1. #14821
    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    So 2027-2032. Well, we will see, then. I would ask how they will deal with the insane corruption, first, it's not gonna magically go, it's systematic.
    Sure. And that's one of the criteria. If they decide to be like Turkey, it might as well last forever.

    But since I'm not influenced by Russian propaganda habitually, I reckon Ukraine will have two choices: 1. Follow the path of corruption, and basically be like Russia... or 2. Reset, reevaluate and comply with the requirements to join the EU. See, the thing about corruption is... you can get rid of systemic corruption with systemic tools. And the EU happens to be fucking full of countries that know how to limit corruption to a tolerable minimum. Is the West completely pure of corruption? Nah. Nobody is. It's impossible.

    But the question you need to answer to yourself is... why are you still pushing the Russian propaganda? Aren't you ashamed of yourself?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    Would this be counted as the first "official" Chernobyl-disaster-caused death in 35 years and roll the death toll from 31 to 32, I wonder?
    Absolutely, it is directly consequential, regardless of how much time has passed or how stupid it is. If Chernobyl hadn't happened, those dudes would still be fine.
    Users with <20 posts and ignored shitposters are automatically invisible. Find out how to do that here and help clean up MMO-OT!
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  2. #14822
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Why would a Russian soldier desert, then hitchhike home? I'd assume they'd be immediately arrested.
    Might be playing the numbers.
    If enough people say "Aite, I'm out." it becomes a logistical nightmare tracking them down and shit.
    If there is a regime change, given the incompetence coming out of Moscow about this war/not a war, they'll have enough shit to deal with that these guys are small turnips.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    Quit using other posters as levels of crazy. That is not ok


    If you look, you can see the straw man walking a red herring up a slippery slope coming to join this conversation.

  3. #14823
    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    You still keep believing that Russian soldiers got radiation poisoning? Jesus christ...
    It's the first time I've seen it reported. What is the reason that I should not believe it?

  4. #14824
    Speaking about propaganda... Russian news is saying that Latvia is seeing stopping of gas deliveries.
    But... We are not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    Sure. And that's one of the criteria. If they decide to be like Turkey, it might as well last forever.

    But since I'm not influenced by Russian propaganda habitually, I reckon Ukraine will have two choices: 1. Follow the path of corruption, and basically be like Russia... or 2. Reset, reevaluate and comply with the requirements to join the EU. See, the thing about corruption is... you can get rid of systemic corruption with systemic tools. And the EU happens to be fucking full of countries that know how to limit corruption to a tolerable minimum. Is the West completely pure of corruption? Nah. Nobody is. It's impossible.

    But the question you need to answer to yourself is... why are you still pushing the Russian propaganda? Aren't you ashamed of yourself?
    No, it is your incapability to accept any criticism and the kneejerk reaction to anything that might show Ukraine in negative light - because it is so much easier to not think and just go with the flow of memes and open stereotypical propaganda towards Russia (your example - talking about Russian equipment being crap but not even knowing specific models - which leads to only obvious conclusion that you think Russian equipment is crap by default because it is Russian). Let's not pretend that this thread is not an echo chamber which cannot stand any dissent.
    Ukraine has and will have so much more common with Russia than West, despite their recent attempts of denying it. Fight with corruption will be long and hard, more than it was anywhere else. And I am not sure Turkey can be compared, they have... a bit different kind of issue (that whole situation is a charade both sides can't admit and have spine to stop).

    I do not care for bullshit like Snake Island, sinking ship with MLRS, Ghost of Kiev, radiation poisoning and other funny stories.

    Quote Originally Posted by DarkAmbient View Post
    It's the first time I've seen it reported. What is the reason that I should not believe it?
    Read news for like the last 2-3 days.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  5. #14825
    Russian Troops Suffer ‘Acute Radiation Sickness’ After Digging Chernobyl Trenches

    Several hundred Russian soldiers were forced to hastily withdraw from the Chernobyl nuclear power plant in Ukraine after suffering “acute radiation sickness” from contaminated soil, according to Ukrainian officials.

