Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Grapemask]

Yeah sorry, you are right. I was just pissed off of people shouting hurr durr war, while being half the world away, pretty safe unless crazy vlad really sends those nukes. And while I understand the sentiment to help Ukraine, in my opinion, it's not worth it to plunge at least half the world in war for it.

I mean no one wants a devastating war, but in the long term we have to consider that Putin wants to fuck the world regardless.

Ukraine is not the end of what Putin wants. We know that he wants at least the entire bloc Ukraine is a part of. And given how far he was willing to push it for Ukraine, he's not going to be any less brutal about the rest. We can probably safely assume it only gets much worse from here.

But Russia has also spent the last 10 years fucking with every industrialized nation on earth, from hacking infrastructure to outright murder on foreign soil.

Our family has a friend who was in a deeply abusive and controlling relationship. She finally got out by opening three new holes in him with a shotgun. She's spent the last 20 years in therapy and fighting off depression and substance abuse. But then there are other people who didn't get out, and they were the ones who ended up dead. You're fucked either way, but maybe one of those results was just a little better than the other.

[Gaidax]

So the crap that Russia has been pulling of for 100 plus years now they will keep on doing that for another 50 years? Or what, suddenly the crap that Putin has been doing for the last 25 or so years didn't make him populaire and won't stop the next person of becoming populaire?

Nothing changes.

Yes nothing changes, or what you thought the moment Putin goes it's going to be sunny days and blue skies?

I keep telling you, it's a system deeply ingrained and Russia is not some banana republic where all it takes is bumping off El Presidente for country to change course 180 degrees.

Also people underestimate Putin's cult in Russia. It most certainly exist as well as that dumbass Russian pride in how they are a great country with a great destiny.

[Jessicka]

I'm sure a lot of really rich people hate his guts right now. How does he even eat or sleep without constantly second guessing it? If any more nuclear weapon shenanigans happen, I think that will be the final straw in making something like that happen.

Putin made them rich. Something about not biting a hand that feeds. They'll be more worried than he is, enough of them have drunk the Polonium Tea already.

I somehow get the feeling that putin has cancer or something similar and this is his last stand of sort, making a lasting mark in history, or he is simply nuts.

I don't understand this obsession, this isn't any change in Putin's MO. He'd have been doing it from day one if he could have, he's just had to spend years rebuilding his military and making his excuses. Georgia, Donbass, Syria were all test runs on a very obvious trajectory on a plan he's made absolutely no secret of.

Nothing has changed about him, sociopathic mob boss is still the same sociopathic mob boss he's always been. People in the west thought they could just variously ignore him, take his bribes, deal with him, and over the years got complacent. Now it's like 'ex-KGB man who wanted to rebuild the USSR, who bought his way to the top, subverted and changed all the rules to let him take up a dictatorial rule, amass an army, openly assassinated his opponents', is suddenly surprisingly 30 years later, an 'ex-KGB man, turned dictator, who wants to rebuild the USSR and will use force to do it?' He's not ill, this is just what he always envisaged.

[XDurionX]

That sort of would be a loophole.

It's really not. Surrendering wouldn't make the ukraine polish magically. Not to mention you can't surrender to someone you're not in war with.

International law is a little more complex than that.

[Makabreska]

Putin made them rich. Something about not biting a hand that feeds. They'll be more worried than he is, enough of them have drunk the Polonium Tea already.

He made them rich, now he is making them (kinda) poor.

[Jessicka]

He made them rich, now he is making them (kinda) poor.

There is absolutely no risk any of them are going to worry about what they're having for breakfast tomorrow, or in 12 months time. Most of them are rich enough that they can't even comprehend how rich they are, they pay managers to hide and move their wealth around as a matter of routine. They're at no personal risk from anything or anyone, other than Putin.

[jonnysensible]

at least we know the VDV are complete dogshit. getting battered everywhere they go

[Jessicka]

So the giant column north of Kyiv that been stalled four days running now? Last report I heard was that they were setting up field camps, which is a sign they aren't planning to move anytime soon.

Let it eat itself, save ammo.

Russia has come out and said that they are not going to institute martial law. The fact that they felt the need to actually say that does say something about the situation going on in Russia.

But then again they also said they weren't going to invade Ukraine, so who knows.

Can't institute martial law if it's never not been instituted.

[Corvus]

Moscow stock market to remain closed for a 5th day. Its never going to open again is it?

[Shadowferal]

Between the nuclear plant and that convoy...have to wonder if this isn't deceptive. A big "LOOK AT ME!" ...*sneaks around*

[Jessicka]

Ah yes, armor is out of date. Yet all major players keep working on new and upgraded tanks.

T-84's? I suggest you research that model, first. The chance of it appearing in this war is basically zero. Unless Ukrainians drag the 1 or 2 prototypes out of storage.

Infantry with missile launchers is not going to be the future, unless you want them unprotected from artillery strikes and moving very slowly without mechanized vehicles aka armor, from APC's to MBT"s.

