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  1. #21
    I am Murloc! Makabreska's Avatar
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    Yet another Teriz low key "Tinkers when" thread. Creating these wont make the class happen, though.
    Last edited by Makabreska; 2022-01-09 at 06:24 PM.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  2. #22
    Scarab Lord Razorice's Avatar
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    I don't care about new races or classes to be honest. If they add them, great.

    All I want from expansions is less forced time-gating. Let me grind reps, etc the old way.

  3. #23
    races are always kinda meh... classes though, The more the better.

  4. #24
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McNeil View Post
    I don't think that a new race or class is that high on the playerbases wish list for wanting to play WoW, they want the game to be actually good. They could maybe forgive its absence if all the other content is at least of high quality. Quality over quantity or quantity over quality, either way SL has failed on both.
    I disagree. I remember playing through WotLK, MoP, and Legion, and having that new class floating around always gave me something additional to dive into beyond the typical expansion drive. It's definitely a new feature, and for some players a new class becomes a permanent feature because it becomes their new main. New races adds this as well, but to a much lower extent, since new races tend to be more cosmetic than mechanical.

    However, compare that to SL where neither were added, and the expansion simply has to hang on its own merits. Again, is it a coincidence that WotLK, MoP, and Legion are all considered great expansions, while WoD and SL are pretty much considered among the worst?

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    Quote Originally Posted by marcusblood View Post
    The fact that they added so many new allied races yet made them gated behind stupid questlines and rep (which was rescinded) is just a testament for how stupid they are. They need to add new stuff to keep it interesting. Fuck what the retards think about balance. Just add the classes and say fuck it. A new class always injects life into the game.
    The questlines are just as stupid. As I said, hopefully all the requirements are removed in 10.0.

  5. #25
    Warchief Nero Duskwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Interestingly, those two expansions had no new races or classes. Could it be that expansions lacking those features are considered “less than”?
    No. SL and WOD didn't suck because they lacked new classes/races. They sucked because of poor design and iteration, unwieldy systems, content drought caused by trying to repair the previous two items, content cut as a result of falling behind executing said fixes, and overall incoherent storytelling resulting from the swaths of content slashed. Having a new race or class in place isn't going to gloss all of that shit over. It'll just go from a shit expansion to a shit expansion with yet another FotM race/class that falls by the wayside
    Quote Originally Posted by Ulqiorra View Post
    If you equate playing WoW to having electricity, I feel very, very happy for the rest of the world, as that kind of thinking will, inevitably, lead to the eradication of your seed from the gene pool.
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  6. #26
    Yes we can if blizzard actually makes changes into making every class perform at the same % and create a game where you enjoy playing like they did with legion or dare i say MoP

  7. #27
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nero Duskwind View Post
    No. SL and WOD didn't suck because they lacked new classes/races. They sucked because of poor design and iteration, unwieldy systems, content drought caused by trying to repair the previous two items, content cut as a result of falling behind executing said fixes, and overall incoherent storytelling resulting from the swaths of content slashed. Having a new race or class in place isn't going to gloss all of that shit over. It'll just go from a shit expansion to a shit expansion with yet another FotM race/class that falls by the wayside
    The evidence doesn't bear this out though. The classes that bring in new races and especially new classes simply don't rank as low as SL and WoD among players. What is it about expansions that have new classes especially that make them considered the best among WoW's expansions?

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Interestingly, those two expansions had no new races or classes. Could it be that expansions lacking those features are considered “less than”?

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    Considering that Blizzard remixes the existing classes every expansion, I don’t believe that perfect balance is a realistic goal.
    i would consider that coincidence. mop was considered terrible until 5.1 and that expac had both.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Interestingly, those two expansions had no new races or classes. Could it be that expansions lacking those features are considered “less than”?
    oh yes, thats why BFA that added more races than all previous expansions combined was soooo loved...

  10. #30
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aceperson View Post
    i would consider that coincidence. mop was considered terrible until 5.1 and that expac had both.
    5.1 came out like 2 months after expansion release. Also I don't remember people saying it was terrible, I remember trolls saying it was "kiddie".

    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    oh yes, thats why BFA that added more races than all previous expansions combined was soooo loved...
    More races gated behind ridiculous rep and quest grinds.

  11. #31
    Light comes from darkness shise's Avatar
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    Who ever said that this is a must feature?

    Should be happy that they do it at all ever again.

