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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Welcome to the fight for workers rights since forever, it's always been this way. And like...David beat Goliath in the story : 3
    Yeah but they weren't asking the Phillistines to come and rule them, while fighting for better-than slavery standards.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  2. #22
    Over 9000! Kathranis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    The point of the funds is offset lost wages from striking, so donating to a nonprofit won't accomplish that. There may be a better way to handle it (I'm not super familiar with GFM), but someone has to organize it and she's been one of the leaders of the workers protests and push to remove Kotick, even if she's no longer with the company.

    Considering the A Better ABK workers collective is promoting this on their social channels, I don't see a reason to view this as shady. If they weren't involved with this or there were questions about what would be done with the money I doubt they'd be promoting it - https://twitter.com/ABetterABK/statu...43518248980486
    Looking into it, seems like GFM seems to have a record of being used to collect strike funds. I guess if this is who they want organizing it, it's alright, then. Just that it's obviously already causing people to question the authenticity.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Can't help but say this David vs Goliath shit ain't gonna work out well for those employees.

    You work to take down the big guy, not challenge them into ruling you nicely.
    Unions had a pretty good track record until Ronald Reagan started breaking them up, and they're still highly effective in a lot of industries and other countries.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    Unions had a pretty good track record until Ronald Reagan started breaking them up, and they're still highly effective in a lot of industries and other countries.
    Agreed.

    And this isn't exactly unionizing at all...

    It's donations for a self-imposed strike. That's really gonna end up going nowhere...
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  4. #24
    The Insane Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Agreed.

    And this isn't exactly unionizing at all...

    It's donations for a self-imposed strike. That's really gonna end up going nowhere...
    looks like they are going for a full union. https://twitter.com/valentine_irl/st...02466926608386

    Ok so its been made public that we have give people at ABK union authorization cards. I want to take a second to outline what that means and why we took this step.

    First, we should be clear about some of the history of game worker unionization. A lot of the games industry IS actually unionized. Our French office that was closed down this year was fully unionized, and gaming companies in Europe tend to be unionized.

    However, that's not the case everywhere. In the US we have the right to unionize under the US National Labor Relations Board. Its been rare to see US companies take this step for a number of reasons.

    Generally most game companies have done a good enough job working with employees to include their voices that workers haven't felt the need to unionize.

    Unionization across ABK would require a number of things to happen. The first is that we need buy in from our fellow employees. We do that through the use of Union Authorization Cards, these cards are a secure way for employees to express that they would like to unionize.

    After that, if we have enough support across any given business unit (say for example, US Blizzard employees or Canadian Activision employees), then we can work with that country's union authority to call for a vote of that group of employees.

    If more than half of those folks vote to approve a union, then one is created, and that group begins contract negotiations with its leadership. Contract negotiations can take a while, but most countries offer something called Status Quo Bargaining Rights.

    These rights say that while the contract is being negotiated, leadership cannot make bad faith decisions that can result in coercive bargaining or retaliation against employees. These rights are different per country, but basically attempt to assure negotiations are fairly done.

    We would also be electing union leaders from among the workers in the business unit to help assure that employee's needs are heard and advocated for.

    One thing that a lot of US unions have in common is that they work with a national union group who's sole purpose is to help workers form their own unions. When we seriously started considering unionization months ago, we reached out to several.

    We have partnered over the last few months with CODE-CWA, a national organization that helped the Google workers to organize. They have been amazing, offering us free legal advice, support for how to effectively organize, etc.

    And for our US workers, CODE-CWA is working to help any of them who wish to unionize to do so. We are also working with partner organizations in other countries as well, to support unionization for anyone who wants to there as well.

    There is still a long way to go, but we want to support our coworkers across ABK to finally have a real voice in how our companies are run, because for the past months and years, we have seen our leadership continue to ignore the needs of its employees.

    Thousands of ABK employees have put their careers and safety on the line for years trying to make our companies better, safer places to work. We have exhausted as many avenues as we could before looking to unionization.

