Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Reeve]

This is very misleading. General in Russian army is not the same as General in a European or US army. A General in Russia typically commands around 3000 men, sometimes a little more or a little less (as few as 500). Closest alternative would be the Colonel rank (3000-5000 typically), or Lieutenant-Colonel. If I remember correctly, there are around 700 Generals in the Russian army right now. Basically, lower ranked Generals, just like Colonels or Lieutenant-Colonels in the US or Europe, are expected to take part in combat missions. US for example lost 4 Colonels in a single bombing attack in Kabul, Afghanistan in 2010, if I remember correctly.

A quick googling says a Russian Major General is equivalent to an American Brigadier General (1 star general), which typically commands 4000-6000 troops. While that’s not exactly a 30,000 troop commander, it’s still a very significant officer.

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I dunno man, every time Shalcker is back from vaycay, this entire thread ceases to exist with this constant back and forth. Even mods participate. If his intentions are to nuke any discussion then he does an admirable work.

Seems to me that half the reason people keep coming back to this thread is for the enjoyment of dunking on Shalcker. If he/she weren’t here, it’s mostly be people just agreeing that the war is terrible and Putin should delete his account.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I hope nato doesn't focus on China afterwards, I don't want to lose my chinese suppliers too.

Then you better hope China doesn't decide to invade its neighbours

[Reeve]

how is Chinese civil war "invasion"? Taiwan is officially part of PRC. How do you treat Chinese civil war as "invasion"? Do you mean Mao tsetung and CCP are the "invader" because they defeated KMT in the Chinese Civil War? (And Chinese Civil War is technically still ongoing.)

Or do you mean Abraham Lincoln was the "invader"?

If the Confederacy had successfully self governed for 80 years in peace and a United States President tried to retake that territory they would indeed be an invader.

[jonnysensible]

Seems to me that half the reason people keep coming back to this thread is for the enjoyment of dunking on Shalcker. If he/she weren’t here, it’s mostly be people just agreeing that the war is terrible and Putin should delete his account.

yea the only good thing about this forum is getting shackler or pc2 or something stuck in insane loops and watching them take dumber and dumber positions on things.

[Corvus]

Chinese oil and gas company cancels 500 million dollar investment in Russia.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkrainianCo...m_source=share

All due to a board member being sanctioned. Who was saying sanctions don't work and how is that 'alliance' working out?

[Kaleredar]

Chinese oil and gas company cancels 500 million dollar investment in Russia.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkrainianCo...m_source=share

All due to a board member being sanctioned. Who was saying sanctions don't work and how is that 'alliance' working out?

I think perhaps some people wanted to believe that Russia had some sort of "friend" in this situation they stared, believing that China would join them in their "defiance of the west."

Not realizing, of course, that China is only interested in China, and certainly not in getting their asses sanctioned by the rest of the world over Russia's little expansionist fantasy.

Russia doesn't have a friend in the world on this. Putin immediately lost the messaging war, and no army of trolls will be able to overcome that. The useful idiots (like Trump) that he propped up in other countries aren't in the position to twist the narrative for him there in any meaningful way.

[Mihalik]

sip.

This is the one bit that endlessly confuses me.

I get it, Vlad is delusional, but just how delusional do you need to be to think China will come to your aid?

Like, was China going to sit out the sanctions? Sure.
Was China going to risk it's trade with the West while dealing with another Covid outbreak, distruption to supply chains and house market collapse? I mean fuck no.

[Logwyn]

How many times did Russia have to invade its own 'allies' during the Cold War to keep them from leaving the USSR/Warsaw Pact?

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The US really ought to be joining in with a Berlin airlift sort of deal where we fly in food, medicine and other critical humanitarian supplies to besieged cities and try to get wounded civvies out, too.

Twice '56 Hungry and '68 Czechslovakia!

I think there is too much danger of an airlift being shot down due to "that's not food! Its weapons!".

[Rasulis]

Chinese oil and gas company cancels 500 million dollar investment in Russia.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkrainianCo...m_source=share

All due to a board member being sanctioned. Who was saying sanctions don't work and how is that 'alliance' working out?

I kept telling people. No Chinese companies and financial institutions will risk a secondary sanction for helping Russia.

[ruwshtyb]

If the Confederacy had successfully self governed for 80 years in peace and a United States President tried to retake that territory they would indeed be an invader.

Oh yeah. China doomed into civil wars for many times in the history every 300 hundred years. So it invades itself every 300 hundred years lol.

[Kallisto]

This is the one bit that endlessly confuses me.

I get it, Vlad is delusional, but just how delusional do you need to be to think China will come to your aid?

