Crisis in UK, Can Tories Save Liz Truss?

[dribbles]

Mordaunt's supporters fear defeat.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-p...ost_type=share

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BREAKING 5th round of Tory leadership

(Last round in brackets)

Mordaunt 105 (92)
Sunak 137 (118)
Truss 113 (86)

SUNAK V TRUSS GO THROUGH TO MEMBERSHIP BALLOT

https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status...71470913650688

Clear choice now. No tax cuts and high big state spending from socialist Red Rishi, or tax cuts from our darling Liz and the dole for lots of state "workers". No contest what the Tory members will go for.

I'm looking forward to those tax cuts sooner rather than later, what to spend them on is the question. Yet another BTL?

Liz for Leader!

[Forogil]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...st#top-of-blog

I believe that overestimated Rishi Sunak's chances (yes, I'm a bit late posting this).

We all knew that it would be a head-to-head competition between two candidates and both of them would currently win comfortable against him among party members (54-35 for Liz; 55-31 for Penny). https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics...h-now-all-tied

Obviously it is not certain yet, but it is still likely.

[Crispin]

Hilarious how the tories go through one idiot leader after another. You'd think there were more suitable people to lead the UK than idiots like Cameron, BJ and now that imbecile Truss.

I mean Boris Johnson is nothing but a liar who can't help himself from lying, Truss is his retarded lapdog, she won't lie as much but it'll be even more embarrassing to be a brit.

Its as if the Tories hates the UK.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Clear choice now. No tax cuts and high big state spending from socialist Red Rishi, or tax cuts from our darling Liz and the dole for lots of state "workers". No contest what the Tory members will go for.

I'm looking forward to those tax cuts sooner rather than later, what to spend them on is the question. Yet another BTL?

Liz for Leader!

Your record with backing losing causes does suggest that Liz is the one for you. Someone with that little talent in charge of the failure that is Brexit will be catastrophic for the country. If this little character you play on this forum is actually who you are, I'd be worried if I were you. Because when the economy does tank, it's going to be the BTL people that will get hit hardest as the property market collapses.

If you actually were a BTL landlord, you'd be concerned about where interest rates are going to get inflation under control. But I'm sure you knew that, with all the financial wisdom at your fingertips. Or do you just ignore that kind of thing like you do all the Brexit damage?

[Edge-]

Hilarious how the tories go through one idiot leader after another. You'd think there were more suitable people to lead the UK than idiots like Cameron, BJ and now that imbecile Truss.

I mean Boris Johnson is nothing but a liar who can't help himself from lying, Truss is his retarded lapdog, she won't lie as much but it'll be even more embarrassing to be a brit.

Its as if the Tories hates the UK.

They're not sending their best...some, I assume, are good people.

Conservatives will deserve the electoral drumming that comes out of this much as they've deserved the electoral drumming of late that was a response to BoJo's hilariously terrible leadership.

[Pann]

Clear choice now. No tax cuts and high big state spending from socialist Red Rishi, or tax cuts from our darling Liz and the dole for lots of state "workers". No contest what the Tory members will go for.

I'm looking forward to those tax cuts sooner rather than later, what to spend them on is the question. Yet another BTL?

Liz for Leader!

The problem with this is where is the money for tax cuts going to come from? Her economic plan is all over the place and whilst we share similar concerns over Sunak's record as chancellor he at least recognises the issues ahead.

The Tories are in a really difficult place because if the polls are accurate then Truss will win and their MPs will have to go to the polls with her as leader when she is not necessarily the popular choice amongst the party's MPs. This is what happened with Labour and the Milibands and they are still feeling the effects to this day and if the Tories lose the next election - which is a real possibility - then I think the infighting will become so intense that it will not be a short period in opposition.

Although if everyone's favourite political mastermind is correct all is not yet lost - https://twitter.com/Dominic2306/stat...82798608785408

Quite honestly the big winner out of all of this is Ben Wallace.

[Forogil]

The Tories are in a really difficult place because if the polls are accurate then Truss will win and their MPs will have to go to the polls with her as leader when she is not necessarily the popular choice amongst the party's MPs. This is what happened with Labour and the Milibands and they are still feeling the effects to this day and if the Tories lose the next election - which is a real possibility - then I think the infighting will become so intense that it will not be a short period in opposition.

Apart from Liz short-comings the selection of leadership seems weird, and Labour under Corbyn was even weirder in that respect, some even call it a 'rotten presidency' and think that MPs should take back control of selecting party leader.

[Nymrohd]

Quite honestly the big winner out of all of this is Ben Wallace.

The smart play seems to be, stay out of THIS leadership competition. THe party will lose the next general election, you let whoever wins here crash and burn and then challenge them before the next election.

