Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Alakallanar]

It's almost as if you don't know about Ukrainization (which indeed is a recent trend) or how ex-Soviet countries tend to call it.
Habits die hard (call it legacy of the oppressors, if you wish) if nothing else. It is absolutely ridiculous to think there is any "Gotcha!" if someone uses Kiev.

Considering he previously claimed to be partially ukrainian and russian-speaking the Kiev alone is not what's causing suspicion. But he has been constantly blaming Ukraine (and occasionally the US or the EU) while defending Russia in various contexts up to and including marginalizing Stalins purge. Some examples:

And I am right in the middle of it. I know that 99% here are zombified with "Russia bad", but as everything in life, in is not that simple. We provoked them. Constantly. Dehumanized anyone who supported the "old regime" (even though it was elected by a simple majority of Ukrainians), and when some decided to fight for their freedom and against what they consider a violent, unconstitutional coup (rightfully so I might add), we came to their houses and bombed them for 8 years straight.

Just you wait, Lugansk city will raise untold millions of combatants, arm them with the latest and greatest, will storm the 100k of entrenched Ukrainian Army ranks, then overtake Kiev city... Any day now.
Again, the Ukrainian military was ordered to stand down by the President of Ukraine. The problem is, first, there are enough foreign actors that are beyond their control, and second and perhaps the most important of all - the 20000 whackos that chant "kill all Russians", have SS insignia on their uniform and raise SS and swastika flags. These groups do not want de-escalation.

There is so much BS in that text, I do not even know where to start... Just to set things straight, I am a Ukrainian, at least partially. My parents live here in Kiev, and I spend most of my time in Kiev as well because I work here. I am actually writing from Kiev right now. Now that my "expertise" and "interest" in the situation has been established lets get to the facts:
1. The situation is deteriorating. And it has nothing to do with the separatists. We have actual SS insignia wearing lunatics in control of much of the military. They really need this war, just like the Pentagon does, to justify their existence.Just this night, a water tower that supplied water to the unrecognized republics had been destroyed. When OSCE press tried to investigate what happened, they were shot at from the Ukrainian encampment, which just happened to be about 500m from the site. Damage was done from the Ukrainian side, that is easy to check. SO unless someone is trying to say that "separatists" set up 2 mobile artillery units right near Ukrainian trenches, there is only one explanation that comes to mind.

Something tells me that if shit hits the fan, Zelensky (Ukraine's current president), who dodged draft himself by the way, will be the same as the previous puppet Poroshenko and find himself cruising between Turkey, Poland and Israel, giving angry interviews to BBC and such about how unfair life is, and that he is forced to force these suicidal attacks.

(That one aged well.)

F. off. I lived in Ukraine most of my adult life. And I lived through 2012-14. Even though an idea of a separate state was marginal at the beginning, it all completely changed by the end of Maidan. People assaulted me because I spoke a different language on the streets of the capital. Even though half of Kiev speaks Russian to say the least. Funny thing, they could not speak clean Ukrainian as well, constantly mixing words from Polish or even English. Any opposition was silenced. Forcefully in many cases. Or straight up assassinated. Opposition and journalists like Oleg Buzina were either killed in broad daylight, or went into hiding/exile. By the end of 14' even the capital had enough people thinking about forming a separate state from the western Nazis.
...
I am tired of people glorifying mass murderers from the WW2 era. I am sickened that when going to work I pass 2 streets that changed their name to famous Ukrainian-Nazi commanders. I am horrified of the amount of propaganda and straight up lies that pour from what is left of our media. Lies that are so obvious, you can actually debunk them in real time just by walking on a street and seeing everything for yourself. Everything gets blamed on Russia. Our politicians kill each other - Russia's fault. Cars explode in the center of the city - Russia (even though the one who planted charges was an ultra right Azov soldier). Economy is in the gutter - Russia. Covid - Russia (must be spreading it somehow). FFS, even one's name can be a subject of criticism, because it is a Russian name and should be spelled differently around here. So anyone defending this shit, would you kindly f.off and deal with your own issues. Stop helping these maniacs from the so called Ukrainian government by either spreading misinformation, or twisting facts. At this point we would be much better off if the whole country simply joined Russia, at least to the extent Belarus did (economically). At the very least there would be less civilians dying in the eastern regions. And stop with the bullshit about Russian troops over there. There are as many (volunteer) Russian troops in the East of Ukraine, as there are German, English, US and others on the opposite side. One can only wish for Russian military to go in properly so that everything would be done quickly.

