazism viewed in places like Netherlands or Belgium, I feel that this has never been a thing for north Europeans. They always blame stalin and communism but they never say anything about hitler or nazism. It's funny that even countries like Ukraine name their airforce Luftwaffe!! and have units called edelweiss and Kraken. I hope Poland has some pride in its history and won't use similar names for its military units if it ever faces Russia. Ukraine is humiliating itself, you want to be a proud independent nation away from Oppressive Kremlin control but you name your airforce Luftwaffe, it's amazing. You can't be called a serious country like this, especially since the Germans killed 18% of Ukraine's population during ww2, even higher than Greece (12%) and considered the slavs subhumans.

Apparently we live in a different world, my country never experienced communism so I guess we can't relate with these people, we don't know how they felt. On the other hand, they never experienced the dark side of nazism who teared my country apart, that's why soviets are viewed as heroes here who saved us from nazism and extermination.

You will be surprised, how many Ukrainians are not following evacuating orders and instead choose to wait for the Russians. This is the other side of the war, there are lots of Russophiles in eastern Ukraine who risk death because they don't want to be with the west.

As a Dutch man, I am surprised you seem to be under the delusion we dont speak ill of nazis. You know we were occupied by them for 5 years right?

To this day we hold a large national celebration for our liberation of the nazis where the Canadian veterans who helped liberate us still come over to feature in a parade. Though for obvious reasons, thats down to very few men now.

[Gabriel]

A second generation of Europeans liberated Europe from soviet communism.... - New Netherlands guy

I wonder how is nazism viewed in places like Netherlands or Belgium, I feel that this has never been a thing for north Europeans. They always blame stalin and communism but they never say anything about hitler or nazism. It's funny that even countries like Ukraine name their airforce Luftwaffe!! and have units called edelweiss and Kraken. I hope Poland has some pride in its history and won't use similar names for its military units if it ever faces Russia. Ukraine is humiliating itself, you want to be a proud independent nation away from Oppressive Kremlin control but you name your airforce Luftwaffe, it's amazing. You can't be called a serious country like this, especially since the Germans killed 18% of Ukraine's population during ww2, even higher than Greece (12%) and considered the slavs subhumans.

Apparently we live in a different world, my country never experienced communism so I guess we can't relate with these people, we don't know how they felt. On the other hand, they never experienced the dark side of nazism who teared my country apart, that's why soviets are viewed as heroes here who saved us from nazism and extermination.

You will be surprised, how many Ukrainians are not following evacuating orders and instead choose to wait for the Russians. This is the other side of the war, there are lots of Russophiles in eastern Ukraine who risk death because they don't want to be with the west.

Pfffftttt, pussies.



We're still using the swastika in Finnish Air Force flag because when it comes to triggering Russiaboos, nothing else comes even close in effectiveness.