Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Strawberry]

How about you respond to his arguments?

There's no argument.

[Elegiac]

After watching so many corpses and explosions I probably start to lose contact with reality and it feels like watching an anime. The media doesn't help with this.

Imagine typing this in words and thinking this is a remotely appropriate thing to state in a public place.

[Jessicka]

I get your point but looking at the history of Russia, it's hard to see a reference point where Russian would go we've had much better this guy sucks let's do something about it. The younger generations is more plugged into the outside so they are more likely but the average Russian has no catalyst to think that way.

What about 1917? When Communism wasn’t just a facade for a fascist regime?

[Elegiac]

There's no argument.

You're absolutely correct. There's no argument to be had with someone spouting Kremlin propaganda verbatim and feigning concern for other humans while they have a signature gloating about their refusal to get vaccinated.

[Shadowferal]

Well, for the purpose of defining the conflict, it isn't "Joe Average Russia" who lives in Russia that is the enemy. It's the soldier following orders attacking Ukraine that is the enemy.

[Jessicka]

Well, for the purpose of defining the conflict, it isn't "Joe Average Russia" who lives in Russia that is the enemy. It's the soldier following orders attacking Ukraine that is the enemy.

“Just following orders” is not a defence. And plenty of Russians have already deserted.

The ones left are those happy with firing MLRS cluster munitions into civilian areas.

[Vampiregenesis]

Well, for the purpose of defining the conflict, it isn't "Joe Average Russia" who lives in Russia that is the enemy. It's the soldier following orders attacking Ukraine that is the enemy.

So do you assume that these soldiers are doing it out of their will?

If that's the case, how were they convinced to do this in the first place, it's very hard to believe. Is there any army in the world who will get a command from the leader and disobey it?

[Gaidax]

So your opinion is biased. Good to know.

No, my opinion is informed, because I actually lived there for good half of my life and still in touch with both sides family and friends.

[Shadowferal]

What about 1917? When Communism wasn’t just a facade for a fascist regime?

To be fair, communism was very popular in the US at that time.

[Shadowferal]

So do you assume that these soldiers are doing it out of their will? If that's the case, how were they convinced to do this in the first place, it's very hard to believe. Is there any army in the world who will get a command from the leader and disobey it?

As I put it, you need to define the enemy. And I believe General Milley of the US armed forces was mentioned earlier when it came to obeying certain orders from then president Trump.

[Elegiac]

No, my opinion is informed, because I actually lived there for good half of my life and still in touch with both sides family and friends.

No dude you're clearly biased despite having emotional investment on either side of the conflict. We should absolutely be listening to an antivaxxer from Sweden for a comprehensive understanding of current events. /s

[Jessicka]

To be fair, communism was very popular in the US at that time.

Draco-Onis couldn’t think of a reference point in Russian history where the people thought “shit, these Tzars are jerks, taking all the money while our agrarian economy goes backward while the world industrialises.”

No parallels at all with a fascist dictatorship taking all the money from petroleum sales while their economy stinks and remains technologically in the 1980s.

[Machismo]

Do you think Russians that come here to post are free citizens shilling for Russia? or represent the country? seriously?

Nope, i've spoken to many, many Russians in the past 20+ years. In reality, the ones in these forums are the tiny minority with whom I've interacted.

[Shadowferal]

“Just following orders” is not a defence. And plenty of Russians have already deserted.

That's my point. Or are those that deserted the enemy?

[Machismo]

Outside information is aplenty in the US but how many Americans let is sway their world view let alone domestic ones? if it did we would have universal health care already. The average person lives in a self imposed bubble regardless of where they are outside information barely gets in.

This is literally just preaching in defense of willful ignorance.

[Voidwielder]

If you think food prices are high now, you have no idea what is about to happen.
Nitrogen based fertilizers and potash based fertilizers are a huge part of Russian exports. And the world simply needs them. There are no substitutes. This war will slam the Ukrainian grain production.

I'm stocking pasta, rice and buckwheat. You should too. There's a non zero chance of famines in places you previously would not have expected.

[Machismo]

So now the few trolls here represent all Russians?
Come on dude. I know you don't believe that. Its ok to be wrong on the internet. You don't need to keep digging that hole.

I didn't say that, and you are simply ignoring what I have said on the issue. I even specifically stated that I understand people keeping their heads down, and waiting for him to simply go away.

I've dealt with many, many Russians over the past couple decades. These forums are simply a small representation of a much larger sample size. I've worked with them, partied with them, and even argued politics with them. Honestly, almost all the interactions (other than online forums) has been enjoyable. That doesn't mean the brainwashing (politzanyatiya), and willful ignorance about their own leaders isn't prevalent.

[Jessicka]

That's my point. Or are those that deserted the enemy?

They are not.

[Machismo]

So your opinion is biased. Good to know.

Literally all opinions are biased...

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So do you assume that these soldiers are doing it out of their will?

If that's the case, how were they convinced to do this in the first place, it's very hard to believe. Is there any army in the world who will get a command from the leader and disobey it?

If they are choosing to commit war crimes, that is entirely on them.

[Shadowferal]

They are not.

We can find agreement...somewhere.

Now how about an extra large shipment of sunflower seeds to be sent to the Ukraine for Russian soldier burials?