(Emphasis mine.)This one is especially curious because he claims to have lived in Ukraine. Past tense. That was 11/30/21. And starting in late February he claims to be in Kiev/Kyiv. So he moved back to a place that he describes as basically the Fourth Reich. A place of constant harassment for him due to his russian name/language.

A bit of a side step on my part.
I find Stalin's death count to be extremely exaggerated. Every time someone talks about it, they either can not state where they got that info from, or (very rarely) site a source from Khrushchev time period and post that, by people who actually benefited, financially or otherwise, from such myths. Case in point Solzhenitsyn memoirs that got published during late 1960s. He was writing them under the protection of Khrushchev, a person so closely resembling Boris Johnson in appearance as well as spirit, that I honestly would find it hard to distinguish between them if a blond wig would have been thrown into the equation. Both, Solzhenitsyn and Khrushchev, were extremely biased in their views towards Stalin. One for being sent to prison for 8 years for criticizing government and superior officers in writing (I should mention that at the time it was seen completely normal to jail even a civilian for being of a wrong national descent, let alone open criticism that could be interpreted as hostile propaganda. Japanese-Americans can confirm), during war time, while being in active military service. The other because he basically fought for power in the USSR after Stalin's death, had to destroy any opposition and rise above the rest of Stalin's subordinates (who he very much was, being a member of NKVD troikas, taking a very active role in purges in Ukraine during late 1930s as a head of Ukraine SSR. Basically, you can find his foot prints near every questionable position that was available at the time).
Works by Glantz and House paint a rather different picture compared to what is considered mainstream. And these two had direct access to Russian military archives and spent many years shuffling tons of paper there. IIRC it is these two managed to list every general in USSR Army, Navy and Airforce that were in service during 1930s and into WW2, to find that these famous military purges that allegedly decapitated USSR armed forces, ended in execution of 20 generals... out of 1200. And by the time the war started in 1941, around 90% of those convicted were reinstated in military forces. Total number of all military officers (Junior Lieutenant and up) that were removed from their posts ranged from 24000 to 28000, depending on a source. Out of about 240000 (having one officer for 6 non officer positions was bloated beyond all reason and many were demoted). Most arrests were for crimes not related to politics.

5. His repressions are very overblown. 90% of what is known about him in the West is similar to "Russia hacked US presidential elections of 2016". I mean yeah, it creates a nice narrative, a good bedtime story, but actual facts or archives in this case draw a completely different picture. I am sure you are not familiar with the idea of "destruction of cult of personality" introduced by Khrushchev in 1956. He had to create a good basis for himself as a USSR ruler and created a huge smear campaign for Stalin (who was already dead for 3 years). He even admitted that on several occasions in his memoirs, like how he had to exonerate several generals who were shot during first months of the German attack on the USSR. I can not remember the exact quote, but it was something along the lines of "would I have done the same? Definitely. But I had to do it because they were HIS responsibility."
In essence, the West wanted to smear Stalin because he represented a strong USSR. You need to put a monster in charge, wash the whole country with dirt to demote any positive interest, promote fear, or people may start getting ideas. McCarthy and all that nonsense. And this met a perfect match in Khrushchev's smear campaign from inside the USSR, him wanting to secure his seat of power. Right now, there are so many myths and fabrications around Stalin's figure (who was not a saint by any means), it is extremely hard to see past that.