Like, was China going to sit out the sanctions? Sure.
Was China going to risk it's trade with the West while dealing with another Covid outbreak, distruption to supply chains and house market collapse? I mean fuck no.

Likely ever since Covid he fully insulated himself from the world and relied on his inner circle to tell him what's been happening. The thing is his inner circle are too afraid to tell him the truth so for all he knows Ukraine really is about to fall, China really is a friend that's going to help him.

[Draco-Onis]

What an ignorant statement; the only entity responsible for "oh, no, my Russian suppliers!" is Russia. NATO's focus is only ever on the defense of its members.

That's inaccurate NATO has intervened for non NATO countries with and without the UN giving their blessings, also the United States and China are on a inevitable collision course. They are ideologically different and the US doesn't have the best track record when it comes to co-existing with possible competition, we spend almost 1 trillion dollars a year on "defense" have to find someone to point those guns at.

[Dontrike]

I didn't ever make such claim; though i probably would if i wasn't banned at the time.

Confirmation bias is very strong thing.

Still, even if "shock and awe" fails eventually fundamentals will win.

You did with "everything is going to plan" and the initial plan was to win in just a few days. If I gave you a quarter, which has to be like 4 hours of pay for you now with the ruble so low, will you post what I tell you to say like you normally do at your "job"?

[PhaelixWW]

also the United States and China are on a inevitable collision course. They are ideologically different and the US doesn't have the best track record when it comes to co-existing with possible competition, we spend almost 1 trillion dollars a year on "defense" have to find someone to point those guns at.

When's the last time the US has used its military against "possible competition"?

[ruwshtyb]

When's the last time the US has used its military against "possible competition"?

When's the last time China has used its military?

[PhaelixWW]

When's the last time China has used its military?

What does China have to do with the Russian invasion of Ukraine and the war crimes committed by Putin's regime?

Let's get back on topic, shall we?

[Zaydin]

What does China have to do with the Russian invasion of Ukraine and the war crimes committed by Putin's regime?

Let's get back on topic, shall we?

I still don't get why people are replying to someone who is rather blatantly one of Putins paid trolls.

[Shalcker]

I think perhaps some people wanted to believe that Russia had some sort of "friend" in this situation they stared, believing that China would join them in their "defiance of the west."

Not realizing, of course, that China is only interested in China, and certainly not in getting their asses sanctioned by the rest of the world over Russia's little expansionist fantasy.

If you look at Chinese media they do join "in defiance of the west".

And they do have other interests then "getting sanctioned" - they already were sanctioned by West before, and US just added more sanctions on Chinese officials.

Russia doesn't have a friend in the world on this. Putin immediately lost the messaging war, and no army of trolls will be able to overcome that. The useful idiots (like Trump) that he propped up in other countries aren't in the position to twist the narrative for him there in any meaningful way.

Russian strategy isn't based on "friendship", it is based on common strategic interests.

Western strategy also isn't based on friendship - there are plenty of disagreements.

[Kaleredar]

If you look at Chinese media they do join "in defiance of the west".

And they do have other interests then "getting sanctioned" - they already were sanctioned by West before, and US just added more sanctions on Chinese officials.

And yet they ain't lifting a damn finger to help Russia in any way.

Again, because they're in it for themselves. They were initially tentative on what line to tow on Ukraine, but they seem to have judged Russia's little venture and found it wanting. So they've stepped back from it entirely.

Russian strategy isn't based on "friendship", it is based on common strategic interests.

...ones apparently not shared by anyone else on the planet.

Western strategy also isn't based on friendship - there are plenty of disagreements.

And yet were Russia to get too big for its britches and strike any member of NATO they'd all immediately descend upon Russia like a pack of eagles, and China would still see fit to sit and watch Russia be dealt its fate. Moreover, the EU, which in the short term WILL be hurt by the sanctions, still banded together with the US in opposing Russia, and have fast tracked removing their necessity on utilizing Russian energy sources. Which will inconvenience them in the short term. But perhaps they can see the benefits of not being reliant upon a despotic state with its finger on the "invade" button.

Putin was hoping that Ukraine, and the rest of the world, would seek "appeasement" to temporarily stave off Russia's aggression as opposed to inconveniencing themselves with sanctions and support. But maybe because they remember the last time a megalomaniac was allowed to gallivant as he pleased across Europe it turned into World War 2, that plan of Putin's fell flat. So they're taking a far more proactive approach than in the 1930s.

[Dontrike]

Russian strategy isn't based on "friendship", it is based on common strategic interests.

Didn't know being the 3rd best in a war out of 2 countries was a common strategic interest.