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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Zka View Post
    This is old news. The transition was incremental but it's been very clear for several expansions now.
    Fun is no longer a goal, instead they try to build addictive timegated systems. I find these incredibly repulsing and anything but addictive, but apparently it works quite well for many people.

    I guess it's a management takeover. They defined KPIs that need to grow at all costs. Since fun is subjective and cannot be properly measured, they created KPIs like MAU which are wrong KPIs and steer the product off the rails while the KPIs keep saying "it's all fine". Good companies should notice a wrong KPI and fix their mistake but these guys are not good anymore.
    False. Fun is a goal. What you fail to understand is that "fun" is subjective and what you find fun others don't.

    So what you are really saying is "fun for ME is no longer a goal of Blizzard's. And it shouldn't be. Why? Because there are millions of others who play and many of them don't find fun what you do. The actual goal is to make the game as fun for as many people as they can knowing they will never make it fun for 100% of the people.

  2. #22
    i like logging in daily for at least 15-30 to do mindless repetitive things. When you get older you start appreciating some daily routine and "rewards" for all that do not matter that much anymore. The path is the goal. When the zone is visually pretty and interesting (what it seems to be, unlike Korthia) i like to spend time there. IDC how long it takes to unlock flying or some getting somewhat better blue gear. I am just there to press my buttons and click things.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalam the Venom View Post
    Not logged into WoW for at least 2 months.

    Shadowlands even longer than that.

    I’m personally enjoying Blade & Soul a lot more.

    When blizzard gets their head out of their arse and add more player power to blizz store, Then i might come back.

    But before that happens i’ll enjoy games that has that option.
    These are the types of players the game doesn't need. Those things should be earned, not given. They already toe that line with the level boost, but that is only because it doesn't boost you to max level.

  4. #24
    Out of the jar . . . Allatar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nalam the Venom View Post
    Just ways to by pass the time gates.

    Fast pass for the researches. Instant or at least a few days shorter.

    Torghast and other currencies (tho not unlimited, But just so you can get some more above the weekly amount)

    The RnG loot boxes that usually appear in the 5x Mything dungeon weekly.

    Vault slot unlocks.

    And such.
    And here we have it: someone actually advocating for the ability to buy an ingame advantage from the store with real $$.

    I hazard to suggest that the MMO genre is not for you.
    I don't know the recipe for success, but I know that the recipe for failure is trying to please everyone.

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  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by ResentfulUK View Post
    God forbid a game tries to keep you active and doesn't just hand you everything upon login.
    strawman,thats not what people want,they want actual content to do,not timers,remember back in tbc when you could spend weeks doing attunements?zero time gating,but it still took you a long ass time

    why is it so hard for people to understand,forced artificial time gating is simply bad game design,this isnt a mobile game,we pay a sub

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Devilyaki View Post
    Why make the game fun, fun isn’t allowed in Warcraft
    you do realise YOUR view of fun is opinion rather than definition?

    ill ask you something, what do you consider "fun" in wow, and how is cypher stoping you from doing it?

  7. #27
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    Renting business + timegates = profit
    If you knew the candle was fire then the meal was cooked a long time ago.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Devilyaki View Post
    God forbid a game keep you busy by giving something fun to do rather than time gate bs.
    Some people will find the progression of their character fun. If you don't want to work towards your character and their exploration of a new world there are plenty of other games that offer that experience.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalam the Venom View Post
    Just ways to by pass the time gates.

    Fast pass for the researches. Instant or at least a few days shorter.

    Torghast and other currencies (tho not unlimited, But just so you can get some more above the weekly amount)

    The RnG loot boxes that usually appear in the 5x Mything dungeon weekly.

    Vault slot unlocks.

    And such.
    Have you considered Magic the Gathering....a fat wallet will literally win you things

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    strawman,thats not what people want,they want actual content to do,not timers,remember back in tbc when you could spend weeks doing attunements?zero time gating,but it still took you a long ass time

    why is it so hard for people to understand,forced artificial time gating is simply bad game design,this isnt a mobile game,we pay a sub
    You're right. Taking 6 days to progress through a character development and exploration system is very un-MMO like.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by deenman View Post
    strawman,thats not what people want,they want actual content to do,not timers,remember back in tbc when you could spend weeks doing attunements?zero time gating,but it still took you a long ass time

    why is it so hard for people to understand,forced artificial time gating is simply bad game design,this isnt a mobile game,we pay a sub
    oh yeah, good old times without timegated content when you get somewhere, did daily quest... and you were done for the day, and had to return the next day to do the same q and do it for weeks, thats so much better than play how much you want and then wait a bit while you can do other things, or play other characters, or games or whatnot...

    dont know what game you played before but it seems it wasnt wow, as it have timegated content since vanila...