He also was thinking the Navalny poisoning was more likely to have been done by UK, US or Ukraine (!), in order to hurt Russias standing in the world:

But prevention of German-Russian gas pipeline cooperation is a multi billion business opportunity for the US and US's condensed gas deliveries to Europe. 20-30 billion per year opportunity at the very least. Just an idea.
PS: it should not even be US or UK. Lets take Ukraine for example. They get about 1 billion for gas transit to Germany from Russia annually. Do not quote me on the amount though, I do not remember exactly. If the North and South Streams becomes operational, Russia would be able to stop that line completely and go around Ukraine. For the poorest country in Europe, 1 billion annual income (which is like 10% of their budget or some such) is a crucial thing. Do you think that a country torn by civil war would want to keep that income at all costs during these times?

I'll not post further quotes in order to keep this post somewhat short, but other instances include siding with Russia regarding the warning shots at a british vessel.

Trying to derail the thread about Belarus hijacking a plane with anti-ukraine stuff.

Defending the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. (While trying to derail an older threat on Russia threatening Ukraine.)

Talking about the Skripal poisoning (in the thread about the navalny poisoning) being an inside job by the UK to distract from failing UK-EU-negotiations as equally likely to Russia having done the poisoning.

Arguing against russian election interference.

So I can see how doubts about some of his claims may be warranted.

[Easo]

So I can see how doubts about some of his claims may be warranted.

Fair enough and honestly thanks for gathering all that in one place. One has to remember that not everyone will support the current government (I mean, just look at Donbas, with or without Russia intervening they had/have a lot of different opinions).

He is right about use of ambulances by soldiers and similar things, though. It's not like it is being hidden much, anyway.

[Yunru]

So Did you know that Putin hated this show?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puppets_(TV_series)

[Rasulis]

How China is helping Russia.

Chinese car makers, such as Great Wall Motor and Geely Auto, which occupy 7% of Russia's market, has stopped supplying new cars to dealers in Russia because of the exchange rate fluctuations.

So far, People's Bank of China is not letting Central Bank of Russia convert its yuan reserves into US dollars or euros.

Since Boeing and Airbus are no longer able to supply spare parts or provide maintenance support for Russian airlines, Russia has been looking for alternative sources. Earlier this month, Valery Kudinov, head of aircraft airworthiness at Russia's air transport agency, said that China has refused to send aircraft parts to Russia. Russia is now looking to source parts from Turkey and India.

Beijing-based Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank suspended all activities related to Russia and Belarus. Including 1.1 billion approved loan to improve Russia road and rail networks.

[Edge-]

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/03/...ne-going-lose/

And a US Rep. encouraging the US to abandon Ukraine because "they will lose".

Just a reminder of which political party seems kompromised by Russian kompromat.

[Huehuecoyotl]

He is right about use of ambulances by soldiers and similar things, though. It's not like it is being hidden much, anyway.

I'm sure you have a bunch of sources to back up claims like that. After all, we all know how much you hate it when people try to claim knowledge about things without proof.

[Azadina]

Moderately related, apparently Russians who don't want to be drafted are fleeing to Uzbekistan, Georgia, Armenia, Turkey and Finland.

Considering some of Russian excuses for invasions being "protecting it's citizens from genocide and harassment" (obviously made up nonsense, but still), I'd personally not want any flood of Russian refugees here.

[Belize]

Considering some of Russian excuses for invasions being "protecting it's citizens from genocide and harassment" (obviously made up nonsense, but still), I'd personally not want any flood of Russian refugees here.

That's the big brain move: make your citizens flee by making life unbearable, then invade the places they flee to under the pretext of protecting them in their new place of residence, then repeat ad nauseam

[Vulturia]

It's always funny to hear about people being "assaulted for speaking Russian" in Ukraine. Even NOW, during war, in western Ukraine (which has always been much more nationalistic) the worst we got was pieces of paper on tables in a restaurant strongly encouraging us to speak Ukrainian. And we actually do speak it more now. Because fuck Russia. How you can have any attitude other than "fuck Russia" while being Ukrainian these days - I don't know.
Maybe you could get "assaulted" by being an insufferable fucktard about speaking Russian? Like some of my dear family, who attacked waiters for speaking Ukrainian to him. I think if these "assault" claims are true, this is what they are about.
There definitely are Russian shills living in Kyiv. I should know, with most of my extended family being like that. There is certainly hope even the most USSR-loving might realise they actually supported an anti-human regime all this time.