    If you want to help, please consider donating to our strike fund. When employees strike they are not allowed to take sick time or PTO when doing so, and while certain parts of ABK have offered to pay people who are striking, not all companies have. And those who have wont forever

    This money will go to make sure that those people who are striking for A Better ABK are able to do so without sacrificing their livelihood. A common tactic for leadership is to wait out strikes, because they know most workers are living paycheck to paycheck.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    It's donations for a self-imposed strike. That's really gonna end up going nowhere...
    The donations? Or the strike? Because like, they're handing out union auth cards for folks to sign. That's a big step.

  6. #26
    The Unstoppable Force Puupi's Avatar
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    They have raised 100k on a GoFundMe for this? How fucking stupid are people? I thought BelleDelphine's bath water was the stupidest thing ever, but this one takes the cake.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i've said i'd like to have one of those bad dragon dildos shaped like a horse, because the shape is nicer than human.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i was talking about horse cock again, told him to look at your sig.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Considering she already announced that she's got a job lined up outside of gaming, not really - https://twitter.com/BlizzJess/status...14592189849613

    It's weird how much everyone seems to hate her? Is it just because of her annoying creeps into outing themselves because internal Blizzard HR has been shown to be completely useless?

    I swear, nobody is allowed to do anything without apparently having some secret, dishonest, nefarious motive or something.
    I didn't say anything about her other than the fact she's only doing this after already leaving. It seems odd to say you are leaving because you ain't winning the fight or what ever and now that other people are striking that you would set this up.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    They have raised 100k on a GoFundMe for this? How fucking stupid are people? I thought BelleDelphine's bath water was the stupidest thing ever, but this one takes the cake.
    To cover the lost wages from the walkouts that Activision/Blizzard will not pay employees for, yes. How is this stupid? It's showing solidarity with the workers that are putting their jobs at risk to fight for better working conditions for themselves and their colleagues. This way you can directly support them without supporting ATVI's bottom line in the process.

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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    I didn't say anything about her other than the fact she's only doing this after already leaving. It seems odd to say you are leaving because you ain't winning the fight or what ever and now that other people are striking that you would set this up.
    "seems like she realize she couldn't get a new job that quickly" - which implies that she'd be taking the funds and using them herself, and that she didn't already have a job lined up.

    She made it clear her departure wasn't just because of that, but also because of the better pay/conditions elsewhere. That doesn't mean she doesn't still care about the folks she worked with for years and isn't going to continue supporting them however she can.

    There's literally nothing odd, shady, or weird about this. Only what shadows you conjure up in your head.

  9. #29
    The Unstoppable Force Puupi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    To cover the lost wages from the walkouts that Activision/Blizzard will not pay employees for, yes. How is this stupid? It's showing solidarity with the workers that are putting their jobs at risk to fight for better working conditions for themselves and their colleagues. This way you can directly support them without supporting ATVI's bottom line in the process.
    You have to be incredibly naive to believe that any of this will work and furthermore, the most important part, is the whole logic of paying the salaries of the employees of the company you hate so much.

    You, as a customer, want to pay them so they can work again for the company you hate, which can then again create more products for you to buy and grab your money.

    Stockholm syndrome.

    I could understand investing money on the workers to create a new gaming studio of their own. But this strike thing? Absolutely mental.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i've said i'd like to have one of those bad dragon dildos shaped like a horse, because the shape is nicer than human.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i was talking about horse cock again, told him to look at your sig.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    You have to be incredibly naive to believe that any of this will work and furthermore, the most important part, is the whole logic of paying the salaries of the employees of the company you hate so much.
    I mean, they're signing union auth cards now. Sure it's still a big uphill battle for them before anything happens, but it always is.

    And make up for the lost wages of the employees of a company we hate? Yeah, because we can separate out - employees who are pushing for change and not a part of the problems within the company, and the company itself and its management who are the primary ones at fault here who people are angry with.

    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    You, as a customer, want to pay them so they can work again for the company you hate, which can then again create more products for you to buy and grab your money.
    No, this is to show your support for the workers as they push for better working conditions and the removal of the leadership members that created and protected a toxic work environment. The goal being that the workers are able to unionize, and can negotiate contracts that would include actual accountability within the company and force out Kotick to bring in new leadership capable of enacting the change that needs to happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    Stockholm syndrome.
    Don't think you know what that term means.