  12. #32
    Pandaren Monk Nalam the Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Allatar View Post
    And here we have it: someone actually advocating for the ability to buy an ingame advantage from the store with real $$.

    I hazard to suggest that the MMO genre is not for you.
    Most MMO’s have these options.

    Blizzard is just really weird, So many time gating and currencies, Just like those other games, But no ways to speed up with money.

    So WoW is just tedious for tedious sake.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterymask View Post
    Have you considered Magic the Gathering....a fat wallet will literally win you things
    I prefer MMORPG’s, I’m not much for the card games.

    Never even tried hearthstone for example.

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  13. #33
    I hope they just sell those things like Korean mmorpg.

  14. #34
    IQD was a beautiful zone and well laid-out. not these piles of muck dirt grime and sadness like korthia. makes a difference.

    ive said it many times before but the art in this game has gone into a tailspin. sets are ugly. zones are ugly. SL is a nightmare of art and design in general.

    time-gating is easier to deal with when the art is very good.
    Last edited by Kokolums; 2022-01-05 at 11:11 AM.
    TO FIX WOW:1. smaller server sizes & server-only LFG awarding satchels, so elite players help others. 2. "helper builds" with loom powers - talent trees so elite players cast buffs on low level players XP gain, HP/mana, regen, damage, etc. 3. "helper ilvl" scoring how much you help others. 4. observer games like in SC to watch/chat (like twitch but with MORE DETAILS & inside the wow UI) 5. guild leagues to compete with rival guilds for progression (with observer mode).6. jackpot world mobs.

  15. #35
    there's somewhat intelligent timegating that covers a specific timespan by rationing reputation over several days (dailies)

    and there's mobile level braindead timegating bullshit designs as the cypher

    i'd prefer the dailies.

  16. #36
    Pandaren Monk Nalam the Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    These are the types of players the game doesn't need. Those things should be earned, not given. They already toe that line with the level boost, but that is only because it doesn't boost you to max level.
    The WoW Token --> wait for it to sell --> find booster --> wait for completion of boosted run --> wait for vault day.

    Is just a bit of a Conveluted mess imo.

    Would be better to have the Loot in an RnG box straight from the store, so you can avoid going through the boosters.

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  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    you do realise YOUR view of fun is opinion rather than definition?

    ill ask you something, what do you consider "fun" in wow, and how is cypher stoping you from doing it?
    I don’t find anything in wow right now worth my time, it’s a game of boring tasks.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by gosuabbbff View Post
    AQ was timegated. ICC was timegated. Timegating has been in WoW since the beginning, "old news" indeed and there's no "transition" you speak of. And those were part of the player progression systems. Zereth Mortis has none of it.
    AQ was not timegated aside from the one week delay from delivering supplies til event start. The progress and pace was entirely dependent on server effort. AQwas effort gated, the only good way of gating. There were no artificial daily limits to turn ins, only goal.
    Modern gaming apologist: I once tasted diarrhea so shit is fine.

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  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Nalam the Venom View Post
    The WoW Token --> wait for it to sell --> find booster --> wait for completion of boosted run --> wait for vault day.

    Is just a bit of a Conveluted mess imo.

    Would be better to have the Loot in an RnG box straight from the store, so you can avoid going through the boosters.
    WoW doesn't sell the boost nor does Blizzard. Players do. Even in a boost run they still have to complete content to get gear.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Wilian View Post
    AQ was not timegated aside from the one week delay from delivering supplies til event start. The progress and pace was entirely dependent on server effort. AQwas effort gated, the only good way of gating. There were no artificial daily limits to turn ins, only goal.
    Man, I wish they brought back this design then.

    To enter the raid you must farm 55000 pieces of leather and 35400 herbs.
    Will be the most fun anyone has ever had.

    Also, since this is peak game design, let's make you do it on all characters separately.
    So as much fun is had as possible.

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