[Strange One]

How China is helping Russia.

Chinese car makers, such as Great Wall Motor and Geely Auto, which occupy 7% of Russia's market, has stopped supplying new cars to dealers in Russia because of the exchange rate fluctuations.

So far, People's Bank of China is not letting Central Bank of Russia convert its yuan reserves into US dollars or euros.

Since Boeing and Airbus are no longer able to supply spare parts or provide maintenance support for Russian airlines, Russia has been looking for alternative sources. Earlier this month, Valery Kudinov, head of aircraft airworthiness at Russia's air transport agency, said that China has refused to send aircraft parts to Russia. Russia is now looking to source parts from Turkey and India.

Beijing-based Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank suspended all activities related to Russia and Belarus. Including 1.1 billion approved loan to improve Russia road and rail networks.

Can you link one statement from China saying the attack was unjust?

[Milchshake]

I hope Ukrainians learn the lessons Syrians had to against Russia fast.

• Never reveal the locations of shelters for women and children, field clinics or breadlines.
• Russia will target them first.
• Don’t reveal the locations to the UN.
• Russia will access them, and target them first.

[Slant]

Now that is some chestbeating if I have ever seen one. Funny, how 4th biggest economy in the world (IIRC, you are from Germany) could not spend 2% on the defense, while we in Baltics can. Go be proud somewhere else, please, or at least ensure your military is not given orders by people to whom G36 "melts".
I have donated too. So what? It doesn't make you or me special. And why the hell would I send money to "Russia"?

You're mixing up "could not" with "wanted not". The quality of your posts are not improving.

[Rasulis]

Can you link one statement from China saying the attack was unjust?

Nope. I don't expect them to ever do that.

In term of economic lifeline, it appears that India is a better partner to Russia than China. China is all lip service and no actions. India is actually buying crude and arms from Russia.

[Slant]

So Did you know that Putin hated this show?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puppets_(TV_series)

I would hate it too, it's not a particularily funny show.. :P

[Kaleredar]

How China is helping Russia.

Chinese car makers, such as Great Wall Motor and Geely Auto, which occupy 7% of Russia's market, has stopped supplying new cars to dealers in Russia because of the exchange rate fluctuations.

So far, People Bank of China is not letting Central Bank of Russia convert its yuan reserves into US dollars or euros.

Since Boeing and Airbus are no longer able to supply spare parts or provide maintenance support for Russian airlines, Russia has been looking for alternative sources. Earlier this month, Valery Kudinov, head of aircraft airworthiness at Russia's air transport agency, said that China has refused to send aircraft parts to Russia. Russia is now looking to source parts from Turkey and India.

Beijing-based Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank suspended all activities related to Russia and Belarus. Including 1.1 billion approved loan to improve Russia road and rail networks.

It would seem china has appraised Russia’s odds in this situation and found them wanting.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/03/...ne-going-lose/

And a US Rep. encouraging the US to abandon Ukraine because "they will lose".

Just a reminder of which political party seems kompromised by Russian kompromat.

Luckily, I don’t think this is playing very well.

Republicans capitalized on decades of mud slinging at Hillary Clinton in 2016. But US pop culture has been villainizing Russia for far longer than that, and does to this day. Hitman-related crime movie, who’s the bad guy? Odds are, some Russian gang. International espionage film? You can bet some Russian oligarch is doing bad things somewhere in there.

Except, of course, in this example, Russia, unlike Clinton, actually did something wrong of note. Like “invade a foreign sovereign nation.”


So I don’t think the GOP will get very far pushing this “Russia did nothing wrong/Russia isn’t so bad/lol at those stupid innocent Ukrainians getting bombed.” Biden has done a good job at setting the national tenor squarely against Russia, and the GOP isn’t coming together as a whole to push back on it.

[Cynep]

So, two interesting tidbits from the local Russian radio. First, those who call regular Russian people on the phone and claim that local medical supplies are running out, are fraudsters, all is well. ...I find it interesting that they aired this announcement on the radio...