    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    I could understand investing money on the workers to create a new gaming studio of their own. But this strike thing? Absolutely mental.
    Welcome to how workers rights are fought for. It's not fun, it's messy, it's risky, and a huge number of people who benefit from the rights and protections that union members have fought and died for will piss on continued efforts without understanding their significance.

  11. #31
    So they charge full price for an expansion, 13 bucks every month for a subscription, ridiculously high prices for ingame shop stuff. Then they underpay their staff and make working for them a living hell by harassing everyone so that nobody is actively working on anything right now but I still get charged for nothing.

    And now they have the audacity to ask me for money because they are striking and not working on the product THAT I ALREADY PAYED FOR 3 TIMES? Fucking assholes.

    If working for Blizzard sucks or isnt yielding enough money get a different job. Blizzard is dead anyway. No reason to pump more money into it.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Exkrementor View Post
    So they charge full price for an expansion, 13 bucks every month for a subscription, ridiculously high prices for ingame shop stuff. Then they underpay their staff and make working for them a living hell by harassing everyone so that nobody is actively working on anything right now but I still get charged for nothing.

    And now they have the audacity to ask me for money because they are striking and not working on the product THAT I ALREADY PAYED FOR 3 TIMES? Fucking assholes.

    If working for Blizzard sucks or isnt yielding enough money get a different job. Blizzard is dead anyway. No reason to pump more money into it.
    Do you not understand the difference between Blizzard as a corporate entity, the ones that determine the scope of the expansions and set prices and release targets, and the employees proper who largely have no say in any of that and are just working there?

    None of this money goes to Blizzard dude, it goes to the striking employees.

  13. #33
    The Unstoppable Force Puupi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Welcome to how workers rights are fought for. It's not fun, it's messy, it's risky, and a huge number of people who benefit from the rights and protections that union members have fought and died for will piss on continued efforts without understanding their significance.
    Workers rights definitely haven't been fought for with crowdfunded customer money, that's for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i've said i'd like to have one of those bad dragon dildos shaped like a horse, because the shape is nicer than human.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i was talking about horse cock again, told him to look at your sig.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    To cover the lost wages from the walkouts that Activision/Blizzard will not pay employees for, yes. How is this stupid? It's showing solidarity with the workers that are putting their jobs at risk to fight for better working conditions for themselves and their colleagues. This way you can directly support them without supporting ATVI's bottom line in the process.

    - - - Updated - - -



    "seems like she realize she couldn't get a new job that quickly" - which implies that she'd be taking the funds and using them herself, and that she didn't already have a job lined up.

    She made it clear her departure wasn't just because of that, but also because of the better pay/conditions elsewhere. That doesn't mean she doesn't still care about the folks she worked with for years and isn't going to continue supporting them however she can.

    There's literally nothing odd, shady, or weird about this. Only what shadows you conjure up in your head.
    She failed and now is jumping on the bandwagon again once others actually did shit she couldn't. Maybe it isn't monetary. Maybe its for twitter clout, out of the kindness of her heart, or what ever but yes its extremely odd to get a new job and go back and fuck around with your old job.

    Also why are you insulting me? I didn't say shit about you or her other than the fact its seems like a strange coincidence.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Puupi View Post
    Workers rights definitely haven't been fought for with crowdfunded customer money, that's for sure.
    Nope, but if it was a tool available at the time I'm sure organizers would have used it. Though there is a history of fundraising efforts on behalf of unions or workers trying to unionize to help cover costs at times, so this is hardly unprecedented.

    I'm just surprised at the backlash to, "People want better working conditions and are striking, if you want to voluntarily help contribute to a fund for their lost wages, here's a link." which seems like A) a good thing that they're organizing for better working conditions and B) a purely voluntary, inoffensive fund to help many of them with lost wages because a great many don't get paid shit.

    I don't think folks realize how little money most folks in gamedev make, especially compared to what they could be making elsewhere with their skillset.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    She failed and now is jumping on the bandwagon again once others actually did shit she couldn't. Maybe it isn't monetary. Maybe its for twitter clout, out of the kindness of her heart, or what ever but yes its extremely odd to get a new job and go back and fuck around with your old job.