    Honestly, they should focus on brgining the game back to BC/WotLK systems, and then progress from that point.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    even if they managed to pull out a Wrath, MoP or Legion (My top 3), people are going to complain.
    Because they will pull out a weak demented version of those 3 exp with some bullshit system that nobody wanted or that were already labelled as terrible on alpha etc etc

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    Quote Originally Posted by aceperson View Post
    i would consider that coincidence. mop was considered terrible until 5.1 and that expac had both.
    pretty much false only people that were crying were the male playing orcs moaning about "pandas" because of sexual insecurities or whatever

  13. #33
    Warchief Nero Duskwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    The evidence doesn't bear this out though. The classes that bring in new races and especially new classes simply don't rank as low as SL and WoD among players. What is it about expansions that have new classes especially that make them considered the best among WoW's expansions?
    https://wowanalytica.com/statistics

    Out of the 12 classes, in terms of popularity/most played, Demon Hunter, Death Knight, and Monk rank, 8th, 9th, and 11th, respectively. Sure, the novelty of trying a new class in a new expansion is enticing, but novelty inevitably wears off and the remaining features need to be strong enough for the expansion to stand on its own merit. WotLK and MoP both had incredibly immersive continents rich in engaging lore, fun dungeons, and a wildly popular and, to this day, beloved raid encounter; Ulduar and Throne of Thunder, respectively. I can't really speak to Legion's endgame because I'd long retired from raiding by then.
    Last edited by Nero Duskwind; 2022-01-09 at 06:55 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ulqiorra View Post
    If you equate playing WoW to having electricity, I feel very, very happy for the rest of the world, as that kind of thinking will, inevitably, lead to the eradication of your seed from the gene pool.
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  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    However, compare that to SL where neither were added, and the expansion simply has to hang on its own merits. Again, is it a coincidence that WotLK, MoP, and Legion are all considered great expansions, while WoD and SL are pretty much considered among the worst?
    MoP was not considered great expansion, ever, it was always considered "middle of the pack" at best by popular vote...
    cata added new races and wasnt really liked, bfa added shitloads of new races and was hated...

    and sorry, but DH wasnt what made legion good, it was cherry on the top but it would be good expansion without it, simply due to content and setting,
    same for wrath with setting, plus some nostalgia - and i say it as DK main and someone who loved wrath at the time - if it was released today it would be received terribly
    Last edited by Lolites; 2022-01-09 at 06:57 PM.

  15. #35
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    Who ever said that this is a must feature?

    Should be happy that they do it at all ever again.
    Not really a must-have feature, but considering that players expect new things, and prospective players might be interested in starting/coming back to WoW with a new class or new races, it's something for Blizzard to consider.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by shise View Post
    Who ever said that this is a must feature?
    Shouldnt be a feature should be a core stuff.

    Each expac new class and new race to re ignite the hype, it worked for each expac with this mindset beside terrible system or awful patches

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    More races gated behind ridiculous rep and quest grinds.
    lol "ridiculous rep grind" was ravenholdt in vanila, but allied races? if you only did emisaries (which you generaly wanted to do bcs of reward) you would get all easily...
    it wasnt just given to people, which i know is hard to grasp to some people, but that is GOOD THING with something that is like 99.9% cosmetic...

  18. #38
    Im hoping for the allied-race verson of new classes:
    -Tinker? Here! But only one specc!
    -Dark ranger? Sure, but only one specc
    -Geomancer? Yupp.

    3 diffrent classes for the price of one, instead of pruning a future class into another class (Like gladiator or blademaster fantasy being pushed into warrior with the wrong aesthetic)

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    lol "ridiculous rep grind" was ravenholdt in vanila, but allied races? if you only did emisaries (which you generaly wanted to do bcs of reward) you would get all easily...
    it wasnt just given to people, which i know is hard to grasp to some people, but that is GOOD THING with something that is like 99.9% cosmetic...
    Not in BFA


    Every timegate behind simple feature like new race are terrible and a red flag that there is something wrong with the game because if they need to stretch the time to unlock a feature like that it means there is no content.


    I can get timegate behind heritage xmog but not a race or not like we saw for some races
    Last edited by TBCCLOL; 2022-01-09 at 06:58 PM.

  20. #40
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nero Duskwind View Post
    https://wowanalytica.com/statistics

    Out of the 12 classes, in terms of popularity/most played, Demon Hunter, Death Knight, and Monk rank, 8th, 9th, and 11th, respectively. Sure, the novelty of trying a new class in a new expansion is enticing, but novelty inevitably wears off and the remaining features need to be strong enough for the expansion to stand on its own merit. WotLK and MoP both had incredibly immersive continents rich in engaging lore, fun dungeons, and a wildly popular and, to this day, beloved raid encounter; Ulduar and Throne of Thunder, respectively. I can't really speak to Legion's endgame because I'd long retired from raiding by then.
    Those are the stats now (which shows value because those are active accounts which in turn fills Blizzard's coffers), but while those expansions were active a lot more players were playing and experimenting with those classes. I'm asking if having those new ways to experience the game didn't add to the overall experience of those expansions when they were active for players. I believe they did. I fondly remember running back through old content in MoP with my shiny new Pandaren monk and tanking old dungeons for example.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    lol "ridiculous rep grind" was ravenholdt in vanila, but allied races? if you only did emisaries (which you generaly wanted to do bcs of reward) you would get all easily...
    it wasnt just given to people, which i know is hard to grasp to some people, but that is GOOD THING with something that is like 99.9% cosmetic...
    The problem is that new races and classes WERE given to people in every other expansion, so having to level up to 110 and grind through Kul'tiras or Zandalar to get a major expansion feature sucked. My only requirement for playing Pandaren and Monk in MoP was purchasing the game.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2022-01-09 at 07:02 PM.

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