    The troops, who dug trenches in a contaminated Red Forest near the site of the worst nuclear disaster in history, are now reportedly being treated in a special medical facility in Gomel, Belarus. The forest is so named because thousands of pine trees turned red during the 1986 nuclear disaster. The area is considered so highly toxic that not even highly specialized Chernobyl workers are allowed to enter the zone.

    Local reports suggest that seven buses with the zapped troops arrived in Gomel early Thursday. Journalists on the ground have also reported “ghost buses” of dead soldiers being transported from Belarus to Russia under the cover of dark.

  6. #14826
    Herald of the Titans Vorkreist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    You still keep believing that Russian soldiers got radiation poisoning? Jesus christ...
    You seem to have the same Cernobyl history knowledge as those idiots that camped on radioactive soil.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-ne...ing-chernobyl/

    Oh look one of them died already. The others might not live a lot either depending on exposure levels.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Read news for like the last 2-3 days.
    Where are you getting your news from ?

  7. #14827
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    I did not really invest any or my time in that Chernobyl story, but for certain digging up the soil there is not the best of the ideas. I would not be surprised if they did it, they'd get quite a bit of the shit that went out in 86 on them with all the subsequent outcomes.

  8. #14828
    Continuing the yesterdays discussion about Western fighter jets:

    Regardless of the outlandish claims that some are putting forward, including the Ukrainian Air Force itself, this process will take many months or even, in some cases, years to complete. There is no getting around that reality.
    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-pilots-on-now

    Whatever choice would be made now would unlikely to have any impact in this war. Old Soviet planes are the only reasonable option still and those are not going to be delivered, as per whole "MiG deal" debacle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vorkreist View Post
    You seem to have the same Cernobyl history knowledge as those idiots that camped on radioactive soil.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-ne...ing-chernobyl/

    Oh look one of them died already. The others might not live a lot either depending on exposure levels.


    Where are you getting your news from ?
    Because actual experts in that field are saying that it is unlikely to be the case? Names are Cheryl Rofer and Edwin Lyman, first one had a long explanation in her Twitter, which I linked before, second one finds it unlikely.
    What is the source for that claim? Let me guess, someone in Ukraine...?


    I don't know, news??

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    I did not really invest any or my time in that Chernobyl story, but for certain digging up the soil there is not the best of the ideas. I would not be surprised if they did it, they'd get quite a bit of the shit that went out in 86 on them with all the subsequent outcomes.
    Digging up the soil is only point where we could even believe this a bit (since radiation tends to be "stored" in it), but there is no proof of any kind they did dig up trenches. Fuck, they did not do that south near Kiev where actual fighting took place, why would they do that at Chernobyl, which was lost at the very start and never under attacks by Ukrainians?
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  9. #14829
    Herald of the Titans Vorkreist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Ukraine has and will have so much more common with Russia than West, despite their recent attempts of denying it.
    You're so clueless its silly.
    You should spend some time learning about Ukraine's history to realize how much ukrainians hate Russia and why. A more productive and helpful thing than sniffing russian propaganda and posting here misinformation that gets exposed so easily.

  10. #14830
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    I did not really invest any or my time in that Chernobyl story, but for certain digging up the soil there is not the best of the ideas. I would not be surprised if they did it, they'd get quite a bit of the shit that went out in 86 on them with all the subsequent outcomes.
    Reactor #4 at Chernobyl is still extremely radioactive after 30 years. The Red Forest is supposedly the second most irradiated site in the Exclusion Zone aside from the plant itself after all these years and the idiots digging trenches there would be releasing 30 years worth of radioactive material into the air as they dug. Sure, not all of the material would be as radioactive as when it first settled but prolonged exposure still gave the morons ARS.

