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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by MiiiMiii View Post
    * Young gamers are not as interested in PC gaming. They prefer phone games in a much higher degree.

    What do you think, can WoW keep going in the path it is, ignoring recruiting young gamers?
    This is due to the failure of pc/console gaming..but also refelctive in that gaming ahs transitioned from just a thing for young people, because the young people when it started in the late 80s/90s are all now adults who also stil play those games.


    Their parents never had gaming as children, so associate gaming with childhood, but now, it has a fully fledged adult market for those who were children old enough to play video games in the mid 80s to 90s, which is basically everyone up to about 50 years old today. These are grown ass men, and not one consider gaming childish, all that's chagned is the amount of time they put aside for gaming, , especially once they discover sex, need to actualyg et a job, and off course marry and start having children of their own, some of their children are in their 20s even early 30s, themselves adults and some alreayd having children of their own able to play videogames, i.e. under 10. Yes, you could quite easily be a 50 year old grandpa - especially if you were a ttenage dad, and your kid also started early.

    Video games don't need to appeal to younger people peprsay, but younger people are a larger market slice because of a growing population.. except the west has an increasing aging population, and more young people are dying/being killed than older and many of us, now in between 20 and 40 aren't having as many children, there are more singles , unmarried and childless now than ever before both factoring population growth, and ratios.


    What appeals to a 30 year old man is bound to be differnt to what appeals to a 14 year old boy. But adults always made video games.. always, those who started making thegames we play are now in their 60s - 80s. It appealed to us becasue they understood what was fun, and exciting, and that is ageless. They had balls, were bold and gutsy, and there are inform boy-men around to understand what fun is and know how to reproduce it.

    They really have no excuse. Not appealing to younger generations is all about their market drive, and how they invest in popularising the game. Allthe points you bring up are valid

    Game system wise, the game is as fun as it has been, this should be appealingto new people as much as old people who have done it for years get bored, or at least take very long breaks.

    The fact that it isn't is because they aren't reaching. As old and establisehd as worcraft is, it should have had a much larger media presence in films and TV series, which are priceless adverts, especially animation. Can you imaigne if Warcraft did a Dragon Prince-esque series and a n Arcane 3D -esque type of series... it would totally draw people to the franchise and ultimately the game.

    it has the youtube folloiwng, the reddit following.. there are a lot of 20-30 year old that still paly it, and younger still...

    They also fail to produce single player games which are amore affordable gaming medium than MMORPGs for younger gamers, ..

    Basically, htey don't do enough i world of warcraft and don't do enough for warcraft.


    Warcraft should be releasing single games - Dragonage/Mass Effect/KOTOR level
    THe MMO should run alongside it ast he world deep dive to the stroy driven single player games

    THey should have TVV series (several), a main arc film series and lots of support small appa gmes.

    They could have done so much more with the app game support for wow, and added games from apps, based in warcraft that connect to and support your ingame character..

    THe misison table could have actually been agme in itself, where in the MMO, i'ts just senidng groups on quests you don't do anything, but on the app game, you can actually do sometihing


    They could hae had a building game and a sims like game too, that tied into the MMO, by developing your city, your character having a family, which actually yileded in game resources, buffs and boosts for your character as well as improved your capital zone, but however, all of this could be done from a sims like app game, or sim city type app game thath connected to your client and updated it with your progress.

    you could play the app game without the amin game, but for the fullest experience you could see the tiny 2-D versions on your phone in incredible visual experiences in game with effects tthat effect your character, so much so you could log in game and spend your time decorating your home and living in your city, if you wanted too, just seeing the effects in a 3-D environment, that you saw on your app, although the main focus of the mmo is going out and doing adventures and raids.

    All this builds appreciation, focus, it also appelas to mainy aspects that draw and excite people


    in the above i have

    1. A building game [think Civilization, Minecraft adaptation] that ties into actually in game zones of the various races you can build up
    2. An adventure game [single player Mass Effect/Dragon Age-esque type games]
    3. An arcade like activity game [Siege combat, vehicle combat/racing - all part of mobile gaming but also ties into wow via things like mission table - also old style turn rpg taht uses the mission table quests a lot more
    4. A sims like game
    5. A movie franchise
    6. A tv franchise

    ALl of these are incredible income sources in and of themselves, connected, and combined and feeding into the MMO as the central platfor, fuels and ensures your grass roots... add to that the same level of development you get for expansions...

