M+ Needs a Queue

[crusadernero]

You can't really be serious, this is a troll right?

Automated M+ doesn't work because not everyone is capable of doing it
Its like asking for LFR for heroic and mythic raids, they already have a hard time completing LFR

Just put a MMR system tied to it and "everyone" will be happy. People love ranking these days!

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I said it. When I was playing WoW I first experienced M+ when I joined a M0. Didn't think it was that bad but then once I got up around 8-10 I noticed finding groups became painful. Bare in mind I was a frost mage and at the start of 9.0 after pre-launch nerfs Frost Mages were dookie. Fire wasn't but man I really really hate twitchy gameplay.

Being honest here--there's no good logical reason from my perspective as to why this doesn't happen. I know people will all say comp comp comp--my response is that the burden of responsibility for balancing the game so that all specs, and all classes are viable with one another is a dev issue, and any deviation from that statement is you as a paying customer being okay with a subpar product.

Hire some actuaries to balance your numbers and let players connect with one another automatically. The insistence on Premade grouping is so dated and not helpful to anyone.

Nah I think its fine that m+ dont have automated queues. Its not like its complicated to search and find groups, or even start your own. Just make a grp with your key, invite whoever you wish and go. Just because you are "leader" doesnt mean you have to lead the grp.

[czarek]

I have not had one single leaver or troll in a run during the entirety of SL season 2. I know they do exist but theyre really not common at all and just an easy excuse for hardcore casuals to bring up as to why they should be able to watch Netflix while pushing a 23.

Ok so compare experience from m+ and lfr/lfd lottery. Mix them. Im not sayin its bad idea but this need system rating brackets etc.

[Miffinat0r]

Ok so compare experience from m+ and lfr/lfd lottery. Mix them. Im not sayin its bad idea but this need system rating brackets etc.

Brackets wouldn't be bad. It matches you with players of your same skill. And suddenly you now have players who you can contact to make premades!

This is a positive when I see it. Every other game has adopted this mentality and they shot up like a rocket.

[NineSpine]

Isn't how class war works. It isn't that they want mythic destroyed it is that they want to be the mythic raiders or what they perceive being a mythic raider is like.

The idea that I want to mythic raid is hilarious.

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So go play those other games then.

Thanks, you are very edgy and cool.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

I've been playing them since the 90's also going back to D1. Expecting the worst is your own choice but I don't think adding an automated grouping tool is the end of the world. I think a lot of people would use it and be fine with it. It would be for people who just want to complete an m+ for the week without having to stress out about their dungeon score or having the right spec to get an invite or people to join their group.

Except, this change would have consequences, and those consequences would cause more changes. Thats the whole problem.

It won't be as simple as just adding a premade group finder to the game and we all know it. Because you know, LFR hasn't had any changes or caused any changes to the game.

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Literally if you go back in the thread you can see people worship these players for some reason. I'm sitting here going, why? All I'm asking for is a play and go feature that lets me continually build gear for my character. It's like there's some kind of sacred cow, and this is why I'm posting these threads because it exposes how people think about others. So far the only takeaway I have is people want to exclude people because they think they're more valuable, and don't want to be associated with others.

Furthermore I want to stress this; My brother-in-law is a Actuary. I told him about this, that dude literally balances predictive models based on over 10K lives and tries to tie the chances of getting sick based on age, zip, and what not. I mentioned there's 36 specs and his response was: Any actuarial assistant could do that in a day or two. The math isn't the issue; it's the will.

No one is trying to exclude anyone. Just because you don't want to use LFG, does not mean you are excluded.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

It is more like adding to a core piece of content. They could cap it at +15 or something. I guess the more accessible all content is the better imho.

Its completely accessible, I have no idea why you think it isn't.

[Berndorf]

Except, this change would have consequences, and those consequences would cause more changes. Thats the whole problem.

It won't be as simple as just adding a premade group finder to the game and we all know it. Because you know, LFR hasn't had any changes or caused any changes to the game.

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No one is trying to exclude anyone. Just because you don't want to use LFG, does not mean you are excluded.

The main change(imo) would be to condense the levels down to 1-2 levels per affix, remove keys for queues in the tool(though they could reward a key for the level of the dungeon if done in time) and only allowing queueing for levels 1/2 and the possibility of giving repeated loot on the lower levels since the dungeons will be random. Now you may not agree or like those changes but that's the way it is with any changes or opinions have on the internet. Some people will like it and some won't. Life goes on.

[munkeyinorbit]

Yea...if you're a tank or healer lol.

When I was playing I could get groups within 5 mins everytime by making my own groups. It takes about 10 hours to go from scratch but I was able to start running 13 to 15s on a guy who was 194 ilvl. Yes. Ilvl 194 as a warlock.

DPS would swarm all over me to get a place so I could choose high ilvl, highly sought after classes and a tank and healer. For the most part I didn't even care about the RIO. Within two weeks I was doing 1 m+ dungeon a week and collecting my 220 to 226 piece. I did this for a lock, a feral, a ret, and a BrM. To me it was better than an auto queue and a pot quicker.

[kenn9530]

I said it. When I was playing WoW I first experienced M+ when I joined a M0. Didn't think it was that bad but then once I got up around 8-10 I noticed finding groups became painful. Bare in mind I was a frost mage and at the start of 9.0 after pre-launch nerfs Frost Mages were dookie. Fire wasn't but man I really really hate twitchy gameplay.

Being honest here--there's no good logical reason from my perspective as to why this doesn't happen. I know people will all say comp comp comp--my response is that the burden of responsibility for balancing the game so that all specs, and all classes are viable with one another is a dev issue, and any deviation from that statement is you as a paying customer being okay with a subpar product.