[dribbles]

Your record with backing losing causes does suggest that Liz is the one for you. Someone with that little talent in charge of the failure that is Brexit will be catastrophic for the country. If this little character you play on this forum is actually who you are, I'd be worried if I were you. Because when the economy does tank, it's going to be the BTL people that will get hit hardest as the property market collapses.

If you actually were a BTL landlord, you'd be concerned about where interest rates are going to get inflation under control. But I'm sure you knew that, with all the financial wisdom at your fingertips. Or do you just ignore that kind of thing like you do all the Brexit damage?

This is Diane Abbott school of economic thinking. It is precisely because of inflation why now is not a bad time to be in BTL. Property price rises of 16.9% in the last 12 months in my area, lovely jubbly, CPI is not that high. And interest rate rises? It's the tenants that should be concerned, not me. Rents will only go up up and up to cover those. Again lovely jubbly..

The problem with this is where is the money for tax cuts going to come from? Her economic plan is all over the place and whilst we share similar concerns over Sunak's record as chancellor he at least recognises the issues ahead.

The Tories are in a really difficult place because if the polls are accurate then Truss will win and their MPs will have to go to the polls with her as leader when she is not necessarily the popular choice amongst the party's MPs. This is what happened with Labour and the Milibands and they are still feeling the effects to this day and if the Tories lose the next election - which is a real possibility - then I think the infighting will become so intense that it will not be a short period in opposition.

Although if everyone's favourite political mastermind is correct all is not yet lost - https://twitter.com/Dominic2306/stat...82798608785408

Quite honestly the big winner out of all of this is Ben Wallace.

I guess the Tories are factoring in and planning on losing the next General Election. They are the most successful political organisation on the planet, ever. Will it be a short time in opposition who knows, but dullard Starmer is no Tony Blair.

The Tories have so much young talent coming through for the GE after next. Badenoch, would have been a shame to waste that asset on what effectively is a caretaker messed up Tory government for the next max two years, for example. I think there will be a GE sooner rather than later, Truss as leader can only continue on with Boris's 2019 manifesto, she has none of her own. If she tries to deviate too much from what Boris had planned the House of Lords will tie her up in knots.

She will increasingly and quickly want her own mandate from the people, I don't think she will get it. If Truss doesn't win the leadership contest, then the same will apply to Red Rishi. Should never have got rid of Boris, who will go down as one of the greatest PM's of all time, in my opinion.

[Crispin]

I wonder if Dribbles realise that Truss campaigned for remain.

[Nymrohd]

You can’t tell the difference between the nuance sphere of politics and football can you?

Also anyone who passed on interest rate rises onto their tenants is, objectively, a complete piece of shit, and absolutely incompetent at economic management. Get fucked you exploitative asshole.

A sensible government would cap rental increases.

[jonnysensible]

I wonder if Dribbles realise that Truss campaigned for remain.

shes just a weirdo libdem with tons of reactionary positions

[Pann]

I guess the Tories are factoring in and planning on losing the next General Election. They are the most successful political organisation on the planet, ever. Will it be a short time in opposition who knows, but dullard Starmer is no Tony Blair.

The Tories have so much young talent coming through for the GE after next. Badenoch, would have been a shame to waste that asset on what effectively is a caretaker messed up Tory government for the next max two years, for example. I think there will be a GE sooner rather than later, Truss as leader can only continue on with Boris's 2019 manifesto, she has none of her own. If she tries to deviate too much from what Boris had planned the House of Lords will tie her up in knots.

She will increasingly and quickly want her own mandate from the people, I don't think she will get it. If Truss doesn't win the leadership contest, then the same will apply to Red Rishi. Should never have got rid of Boris, who will go down as one of the greatest PM's of all time, in my opinion.

But why? Labour are polling well - yesterday's prediction put them one short of an overall majority - but none of this necessarily means that the next election is lost and as you pointed out they are up against Starmer's Lab and not Blair's.

The Tories may well have a lot of fresh talent but so do Lab and they are still in opposition also history has shown us that the time in opposition is rarely limited to one term. Neither candidate will deviate much from the current manifesto and I believe that the current issues facing the country will very much limit what they are able to do anyway.

Sunak, for all his faults, is by far the best choice, as far as I am concerned, and if the membership choose Truss over him I think they will have condemned the Cons to opposition.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on Boris' virtues.

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A sensible government would cap rental increases.

Yeah, that's great and all until the landlord can no longer afford the mortgage and the house is repossessed or the landlord decides that it is no longer profitable to rent the property and sells it.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Yeah, that's great and all until the landlord can no longer afford the mortgage and the house is repossessed or the landlord decides that it is no longer profitable to rent the property and sells it.