    It speaks volumes as to how little Putler cares about his troops that they were deployed to one of the most irradiated sites on Earth without even the bare minimum of protective gear or training for a power plant that doesn't even provide power anymore.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Ukraine has and will have so much more common with Russia than West, despite their recent attempts of denying it.
    Vladof Putler has driven a permanent wedge for the foreseeable future between Ukraine and Russia with his failed attempt at conquering Ukraine. Ukraine is not going to forgive Russia for this for a long, long time.
    "If you are ever asking yourself 'Is Trump lying or is he stupid?', the answer is most likely C: All of the Above" - Seth Meyers

  11. #14831
    The Unstoppable Force Bakis's Avatar
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    Another day gone by without Putler using chemical agents is a good day I guess..
    But soon after Mr Xi secured a third term, Apple released a new version of the feature in China, limiting its scope. Now Chinese users of iPhones and other Apple devices are restricted to a 10-minute window when receiving files from people who are not listed as a contact. After 10 minutes, users can only receive files from contacts.
    Apple did not explain why the update was first introduced in China, but over the years, the tech giant has been criticised for appeasing Beijing.

  12. #14832
    Herald of the Titans Vorkreist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Continuing the yesterdays discussion about Western fighter jets:



    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-pilots-on-now

    Whatever choice would be made now would unlikely to have any impact in this war. Old Soviet planes are the only reasonable option still and those are not going to be delivered, as per whole "MiG deal" debacle.



    Because actual experts in that field are saying that it is unlikely to be the case? Names are Cheryl Rofer and Edwin Lyman, first one had a long explanation in her Twitter, which I linked before, second one finds it unlikely.
    What is the source for that claim? Let me guess, someone in Ukraine...?


    I don't know, news??

    "Based on actual experts" from some obscure twitter bullshit.

    There are plenty of articles reporting this. Some are testimonies from workers in the area that interacted with that group of soldiers. Scurry back to the russian bullshit factory to check what the other version of facts and events is and maybe they have a better source than random twitter.

  13. #14833
    Quote Originally Posted by Vorkreist View Post
    You're so clueless its silly.
    You should spend some time learning about Ukraine's history to realize how much ukrainians hate Russia and why. A more productive and helpful thing than sniffing russian propaganda and posting here misinformation that gets exposed so easily.
    Yes yes, they hated each other so very much until Maidan. Wait, they did not, outside of some marginals. You are very close to the Kremlin/Russian nationalist propaganda. Very close.
    That is why Odessa while Ukrainian is speaking Russian, that is why almost everyone in Ukraine knows Russian, that's why there are millions of mixed families in both countries, that's why both countries worked together on number of projects until, again, events of 2014.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydin View Post
    Vladof Putler has driven a permanent wedge for the foreseeable future between Ukraine and Russia with his failed attempt at conquering Ukraine. Ukraine is not going to forgive Russia for this for a long, long time.
    And now this is something I can finally absolutely agree with. Generational hatred or two is guaranteed.
    (they will keep speaking Russian regardless, though)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bakis View Post
    Another day gone by without Putler using chemical agents is a good day I guess..
    Speaking about this - there was a news post that USA is sending some protection material to Ukraine...

    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ns-2022-04-01/

    Quote Originally Posted by Vorkreist View Post
    "Based on actual experts" from some obscure twitter bullshit.

    There are plenty of articles reporting this. Some are testimonies from workers in the area that interacted with that group of soldiers. Scurry back to the russian bullshit factory to check what the other version of facts and events is and maybe they have a better source than random twitter.
    Ok, I guess someone with 30 year experience does not count. The guy finding it "unlikely" was reported on Guardian.
    Believe the fairy tales if you want.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  14. #14834
    The Unstoppable Force Bakis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Digging up the soil is only point where we could even believe this a bit (since radiation tends to be "stored" in it), but there is no proof of any kind they did dig up trenches. Fuck, they did not do that south near Kiev where actual fighting took place, why would they do that at Chernobyl, which was lost at the very start and never under attacks by Ukrainians?
    "Stored in it" is why all nuclear reactors have the core encapsulated by a cardboard cover. After all it's stored and doesn't radiate.
    It's enough that you stay in the area for a prolonged time, hell its even enough you drive in a convoy as the first verhicle will kick up dust.
    If you stay in the zone for just a few days you will start to suffer serious issues.