    Trust me, you would dominate across several boards


    7. Why haven't they developed a full arena game already? MK/SF style or a new style, LoL style even that doesn't require you to have wow itself, however both feeds into wow and your wow characters can feed into it. This can bring people who don't buy wow, into buying wow, they can buy the arena game, and play without subscription, but the more appealing the benefits of having wow are, the more they would want to actually do an adventure game or mmo game with their characters from the Arena game, and may actually subscribe and enjoy a different format type of play.



    I mean, they've done what no one else could do in their popularity, this is how they should have expanded it.. but all of these are my ideas.. so don't share it with them. I suspect they're just greedy for money now, no passion in developing the game, just milking people, and thus the project is doomed to die...becuas eyou need passion and ambition for the game, to produce more... you will get money from all of these, but if money was your main focus, you'd never do anything.. you'd just milk the cow.. a money man would care about a gaming need or desire, but a gamer who wants to amke money with his work, well that's a different thing.

  2. #162
    This isn't just a problem for WoW. It's a problem for all of Blizzard.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53ZFo8jpDfI

    They haven't had a successful game stay as up to date as WoW since...WoW. (EDIT: Forgot Hearthstone)

    They're literally flailing around with their properties. HoTS, SC2, and OW are all pretty much in maintenance mode. So far all their releases have been pretty piss poor and it's directly related to the fact that Blizzard as a company is not able to produce games that are popular with staying power against their other competitors.

    I'd argue WoW is probably the last refuge for Blizzard currently, and honestly the only reason it's still big is because of it's legacy at this point, not because so many new players are joining.

    Blizz needs new leadership and new creative leadership, it's pretty plain to see.

    I know this gonna trigger many of you but honestly as a company--Blizzard needs to do better with controlling toxicity in games. I think that's the start of the process. Get rid of people who berate and taunt others. Tell em' go to Rust.
    Last edited by Miffinat0r; 2022-01-13 at 01:54 PM.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Conceptuel View Post
    Youch. Edge much?

    Then again, I suppose with the intellectual tendencies of this forum, such a lack of understanding of ethics and whathaveyou is not unexpected. Perhaps it is only due to certain variables on your part which you surely do not choose for you to have such a poor grasp of ethics.
    What on Earth do ethics have to do with being a customer or producer of a good and/or service?
    He is absolutely right: He is a customer and therefore the only thing he naturally cares about is whether the product is worth his money. Either it is or it isn't.
    What you, I or anybody else thinks about this particular product is not his concern or his problem. He is acting rationally, you are not.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Azerox View Post
    Young people dont wanna work for things anymore, they just wanna buy it with daddy's CC.
    That's why gaming is being ruined with micro transactions (etc) nowadays.
    Such a lazy outlook lmao

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by T-34 View Post
    What on Earth do ethics have to do with being a customer or producer of a good and/or service?
    He is absolutely right: He is a customer and therefore the only thing he naturally cares about is whether the product is worth his money. Either it is or it isn't.
    What you, I or anybody else thinks about this particular product is not his concern or his problem. He is acting rationally, you are not.
    Lotta people have a hard time accepting that new players don't want to be bored one shooting mobs for 60 hours of grinding and chores before they can reasonably start mythic. The wow player base obsesses over being bored so they feel like they "worked" towards something. This crowd started appearing in wrath and I still hate them.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Sucralose View Post
    Lotta people have a hard time accepting that new players don't want to be bored one shooting mobs for 60 hours of grinding and chores before they can reasonably start mythic. The wow player base obsesses over being bored so they feel like they "worked" towards something. This crowd started appearing in wrath and I still hate them.
    Grinding and "chores" are the definition of MMOs. It has always been like this.
    Some people like it and play the game. That is rational.
    Some people don't like and don't play the game. That is also rational.
    And then we have the very small minority that still plays the game even though they don't like it. They are irrational.
    And the we have the even smaller minority that doesn't play the game, but still complain about it. The are even more irrational.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by T-34 View Post
    Grinding and "chores" are the definition of MMOs. It has always been like this.
    Some people like it and play the game. That is rational.
    Some people don't like and don't play the game. That is also rational.
    And then we have the very small minority that still plays the game even though they don't like it. They are irrational.
    And the we have the even smaller minority that doesn't play the game, but still complain about it. The are even more irrational.
    When you say always do you mean three games from 15 years ago you can't let go of because your near or in our forties?