I can understand people forgetting this in the era of neo-liberal economics, but the point of "investments" is that involves both risks and returns. The fact that we've had governments falling over themselves to make sure that investment risks never come to fruition is partly what's brought the world economy to the state it's in today.

If rates go up, rents are capped and BTL landlords go to the wall as a result, then tough shit. Personally I think that people who seek to pay their own mortgages from the hard work of other families deserve any pain they suffer.

But of course that kind of action will never happen; because there are a HUGE number of landlords sitting in the HoC as we speak. Getting them to vote for controls that might damage their comfortable positions is as likely as the proverbial turkeys and Xmas. So our economy carries on being utter shit for ordinary working people, because who cares about them, right?

[jonnysensible]

Yeah, that's great and all until the landlord can no longer afford the mortgage and the house is repossessed or the landlord decides that it is no longer profitable to rent the property and sells it.

those are good things

[Pann]

those are good things

Are they? How?

[Huehuecoyotl]

Are they? How?

If you didn't have me on ignore, you'd already know that.

But generally speaking, having a larger and larger parasitic class of people in your economy draining more and more wealth away from the actual workers might be great for the landlords, but it isn't great for the bulk of the population. And it isn't great for society either. And when more and more of those landlords set up their parent companies in tax havens, meaning that money is lost to the economy entirely, it isn't great for the economy either.

But you'll never see any of this, because you just can't bear somebody disagreeing with you.

[dribbles]

But why? Labour are polling well - yesterday's prediction put them one short of an overall majority - but none of this necessarily means that the next election is lost and as you pointed out they are up against Starmer's Lab and not Blair's.

The Tories may well have a lot of fresh talent but so do Lab and they are still in opposition also history has shown us that the time in opposition is rarely limited to one term. Neither candidate will deviate much from the current manifesto and I believe that the current issues facing the country will very much limit what they are able to do anyway.

Sunak, for all his faults, is by far the best choice, as far as I am concerned, and if the membership choose Truss over him I think they will have condemned the Cons to opposition.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on Boris' virtues.

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Yeah, that's great and all until the landlord can no longer afford the mortgage and the house is repossessed or the landlord decides that it is no longer profitable to rent the property and sells it.

Why should the Tories plan to lose the next General Election? I, along with many Tory party members, believe there should be a centre right offering in British politics. The Conservative party have drifted too far towards the left, never having recovered properly from the damage done by the Cameron/Clegg coalition.

There are so many career politicians now in the Conservatives that will wear any colour of Rosette if it gets them elected as MP. My own MP being one of them, they wear the blue badge but really are a Lib Dem, I have to hold my nose when I vote for them. Rishi Sunak is another, talking of which this leadership competition has been so depressing.

How on earth can one call themselves a Tory when they support socialist Red Rishi's highest taxation level in living memory? More than 130 Tory MP's seem to. Margaret would be turning in her grave when Sunak falsely claims today that he is the one true Thatcherite candidate. This leadership contest until now should not have been a secret ballot but a public one, I want to know which MP's support which potential leader.

Who are these imposters masquerading as Tories? A period in opposition will allow the Tories to cleanse their party of these false flags and wouldn't be such a bad thing.

Starmer is beatable any day of the week by a true blue Tory party. Neither Sunak or Truss have it in them to lead one.

[Pann]

How on earth can one call themselves a Tory when they support socialist Red Rishi's highest taxation level in living memory? More than 130 Tory MP's seem to.

I really don't know where all this Red Rishi malarkey comes from. I agree that some of his decisions have been dubious but the tax burden is at its highest because we've just been through a once in a 100 years pandemic which resulted £400 billion of borrowing that needs to be paid back at some point, and not only are we, and the rest of world, still dealing with the Covid fallout we have the invasion of Ukraine pushing up inflation further.

The reality is we either grow our way of the debt crisis and/or increase taxes. Anyone who suggests that we can cut taxes and get through this is lying.

[dribbles]

I really don't know where all this Red Rishi malarkey comes from. I agree that some of his decisions have been dubious but the tax burden is at its highest because we've just been through a once in a 100 years pandemic which resulted £400 billion of borrowing that needs to be paid back at some point, and not only are we, and the rest of world, still dealing with the Covid fallout we have the invasion of Ukraine pushing up inflation further.

The reality is we either grow our way of the debt crisis and/or increase taxes. Anyone who suggests that we can cut taxes and get through this is lying.

The indication of how the government intend to deal with the Covid debt crisis is now clear, they have chosen inflation. That £400bn will never be paid back, just inflated away. Of course a non socialist proper Tory chancellor would never have sprinkled money on the population like confetti in the first place. That's Red Rishi for you... https://www.politico.eu/article/rish...the-tory-left/