Yes they pursue new and upgraded such is the nature of pretty much everything, but they're of limited practical use. It's not about 'more and better', it's about 'better but way fewer'.

https://www.nationmaster.com/country...n-battle-tanks Take a look at that list, the only respectable developed countries with a ton of tanks are the US, South Korea and Germany.

I said infantry with missile launchers would be a weird future. More realistic is more armed drones, for which tanks in any setting are no match, and which Ukraine has made excellent use of.

[Grapemask]

Moscow stock market to remain closed for a 5th day. Its never going to open again is it?

Big brain stuff. The Russian stock market can't crash if it never opens!

[Easo]

Putler had another verbal vommit, this time about how more sanctions on Russia would be bad "for the situation".

President Putin has warned those opposing Russia's actions in Ukraine "not to exacerbate the situation" by imposing more restrictions on his country.

The Russian president was speaking at a government meeting broadcast on the state-controlled Rossiya 24 news channel.

"We have no ill intentions against our neighbours," Putin claims.

And he says his government sees "no need" for its neighbours to take further action that will "make our relations worse".

"I think everyone must think about how to normalise relations, co-operate normally and develop relations normally," he adds.

It comes as foreign ministers from across the West gather in Brussels to consider how to maintain pressure on Russia.

Putin also repeats his previous claim that all action taken by the Russian military so far has been made "exclusively in response to some unfriendly actions against the Russian Federation".

Between the nuclear plant and that convoy...have to wonder if this isn't deceptive. A big "LOOK AT ME!" ...*sneaks around*

The power station was literally the last place they hadn't taken on the southern shore there, it was encircled and that circle made smaller over the last ~3 days.
I don't think there is any deep plan there. They can't just leave random Ukrainian units in control of a small town in their rear.

Yes they pursue new and upgraded such is the nature of pretty much everything, but they're of limited practical use. It's not about 'more and better', it's about 'better but way fewer'.

https://www.nationmaster.com/country...n-battle-tanks Take a look at that list, the only respectable developed countries with a ton of tanks are the US, South Korea and Germany.

I said infantry with missile launchers would be a weird future. More realistic is more armed drones, for which tanks in any setting are no match, and which Ukraine has made excellent use of.

Respectable developed country? What kind of measure is that, especially - what do you mean by respectable in this regard? China's and Russia's tanks do not count? Or maybe Japan with it's Type-10's? Or France, who is working with Germany on the new generation (reminder, their current Leclercs are high-end product)?

[Grapemask]

Putler had another verbal vommit, this time about how more sanctions on Russia would be bad "for the situation".

Every single part of this quote is just a "I'm speechless" moment.

"We have no ill intentions against our neighbours," Putin claims.

And he says his government sees "no need" for its neighbours to take further action that will "make our relations worse".

"I think everyone must think about how to normalise relations, co-operate normally and develop relations normally," he adds.

[Mihalik]

Moscow stock market to remain closed for a 5th day. Its never going to open again is it?

I already said it. Probably no.

Capitalism is functionally over in Russia for the foreseeable future.

[Mazza]

"I think everyone must think about how to normalise relations, co-operate normally and develop relations normally,"

How do explain you don't understand irony without explaining you don't understand irony.

[Jessicka]

Respectable developed country? What kind of measure is that, especially - what do you mean by respectable in this regard? China's and Russia's tanks do not count? Or maybe Japan with it's Type-10's? Or France, who is working with Germany on the new generation (reminder, their current Leclercs are high-end product)?

I mean that Russia is selling tens of thousands of its relics to a lot of countries there, while it's "best" it keeps for itself are just upgraded relics.

Fewer than 1000 tanks is not what I'd call "a ton of tanks" when the top 3 have close to an order of magnitude more than that, especially in nations as populous as Japan, France, or even Poland - which is downsizing its own Tank legions in spite of its obvious geographical position of 'European Land War' ground zero. The UK runs 227 tanks that we freely admit suck and have little use for, but keep around almost out of nostalgia. It's an argument that comes up every few years here every time we decide to buy new drones and scrap tanks, the grey haired journalists get all upset.

[Flarelaine]

Respectable developed country? What kind of measure is that, especially - what do you mean by respectable in this regard? China's and Russia's tanks do not count?

I certainly do not find them respectable.

Reason:

Look at the news.

[jonnysensible]

Capitalism is functionally over in Russia for the foreseeable future.

It really isn't the bleakest form of capitalism is about to show itself for anyone living in Russia.

[Draco-Onis]

Middle path. I can see what looks like aid convoys in Kherson already (and internet is talking something about Melitopol too) https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images...2a6597b2e4.jpg , those are not army trucks. One could and should assume they did think about the need to support population beforehand and had made preparations.
Yes, Putler huylo, but they are not gonna starve anyone (unless, of course, they mismanage, let's hope they don't...).

Hope spring eternal, let's hope they handle the Ukrainians better than this invasion and we get more than just photo ops when it comes to feeding them.