    Also why are you insulting me? I didn't say shit about you or her other than the fact its seems like a strange coincidence.
    Did Jess like, shit in your cereal or something? Because you really seem to deeply dislike/mistrust her.

    And I'm not insulting you. I'm saying that you're conjuring up shadows in your mind, because you kinda are. Like the notion that this gofundme was because she couldn't find a job post-Blizzard, despite that she'd already had one lined up when she quit.

  16. #36
    Well for everyone wanting to unsub, that's a good place to put those dollars.
    Quote Originally Posted by DatToffer View Post
    Sylvanas will just give her own head to Tyrande.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    And just like the thread before it, let's back away from sexualizing Azshara and return to the original topic at hand.

  17. #37
    The Insane Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    She failed and now is jumping on the bandwagon again once others actually did shit she couldn't. Maybe it isn't monetary. Maybe its for twitter clout, out of the kindness of her heart, or what ever but yes its extremely odd to get a new job and go back and fuck around with your old job.

    Also why are you insulting me? I didn't say shit about you or her other than the fact its seems like a strange coincidence.
    you know it would take no effort like at all to go to her twitter and she that she isn't jumping on any bandwagon but has still been a active leader of the movment even after her resignation right?

    https://twitter.com/BlizzJess
    https://twitter.com/ABetterABK
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Nope, but if it was a tool available at the time I'm sure organizers would have used it. Though there is a history of fundraising efforts on behalf of unions or workers trying to unionize to help cover costs at times, so this is hardly unprecedented.

    I'm just surprised at the backlash to, "People want better working conditions and are striking, if you want to voluntarily help contribute to a fund for their lost wages, here's a link." which seems like A) a good thing that they're organizing for better working conditions and B) a purely voluntary, inoffensive fund to help many of them with lost wages because a great many don't get paid shit.

    I don't think folks realize how little money most folks in gamedev make, especially compared to what they could be making elsewhere with their skillset.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Did Jess like, shit in your cereal or something? Because you really seem to deeply dislike/mistrust her.

    And I'm not insulting you. I'm saying that you're conjuring up shadows in your mind, because you kinda are. Like the notion that this gofundme was because she couldn't find a job post-Blizzard, despite that she'd already had one lined up when she quit.
    Are you friends with her? Cause you keep attacking me like you are. I literally said one thing I assumed about her and you are making it sound like I stalked and tried to murder her. All I said it seemed odd that she quit claiming it was because she couldn't get shit done and now jumps on the bandwagon and starts the kickstarter. I assumed it was she couldn't find a job because all I knew of the situation was this thread and the one who explained who she was. Sorry I'm not creeping on her reading all her tweets and looking at her bank history. I guess next time I'll do that before commenting on anything.

    Not attacking me and yet asking if she shit in my cereal, Im conjuring shadows because the situation is indeed odd.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    you know it would take no effort like at all to go to her twitter and she that she isn't jumping on any bandwagon but has still been a active leader of the movment even after her resignation right?

    https://twitter.com/BlizzJess
    https://twitter.com/ABetterABK
    I don't use twitter. All the info I have is from the threads. Plus what kind of creep reads all the tweets from somebody.
    Last edited by qwerty123456; 2021-12-10 at 12:55 AM.

  19. #39
    The Unstoppable Force Puupi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Nope, but if it was a tool available at the time I'm sure organizers would have used it.
    It has been available all the time, no need for internet to do this. Nobody else just did it because it's absolutely bonkers. CUSTOMERS funding the fight... This is a sign of cult mentality and would not work in other businesses if the customers weren't so fanatic.

    If it did work like this in "normal situations", every fucking trade union/workers strike would be funded like this.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i've said i'd like to have one of those bad dragon dildos shaped like a horse, because the shape is nicer than human.
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    i was talking about horse cock again, told him to look at your sig.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Do you not understand the difference between Blizzard as a corporate entity, the ones that determine the scope of the expansions and set prices and release targets, and the employees proper who largely have no say in any of that and are just working there?

    None of this money goes to Blizzard dude, it goes to the striking employees.
    I understand that. Then the money should come from Blizzard. I paid for a product that isnt worked on properly. And I should pay extra because Bobby is an asshole? I already did my job, now everybody else need to do theirs.

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