Second, rumors about "purging the fifth column" aka Russians who disagree with the war, are exaggerated. It is expected that most people will come to their senses.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't need to convince anyone, it is an absolutely insane option, which would make new conflicts.

Well you're appealing to readers' emotions to think of the poor Russians who will suffer if RF follows the fate of USSR. That's why I replied to that.

So now it is about specifically Tochkas in Donetsk, instead of Tochkas in general/shelling of Donetsk in general? Or the fact that Ukraine did bomb cities?
Articles are "too fresh"?

Oh, and "anti-Ukraine" HRW? Pro-Russian shills? Let me guess - OSCE calling out things like tortures are probably "anti-Ukraine" as well.

And yes, it is (well, was, due to recent events) civil war - majority of fighters are locals. Just because Russia supported them does not make it less of a civil war.

Ukraine did shell cities in 2014 - just not my city of Donetsk, because Akhmetov. For some reason you can't live with this fact from 8 years ago.

I was taught to separate information and emotions if you didn't understand me the first time. HRW despite the tone gave information confirming my previous posts both in this and 2014 thread: southwest fringes and airport. Search my post history.
And as I said, the shill whom you linked, had a number of articles posted in WaPo, and they were overwhelmingly anti-USA and pro-Russia. One of those their Trumpists maybe? I don't care.

Locals were recruited, organized and paid by Russians who were already here and created this. It started as a Russian invasion and gradually locals became prevalent in rank-and-file positions, leadership was always under Kremlin. Compare this to Yugoslavia or Abkhazia - those were true civil wars and not invasions with locals as a front.

[Strange One]

Nope. I don't expect them to ever do that.

In term of economic lifeline, it appears that India is a better partner to Russia than China. China is all lip service and no actions. India is actually buying crude and arms from Russia.

Interesting, i'll be keeping an eye India's response more now.

[downnola]

Oh my bad I forgot this place is mostly americans and other westoids that just like to watch genocide in 4k with some popcorn like its Netflix since they are so sheltered from the effects of those conflicts.

This you?

Open the borders!!!! Its 2016 again and sjws haven't got a glimpse into the future yet.

Yeah, you seem like a fella who is real concerned with war crimes, genocide, and conflicts on continents other than your own.

[s_bushido]

It's always funny to hear about people being "assaulted for speaking Russian" in Ukraine.

Honestly, without knowing a shred about Ukrainian culture, I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if that was legitimately happening. Humans are stupid, and we love finding reasons to display that stupidity. Just like idiots in America attacking Asian people when the coronavirus first kicked off because "it came from China!!!".

[Easo]

Heyyy, remember that Polish soldier who defected to Belarus during the migrant crisis and was telling fascinating crap about "hundreds of shot migrants"?
He has hanged himself in Minsk.

I'm sure you have a bunch of sources to back up claims like that. After all, we all know how much you hate it when people try to claim knowledge about things without proof.

Really? You do realize that makes you show that you are not following this war very well?

Deliveries of weapons by civilian cars (additionally shows what is happening with Ukrainian logistics)
https://t.me/karaulny/364209
https://ve.lt/sites/default/files/in...530291364n.jpg

Quite widespread photo from the first days, IIRC Kharkiv, as the Territorial Defence Forces were gathering in schools and other buildings with large halls
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FM2i_LVW...jpg&name=large
Another case in the building of Kharkiv Regional Administration
https://t.me/boris_rozhin/25514
It was later destroyed by missiles, if you remember. Should be obvious as to why.

Soldiers sleeping in kindergarden
https://t.me/OpenUkraine/9335

Artillery positions amongst residential buildings
https://imgur.com/a/M9pgA66

Armor on the streets in Odessa
https://culturemeter.od.ua/primorski...ankami-132639/

BTR-3E doing naughty stuff
https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/mast...7_original.jpg

Everything here actually a common thing to happen in a war, everyone will do it and everyone will blame the opposite side. Such is war.

P.S.
Biggest issue is that most of these will come only from local Ukrainian posts (usually Telegram) and pro-Russian ones. Western media is not really into this.

You're mixing up "could not" with "wanted not". The quality of your posts are not improving.

At least you are not talking anymore about "sending money to Russia".