    What itch me most about the whole thing, given a Belarus official seem to confirmed them accepting patients for that treatment, is that it happens now and Russia had a presence there for weeks by now.
    Which can only be concluded as Russia sent in troops with monitoring meassures and safety precautions in place and later rotated in troops that had none of that or even told nor had knowledge of the historic meltdown.
    That would be fucked up even for the master race Putler and high command to order. Then again, a bunch of war criminals that value an illusion of some kinda of Grand Russian Empire more than its own population probably have no moral issues regarding anything.
    But soon after Mr Xi secured a third term, Apple released a new version of the feature in China, limiting its scope. Now Chinese users of iPhones and other Apple devices are restricted to a 10-minute window when receiving files from people who are not listed as a contact. After 10 minutes, users can only receive files from contacts.
    Apple did not explain why the update was first introduced in China, but over the years, the tech giant has been criticised for appeasing Beijing.

  15. #14835
    The Unstoppable Force Gaidax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vorkreist View Post
    You're so clueless its silly.
    You should spend some time learning about Ukraine's history to realize how much ukrainians hate Russia and why. A more productive and helpful thing than sniffing russian propaganda and posting here misinformation that gets exposed so easily.
    I love people who are not from there think they have a bloody clue about anything.

    Get this, boy, I was born in what's now Ukraine and lived there for a good chunk of my life. Denying there is a common ground, both historically and culturally between Russia and Ukraine is like being a frikkin' flat-earther denying the obvious.

    You say "history", but the history is that Ukraine was part of Russian Empire one way or another for hundreds of years with all the mutual mixing up that was going on while at it. Ukraine has its historical national heroes, literature classics and is unique in many ways, just like every ex-Soviet republic has. But at the same time, it is still an ex-Soviet republic with all the ties, bells, whistles and mutual history/heritage - a fact that is not just going to disappear all that soon.

    Ukraine as is now is on a path to discover and manifest its national identity, a path undertaking for a few decades now and it's not just some on/off switch there, it's a process. And this war, by the way, is a part of this process.

  16. #14836
    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Read news for like the last 2-3 days.
    Can you give me the tl;dr as to why I should disbelieve reports of Russian soldiers suffering radiation sickness? Reading three days' worth of news is a tall order at the moment...

    Edit: checking out info posted above
    Last edited by DarkAmbient; 2022-04-01 at 10:10 PM.

  17. #14837
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    A bit of american propaganda:


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_.../Radio_Liberty

    Gas stations are harder to destroy that is usualy shows in movies.
    Don't sweat the details!!!

  18. #14838
    UK MoD latest report says the loss of fuel and ammo in the Belgorod attacks will further stretch Russia's logistics problems, especially around the Kharkiv axis.

    There is video of long queues at petrol stations in Belgorod in response. Might be panic buying.

  19. #14839
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    UK MoD latest report says the loss of fuel and ammo in the Belgorod attacks will further stretch Russia's logistics problems, especially around the Kharkiv axis.

    There is video of long queues at petrol stations in Belgorod in response. Might be panic buying.
    Definitely panic buying.
    "If you are ever asking yourself 'Is Trump lying or is he stupid?', the answer is most likely C: All of the Above" - Seth Meyers

  20. #14840
    Merely a Setback Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    UK MoD latest report says the loss of fuel and ammo in the Belgorod attacks will further stretch Russia's logistics problems, especially around the Kharkiv axis.

    There is video of long queues at petrol stations in Belgorod in response. Might be panic buying.
    As I've said, I assume the whole notion of "oh shit, those people we're beating up that we thought were harmless are actually fighting back? They aren't supposed to do that!" is probably causing a fair bit of consternation in Russia proper.
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

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