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by Sucralose View Post
    When you say always do you mean three games from 15 years ago you can't let go of because your near or in our forties?
    Blizzard can of course make WoW in to another game. That might make Blizzard more money, but it could also make Blizzard less.
    When people argue that WoW should change in order to attract new players, then the selfsame people should consider if that change will make WoW loose more of the "old players".
    At the end of the day it is a business decision.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by T-34 View Post
    Blizzard can of course make WoW in to another game. That might make Blizzard more money, but it could also make Blizzard less.
    When people argue that WoW should change in order to attract new players, then the selfsame people should consider if that change will make WoW loose more of the "old players".
    At the end of the day it is a business decision.
    A lot of people are suggesting wow change back to what it was. A game where if you wanted to just go and do something you did it rather then grind some weird currancy.

    The time it took to get into any end game in tbc to even cata era was hours at max level. Then it went to days in mop and wod. Then weeks in legion,bfa, and sl.

    If you want to pitch a game to someone telling them that after a 100 hours of one shotting world mobs and grinding torghast they can get to the good parts they are never gonna play your game.

    WoW being a grindfest is a recent thing. Before you really only found it in classic. It used to just be if your good enough you advance.

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Sucralose View Post
    A lot of people are suggesting wow change back to what it was. A game where if you wanted to just go and do something you did it rather then grind some weird currancy.

    The time it took to get into any end game in tbc to even cata era was hours at max level. Then it went to days in mop and wod. Then weeks in legion,bfa, and sl.

    If you want to pitch a game to someone telling them that after a 100 hours of one shotting world mobs and grinding torghast they can get to the good parts they are never gonna play your game.

    WoW being a grindfest is a recent thing. Before you really only found it in classic. It used to just be if your good enough you advance.
    You most certainly couldn't do end-game in TBC when you dinged 70. There were plenty of attunements that needed done.
    Today?
    Nothing stops you from hammering out M+ the moment you ding max in SL. If you and the 4 others are good then the sky is the limit.
    Nothing stops you from completing the raid on heroic the moment it comes out. The only thing holding you back is your skill and the skill of the rest in the group.
    The same goes for Mythic Raids. Just be good enough.

    And if you are new and/or bad then you can do normal dungeons and lfr more or less when you ding max level.
    Want to do the harder content? Get better.

    So if you by "attracting young players" mean content made for players that don't find it fun to better themselves then WoW has more of that now that it ever had before.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by T-34 View Post
    You most certainly couldn't do end-game in TBC when you dinged 70. There were plenty of attunements that needed done.
    Today?
    Nothing stops you from hammering out M+ the moment you ding max in SL. If you and the 4 others are good then the sky is the limit.
    Nothing stops you from completing the raid on heroic the moment it comes out. The only thing holding you back is your skill and the skill of the rest in the group.
    The same goes for Mythic Raids. Just be good enough.

    And if you are new and/or bad then you can do normal dungeons and lfr more or less when you ding max level.
    Want to do the harder content? Get better.

    So if you by "attracting young players" mean content made for players that don't find it fun to better themselves then WoW has more of that now that it ever had before.
    The attunements of tbc had you doing the content in the order of difficulty it had from dungeons to heroic dungeons to raiding. It was a linear line that ever increased and challenged the player or at least increased in difficulty.

    Dinging on SL means you have to hit your renowned, conduits, leggos, and start on your sockets and domination gems.

    Go on bud pitch running torghast for me multiple times in a way that doesn't sound like hammering a nail into a chalk board.

    I always tire of lfr players bumbling along pretending everything is their version of right click and win.

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