Hire some actuaries to balance your numbers and let players connect with one another automatically. The insistence on Premade grouping is so dated and not helpful to anyone.

Its an MMO not everything should be automated, the game is best played with friends, pugging is just boring and doesnt always work out. There are too many bad players that cant handle the harder content, do you really want to waste time getting bad players and waste so much time just because you want to click 1 button to get a group, the system is good as it is.

Its really easy to get a group for M+, if you have a group of friends then you will never have an issue doing keys.

You cant just automate M+ because many players dont actually learn the content and how to make it easy, so bad players make it much harder than it needs to be and waste everyones time.

[NineSpine]

?? I literally said adding a queue is a dumb idea

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Im not being edgy literally go play a different MMO. There are so many quality ones now that there is one for every player dont demand WoW changes because you cant get over your sunk cost fallacy.

Hell I play three of them actively for very different reasons right now. Im not gonna demand that they change what makes them unique rather than just exploring other options

Have you considered that a discussion board is not the place for you if you dislike discussion?

[Gestopft]

Its really easy to get a group for M+, if you have a group of friends then you will never have an issue doing keys.

More than that even. I don't even have a regular group- I still run (at least) a key per week on every class, and at this point the lowest I will apply on my lowest toons is +8, but I think I've done some 10+ on every class by now. Yeah, some classes/specs can take longer to find groups (especially when you get to 15+) but it's far from impossible. I guess it probably helps that my toons are split across factions, so if one side is dead I can check the other, but still...I spend a significant chunk of my time in-game running M+ (screw this week though, ewww), and I just don't have that hard of a time finding groups. Especially at the low end.

[Accendor]

No, it really does not need that.
In fact, we should remove automated queues whereever we can.

[kenn9530]

More than that even. I don't even have a regular group- I still run (at least) a key per week on every class, and at this point the lowest I will apply on my lowest toons is +8, but I think I've done some 10+ on every class by now. Yeah, some classes/specs can take longer to find groups (especially when you get to 15+) but it's far from impossible. I guess it probably helps that my toons are split across factions, so if one side is dead I can check the other, but still...I spend a significant chunk of my time in-game running M+ (screw this week though, ewww), and I just don't have that hard of a time finding groups. Especially at the low end.

I never pug would run with guildies or not run a 15 at all, running with friends is much more fun talking on discord than the silence of pugging, MMOs need to push towards players actually talking to each other, otherwise its just a single player game with npcs who dont say anything.

[Argorwal]

Queue would not work.

However comps are the issue and that makes it dumb. Certain classes and or certain specs are just simply not invited to anything higher then a 9 for the most part.

All 36 specs in the game have timed a +25.

[MrLachyG]

Basically you're saying that people worship these raiders? Is that what're pointing out?

I mean WoW has already lost a ton of casual players and that's not any concern at all to you?

This doomsday scenario is like imagin if Miley Cyrus stopped performing the entire music industry would collapse over night!

what actual evidence (not feelings, not anecdotal evidence) do you have that wow has lost a ton of casual players?

[Arcreid]

They need to start adding an actual rating to queued content as well so i don't get matched with literal goldfish and monkeys, especially during leveling content.

[Gestopft]

I never pug would run with guildies or not run a 15 at all, running with friends is much more fun talking on discord than the silence of pugging, MMOs need to push towards players actually talking to each other, otherwise its just a single player game with npcs who dont say anything.

I don't disagree at all there; It's way more fun shooting the breeze with guildies/smashing the dungeon with a reasonable level of communication (I would run with a guild sometimes before it fell apart). My point is simply that getting into a group (that doesn't suck) through the Group Finder is not nearly as hard as many people make it out to be, nor is having a reasonable level of success in the M+ system.

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All 36 specs in the game have timed a +25.

Which is totally awesome, and probably an underrated fact (particularly within the community where it matters the most)

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Absolute worst idea for M+ I’ve seen on this website yet.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

The main change(imo) would be to condense the levels down to 1-2 levels per affix, remove keys for queues in the tool(though they could reward a key for the level of the dungeon if done in time) and only allowing queueing for levels 1/2 and the possibility of giving repeated loot on the lower levels since the dungeons will be random. Now you may not agree or like those changes but that's the way it is with any changes or opinions have on the internet. Some people will like it and some won't. Life goes on.

So a huge change? Yeah why don't you see that as a problem at all? I am not saying your idea is bad, but I don't think you are thinking of how this will effect others or how it will lead to even more changes.

Its basically a massive overhaul of how M+ works, and all because OP is literally just too lazy to make a group or look for one in LFG. Thats just not good enough reasoning for me to even consider massively nuking a system already in play, especially when you won't be able to punish poor performance or leavers at all.

It would be different if just a queue was added, but that won't happen. It would be too hard for OP and others and they would need nerfs or massive changes to the way things work, which would lead to less fun for current M+ players, or two different loot systems, which would lead to more complaining., and then they would just call it "Legendary Dungeons" ... cycle would repeat.

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I never pug would run with guildies or not run a 15 at all, running with friends is much more fun talking on discord than the silence of pugging, MMOs need to push towards players actually talking to each other, otherwise its just a single player game with npcs who dont say anything.

Lets be honest, thats what some people want. Why they are playing WoW and expecting that, I don't know. Its douchey in my opinion.

[Wries]

While I do think they should homogenise the classes somewhat more (Legion levels).. part of the interesting thing about m+ is doing comps. So some diversity is needed. And some stuff is going to come up on top because the community works like that.

If there was a queue for +10's you'd be surprised how many people would queue, be clueless and fail. Maybe the system wouldn't destroy a key but you'd feel like you wasted your time.